Weaning weights

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MurraysMutts

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So what do I gotta do?

I've been thinking I have been improving as I have a pretty decent hereford bull on commercial cows. I don't creep feed. They usually sell about 6 or 7 months. They get raised on mama til it's time to sell.
Most cows run 1100-1200 pounds. I have a couple that are 1500 or so, but they don't seem to raise much bigger of a calf. I'll have closer numbers on them soon.

I hear talk of people raising 600 lb weaning weight calves.

What's it take to achieve that? Does it take some sort of miracle bull? I may consider changing to a different bull, and now is a good time as the home cows need a bull mid May.

I do NOT want a bull that throws huge calves. Being a small herd, I don't want the risk of losing any cows. And a few of my cows are 1000lbs or less.

Do I need to consider a creep feeder? Altho that adds inputs. And margins are tight already.

Appreciate everyone!

P.s. there's a bull sale Tuesday night close enough to go look. But I don't want to make a hasty decision
 
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For me personally I think it really comes from ruthlessly culling cows. I have cows that always raise a good calf , I have cows that don't, that is regardless of the bulls used. Buy the best bull you can get your hands on but get rid of the bottom 20% or so of your momma's every year. This is where I am now is I need to be doing this. The guys on here you see with the nice consistent calves don't allow coasters to stay just because they have an udder and a calf.

Bulls provide genetic potential, momma and your management feed that potential. You can't feed a calf genetics but you can starve them out of them.

Just my opinion, hopefully one of the guys that know what they are doing will be along shortly to set us straight.
 
Things that affect weaning weight:
Similar to weight in people.
Cow and bull genetics.
Nutrition and management.
You don't have to have the biggest cows or bull. But need them with some growth in them. Some breeds have more growth than others. Some animals in a breed have more growth than others. Heterosis will produce higher growth and weight. Use a good Charolais bull and generally get more ww. A 1200# three year old bull that weaned at 450# is probably not a good choice regardless of breed. Cow needs some milk to get a good weaning weight. Too much milk can be bad like too little.
Nutrition and management, overstocked pastures will negatively affect weaning weights. Need enough good forage to supplement the milk to get good ww. Consistency in the cow herd leads to consistency in the calves and allows you to manage for weaning weight.
Creep feed, unless you are a seedstock producer selling high dollar calves, be careful with creep feed. You can get carried away with creep feed and end up spending money and affect your profit.
So, good consistent genetics with some growth ability and adequate nutrition are my vote.
A lot depends on the location and environment. 600# may be a lofty goal some places and may be just average in other places. Achievable almost anywhere, but may not be most efficient or profitable.

Just my thoughts
 
I mean.... is a 600lb weaning weight reasonable?

There are Charolais and Simmental bulls that are lighter bw and heavy weaning. They cost money for the good ones but pay back well.
I considered a sim-angus when I bought my hereford. He was a bit more expensive!
With the price of slaughter bulls right now, I can get more than I gave for mine. And put that towards a better bull
 
Things that affect weaning weight:
Similar to weight in people.
Cow and bull genetics.
Nutrition and management.
You don't have to have the biggest cows or bull. But need them with some growth in them. Some breeds have more growth than others. Some animals in a breed have more growth than others. Heterosis will produce higher growth and weight. Use a good Charolais bull and generally get more ww. A 1200# three year old bull that weaned at 450# is probably not a good choice regardless of breed. Cow needs some milk to get a good weaning weight. Too much milk can be bad like too little.
Nutrition and management, overstocked pastures will negatively affect weaning weights. Need enough good forage to supplement the milk to get good ww. Consistency in the cow herd leads to consistency in the calves and allows you to manage for weaning weight.
Creep feed, unless you are a seedstock producer selling high dollar calves, be careful with creep feed. You can get carried away with creep feed and end up spending money and affect your profit.
So, good consistent genetics with some growth ability and adequate nutrition are my vote.
A lot depends on the location and environment. 600# may be a lofty goal some places and may be just average in other places. Achievable almost anywhere, but may not be most efficient or profitable.

Just my thoughts
Very nice! Thanks!
This particular group was fall born, so grass was not an option for me. Tho I know some folks run their pairs on wheat thru the winter.

Good food for thought on stocking rates!
I'm most probably overstocked at both places. I've sold some from one place. Not gonna put as many back. Tho, the cows did good. And like I said, calves were on milk and hay all winter basically. So maybe that place needs to stay stocked and...
I think my biggest gain will be de-stocking spring calver pasture eh?
This is doable!

Seems reasonably to presume fall born calves run on hay (my hay is sufficient but not alfalfa) and milk won't do as well as spring born calves on nice pasture and milk.
 
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So what do I gotta do?

I've been thinking I have been improving as I have a pretty decent hereford bull on commercial cows. I don't creep feed. They usually sell about 6 or 7 months. They get raised on mama til it's time to sell.
Most cows run 1100-1200 pounds. I have a couple that are 1500 or so, but they don't seem to raise much bigger of a calf. I'll have closer numbers on them soon.

I hear talk of people raising 600 lb weaning weight calves.

What's it take to achieve that? Does it take some sort of miracle bull? I may consider changing to a different bull, and now is a good time as the home cows need a bull mid May.

I do NOT want a bull that throws huge calves. Being a small herd, I don't want the risk of losing any cows. And a few of my cows are 1000lbs or less.

Do I need to consider a creep feeder? Altho that adds inputs. And margins are tight already.

Appreciate everyone!

