Angus Calving Ease Maternal

[Air gator]

Just wondering if there is an experienced Angus breeder who can give a little advice on the CEM EPD for Angus Bulls???
I don't want to breed calving problems into my herd. What's the lowest EPD you would take on a bull?
(I start with the premise that it depends on the cows/heifers in your herd). Is this just something you can work around by
by keeping the heifers a few months longer before you breed them and using a reliable heifer bull?
Thanks in advance.

 

[Lucky_P]

gator,
Not purely an Angus breeder(have at least 2 other breeds in my herd), but by and large, I won't use a bull with CEM below breed average (+9 for current Angus sires) - unless I'm strictly breeding for terminal feeder calf sale.
If I'm breeding - as is usually the case - for the resulting females - but hoping that her steer counterparts will be good, as well - I'm not inclined to use a bull with below-average CEM. CEM is one of my major criteria in sire selection.

 

[Air gator]

So, from your experience the CEM EPD is reliable?
I appreciate your response. I have seen embryos available from donors I like but then I see a +3 for CEM and it makes me hesitant.
I'm not sure I would make CEM my #1 EPD but I don't want to breed problems into my herd. Thanks so much.

 

[dun]

EPDs are really only reliable when they get past 70%. They'll give you a good idea but they aren;t all that reliable yet. Red Angus EPDs have what they call "Possible Change". What that is is the range that can be expected based on the ACC.
Just as each breed has their own EPDs and bases, this is only applicable to Red Angus:
http://redangus.org/genetics/epd-possible-change

 

[Jake]

I have never made a decision based on CEM and doubt I ever will. As long as it's positive I wouldn't worry much about it. Don't fall into the trap that every cow has to be bred to a heifer bull either. You are giving up performance and there have been a lot of problems created by the obsession with "curve benders"

 

[Post Oak]

I have another question? What's the lowest (Angus) CED and the highest BW that you would use on heifers? I am one of those "one bull" small operators that has to have the same bull for both heifers and cows. My Angus bull now has a CEM of +11. I just like having an above average CEM because I keep heifers. I like Trask Herefords, but my gripe with them is that they have small birth weights, but very low CEM numbers . I think that the very low CEM numbers on the Trask Herefords correlates to the fact that Mr. Trask bred his heifers to calve at 3 years of age even though they are very fertile.

 

[Supa Dexta]

You're more familiar with your own animals then we will ever be, age, weight, condition - who their mothers are etc.

Myself for a good solid 2 yr heifer, I want them pushing out calves in the 70s. As cows I want them in the 80-100 range. That's big for some to hear, but cows should be bred to handle that with ease. They're cows, not cats. I don't pull many calves at all, and they hit the ground big enough to get going, with a good jump start on any calf that is 50 or 60lbs.

 

[Jake]

I have another question? What's the lowest (Angus) CED and the highest BW that you would use on heifers? I am one of those "one bull" small operators that has to have the same bull for both heifers and cows. My Angus bull now has a CEM of +11. I just like having an above average CEM because I keep heifers. I like Trask Herefords, but my gripe with them is that they have small birth weights, but very low CEM numbers . I think that the very low CEM numbers on the Trask Herefords correlates to the fact that Mr. Trask bred his heifers to calve at 3 years of age even though they are very fertile.

Try to keep BW EPD at 2.0 or under, prefer negatives but if the right bull I"m not scared to use a little more birth. CED of 7 or greater. Like I said though I honestly don't pay that much attention to the EPDS unless they are really out of wack. I study the pedigree and pay attention to what other people have had results with.

Lower CEM EPDs typically correlate to smaller framed or smaller boned cattle that don't have the pelvic area to be considered easy calving. As long as you pelvic measure your replacements I wouldn't make it a huge concern.