Tractor / hay equip

[jcissell]

I am 22 years old and am just starting. But just b/c it is for sale doesn't mean it is junk. Sounds like you might could stand to come down off that horse for a little while. Not everyone can afford the prices you quote. Also just because you are able to pay that kind of money doesn't mean it is necessary either.

Have you ever used eather to start your tractor?

Josh

 

[Texan]

Why in the world would you want to bale hay if you can get it custom baled.

Good advice, Camp! Some of these guys want to start out having it all. Let 'em go and wish 'em luck! Its good for the economy and sometimes provides opportunities for the rest of us later........

 

[Campground Cattle]

I am 22 years old and am just starting. But just b/c it is for sale doesn't mean it is junk. Sounds like you might could stand to come down off that horse for a little while. Not everyone can afford the prices you quote. Also just because you are able to pay that kind of money doesn't mean it is necessary either.

Have you ever used eather to start your tractor?

Josh

Use all the ether you want good for diesels. I saddled this horse over thirty years ago and I will keep ridin it tag along on your shetland if you can keep up. Nuff Said

 

[jcissell]

My piece of junk tractor that I bought used for only $8000 has never had a single shot of ether in it's 30 years of life. Starts everytime. Point is, if you can afford and justify new expensive equipment, get it. I know I would, but I can't afford nor justify it right now. If the future I hope to be in a position where I can, but if not, I will make do with what I can afford. I just wanted to let him know that he can get equipment for less. Your advice was just a little discouraging to a beginner.

I hope I can learn enough from you and others here to stay in the business for 30 years. But take a piece of advice from me, don't forget that everything can be taken way in a heart beat. Just b/c you have been successful for 30 years doesn't mean that it will continue to be that way. Just appreciate your good fortune and have compasion for others that are less fortunate.

Josh

 

[BuckemRanch]

another thing how often do you guys bale, we have only done once a year for as long as i can remember. when i asked why i was told that a cut in the early summer and early fall would cause the hay to thin out for next year. again there is no livestock on this pasture so is there any truth to that. i've also been told that you can cut up to 4 times a year and wouldnt hurt a thing. what do you guys think?

We cut 3 some years 4 times and then put the cows on the field for a couple of months, until it gets to wet. The fields do fine.

This last year I started cutting and baleing my own. I also did some custom haying. If you buy a used baler give a good once over. There could be cracks in the chamber you cann't see. I've never dealt with a round baler, I don't put up that much hay. Good luck.

 

[CattleAnnie]

A note about the pros and cons of which type of baler you end up getting. When we were kids Dad used to have an old JD square baler. Takes a lot of sweat to move a large number of those bales into the hay yard - between stooking, throwing them onto the truck or wagon, and stacking them in the yard. Then throwing them onto the truck or wagon again to feed.

Funny thing was that once my brother and I flew the nest, a miraculous contraption appeared on the ranch. An automatic square bale stacker.
Maybe it was because he could finally afford one when we kids weren't eating him out of house and home, but I don't think it was a coincidence that he bought the stacker after the haying crew left home. ;-)
And a few years later Dad switched completely to rounds altogether.

Another thing that might influence your decision on which type of baler to purchase is whether or not you might end up owning and therefore feeding stock yourself at some point down the road. Now if you don't mind pitching bales all winter, go for the square baler. Personally my back is still feeling the strain of those thousands of 80lb+ bales all those years ago and I'd sooner lose an arm than go back to feeding squares (sure hope I'm not tempting fate with that tongue in cheek statement).

Good luck with your decision. The only upside to BSE is that there's been a lot of equipment to be had for very little money these days.

Take care.

 

[okmike]

what makes more money square or round? i figure i will always need the square because it seems to sell well around here plus we have two horses. also, is it okay to store round bales outside? i've always heard to put the square in the barn but what if i am going to keep a lot of round for myself, is it going to rot outside?

 

[txag]

ok, i've been reading & listening for a while & finally throwing in my 2 cts.

first of all, you mentioned starting this ranching endeavor when you finish your degree. i'm gonna be a little mean here, but if your degree is in an ag field, i'd hope you'd be learning a little more in school & wouldn't have to ask some of the questions you've been asking here. if it's not in ag, do you plan to use it & work off-farm? if so, owning your own equipment & doing all the hay work yourself may not be feasible for you because it may conflict with your work schedule.

i don't remember what you said about the land, but i think you mentioned financing the cattle. honestly, i wouldn't recommend financing cattle and hay equipment. maybe one or the other but not both. for a newbie, that could be digging a deep hole that could be hard to come out of. maybe think about financing the cattle & having the hay custom baled until the cows are paid for & then buy equipment as you can afford it?

as for storing hay, square bales should only be stored inside. round bales preferable in barns as well, but they can be stored outside. we store them in lines end-to-end pushed tight. if they're outside w/no tarp or any covering, do not stack them!

good luck.