P.s. there's a bull sale Tuesday night close enough to go look. But I don't want to make a hasty decision


You get six hundred pound weaning weights by targeting your cows. I specifically looked for older cows being culled from herds that had 600 pound calves at their side. I was helping the vets at the sales barns when they were preg checking and knew which cows came in with calves, what the calves looked like and weighed, and if the cows were carrying a calf. A little inside information and help from the auctioneers worked for me very well. By the time they raised the next calf I could choose which to put my own bulls on and which to cull. My average cow lasted between two and three years but I'd resell them for what I paid and the heifers went into my replacement heifer program, grouped for uniformity. If a cow didn't raise a 600 pound calf she was gone. Being careful in buying I didn't cull many for underweight calves. One thing about older cows is that they could take a bull that threw larger calves though I still chose bulls that threw average weights or less. So the cow was the harder part of building high weaning weights but that's were the success is IMO.

And I didn't supplement feed at all other than calling my cows in every evening with enough sweet feed to get them to come in. A mineral block always available and changed out depending on when the grass came on, and that's it. Good mixed grass, clover, and alfalfa pasture and hay from the same fields. Rotational grazing.
 
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Keep meticulous records to know which of your cows are working for you and get rid of the slackers. Weight is one aspect of the price you receive but calf quality is another. Strive for good weaning weights but also work to improve the quality and consistency of your calves. Change from Mutts to cattle that are top performers, one way to get there is to cull the worst performing cows each year. AI or use the best bull you can justify for you size of operation.
 
So what do I gotta do?

I've been thinking I have been improving as I have a pretty decent hereford bull on commercial cows. I don't creep feed. They usually sell about 6 or 7 months. They get raised on mama til it's time to sell.
Most cows run 1100-1200 pounds. I have a couple that are 1500 or so, but they don't seem to raise much bigger of a calf. I'll have closer numbers on them soon.

I hear talk of people raising 600 lb weaning weight calves.

What's it take to achieve that? Does it take some sort of miracle bull? I may consider changing to a different bull, and now is a good time as the home cows need a bull mid May.

I do NOT want a bull that throws huge calves. Being a small herd, I don't want the risk of losing any cows. And a few of my cows are 1000lbs or less.

Do I need to consider a creep feeder? Altho that adds inputs. And margins are tight already.

Appreciate everyone!

P.s. there's a bull sale Tuesday night close enough to go look. But I don't want to make a hasty decision
What breed or breeds are your commercial cows?
 
What breed or breeds are your commercial cows?
Mostly angus based.
But mutts really. No registered stock.
My black chi-angus seem to do the best. Tho I've got 1 black sim that does real good too.

I've sold all the REAL mutts. The colored who knows what they were. They did ok, but the color and weights were not what I wanted
 
Mostly angus based.
But mutts really. No registered stock.
My black chi-angus seem to do the best. Tho I've got 1 black sim that does real good too.

I've sold all the REAL mutts. The colored who knows what they were. They did ok, but the color and weights were not what I wanted
Hereford and angus cross is very good. Creep feeding hasn't benefited me any other than getting calves used to eating feed but it sounds like you sell right off the cow. If you are tossing up the idea of getting a new bull then I would take a look at Gelbvieh.
 
Hereford and angus cross is very good. Creep feeding hasn't benefited me any other than getting calves used to eating feed but it sounds like you sell right off the cow. If you are tossing up the idea of getting a new bull then I would take a look at Gelbvieh.
This last batch was eating 20% cubes with their mamas. Only for the last month or so tho.
 
Most calves will therefore creep feeding for me is only beneficial in years of a drought or limited forage.
Makes me wonder if creep feeding would be a good option for the fall calvers only...
Hmmm. Have to see how things go. I'm still giving thought to selling a bunch late fall and not having to feed or hay at all over there this winter. Keeping only the best cows and bringing them home for winter
 
I agree it starts with good paperwork and performance based culling on cows.

Not all that long ago we started putting more emphasis on our bulls. They are not high dollar by any means but we stepped up a notch from where we were. I started looking for moderate sized animals with good growth. I think it has paid off on our weaning weights.

Now the reality of environment. I can haul the same exact cow and bull from one property to the next and change the weight of calf she will wean. Some properties just have better soil, better grass, better what ever and just produce more pounds. Heck some pastures put weight on cattle better than others. Some land is just poor and you can actually hurt yourself by having more genetics than nutrition. You have to match the genetics to the environment.

I try to focus on things I can control like keeping good books, culling, buying the right genetics, and not over grazing. It's very hard for me to control the quality of the land.

Remember, it's not all about what they sell for. I will take calves that bring $600 when I have $300 in them over calves that bring $800 and I have $600 in them all day long.
 
I had 3 years in a row where my steers averaged over 700. But that was on the Washington coast. Good grass and rotational grazing. I was using Simm-Angus bulls. The bulls were cheaper than bulls from a registered breeder. But the people I got them from retained ownership on their calves for years. They are absolutely ruthless cow cullers. Their records shows the bulls weaned over 700. I have never creep fed and those people I bought bulls from didn't either. Over here in the desert we are happy with 550. But the difference is the environment they live in. Semi arid, steep, rocky ground, with miles between water in places. My neighbor who has a great cow herd sells steers on Superior with a base weight of 575 for 2 semi loads of calves.
 
As stated above- keep records on your calves weaning weights on your current enviroment and after you'll have a couple years records, you'll be able to see which cows are performing better and which ones are struggling. Try to keep replacements from good performers too. Noticed that if a heifer had no ilnesses, good conditions to grow and she grew well, she will have good calves too. With only exception, if she has good suply of milk herself. But slower growing heifers usually had slower growing calves. Good herd records, culling, using good bulls and retaining good heifers should increase weaning weights. Of course, each year has different conditions, like drought versus lush green pastures, in winter- different quality of feed, or more nasty weather, so there can be quite a difference in weaning weights every year. But if you know how your cows perform in optimal conditions, you can cull the bottom ones and keep heifers with better potential. Using bulls, which suggest better growth and more milk for daughter is also a key thing.
 

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