 

[dun]

Anecdotal to what txag posted.
A coule of years ago there was a big push to revitalize the dairy industry in this area. If you could spell "cow" and "milk" you could get loans for anything. Almost all of those start ups are now gone. Bankrupt because of the load debt of buying all the equipment and the cows. Start slow and grow. It's far easier to expand then it is to downsize.

dun

 

[Ryder]

Anecdotal to what txag posted.
A coule of years ago there was a big push to revitalize the dairy industry in this area. If you could spell "cow" and "milk" you could get loans for anything. Almost all of those start ups are now gone. Bankrupt because of the load debt of buying all the equipment and the cows. Start slow and grow. It's far easier to expand then it is to downsize.

dun

Almost exactly what I was going to post. Have seen the same thing with the dairy business in Louisiana. They have been folding up in droves. Some of them had been in the business a long time, but were still carrying too much debt load. You can dig a hole with borrowed money a lot faster than you can climb out of it.
Young people have time. Use that with as little debt as possible or no debt.

 

[Caustic Burno]

My piece of junk tractor that I bought used for only $8000 has never had a single shot of ether in it's 30 years of life. Starts everytime. Point is, if you can afford and justify new expensive equipment, get it. I know I would, but I can't afford nor justify it right now. If the future I hope to be in a position where I can, but if not, I will make do with what I can afford. I just wanted to let him know that he can get equipment for less. Your advice was just a little discouraging to a beginner.

I hope I can learn enough from you and others here to stay in the business for 30 years. But take a piece of advice from me, don't forget that everything can be taken way in a heart beat. Just b/c you have been successful for 30 years doesn't mean that it will continue to be that way. Just appreciate your good fortune and have compasion for others that are less fortunate.

Josh

Camp

You not gonna let that kid get by with that crap, are you? How does he know if a tractor older than he is has never had a snort of ether? Then telling you to take a piece of advice from him and remember that you can lose it all. Kid don't understand that's the point of your advice. Don't borrow so much and pay as you go and you're not near as likely to lose your stuff. Duh. Think they've got to start out having everything.

 

[Muratic]

Just appreciate your good fortune and have compasion for others that are less fortunate.

Actually Josh, sounds to me like that "good fortune" that 'ol Camp has is the result of some very smart management decisions.

Don't borrow so much and pay as you go and you're not near as likely to lose your stuff. Duh.

For once you are making some sense there bro. Why don't you sound that intelligent while we are working cattle?

 

[ChrisB]

Seems to me someone telling another that they should buy new equipment instead of used, and then basically telling them they are foolish for "wanting it all" is talking out both sides of their mouth.

From what I see, the most financially stable farms in my area are the ones that are driving the older equipment without the debt. I see some guys with new tractors and combines every couple years, yet their the ones complaining the most about poor corn prices.

If a person has a difficult time telling the difference between "used" equipment and "worn out" equipment and need to have a good service garage around the corner to run their equipment, maybe they shouldn't be giving advice about machinery in the first place.

I agree, staying out of debt is very important, that's why sometimes used equipment is the smartest way to go. If you have the cash on hand like Campground and your operation is in good shape, go ahead and buy new, I do when I can justify it also.

 

[Campground Cattle]

Its about starting out small and paying as go and staying out of debt. As I stated earlier there is a 25 year old Massey still in the hay field every summer. You stay in business by controlling front cost. Thats why we buy new and run it till it falls apart.

 

[Cattle Rack Rancher]

I'm with you Campground. Optimism is a good thing. If things are going well, you can always upgrade your equipment. If you have a setback of some sort and you have alot of debt outstanding, the banks are not very sympathetic and I do know of what I speak. When I worked at the bank, we had one young fellow who tried to expand too fast and ran into financial trouble. His Dad came in and backed with him all his savings When the smoke had cleared, both of them were bankrupt. As far as buying equipment goes, I can hire out my baling cheaper than I can buy a baler. The other thing is if you have to work an off farm job, trying to schedule a day off when the weather is right may be difficult and if you have a serious breakdown, you may be hiring a custom outfit as well as paying for the baler and the repairs. Just my opinion but I've had a few major setbacks and I've never gone bankrupt yet.

 

[hillbilly]

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changing subject a bit now, like i mentioned before, we have good hay pasture. in the past our neighbors have processed it and we split the profits/hay. i now want to take care of all this myself so my question is how big a tractor am going to need to run a square and round baler. whats a ballpark figure that i am looking at spending, going through the fastline magazine the options seem endless. i am just looking for least expensive equipment that will get the job done. also whats the best way of finding this equipment. i've heard dealers are the last and most expensive

After all this BS, I finally read his original post.

If he is still willing allow your neighbor to continue to put up your hay as you buy equiptment, start with a tractor 70 hp+ w/ loader & open remotes

Tell your neighbor your plans to one day do it yourself, so he knows whats
comming down the line.

Volenteer to help him put up your hay, you will learn alot! As posted before don't borrow money unless you have to.

Hillbilly

 

[jcissell]

ok Caustic I know the people that owned the tractor and trust what they say. Also if the tractor had much ether used then it would have to have it to start when it is cold. It doesn't. My point was that just b/c something is used when you buy it doesn't mean it is a piece. Maybe I took his post wrong but to me it seemed like he was telling the guy you had to spend 30,000 + to bale your own equipment.

About my comment about the good fortune, yes it is good fortune. I'm not saying he has not made good financial decisions. My family had a good business for 28 years. During the recession it took a hit and couldn't get out of the hole it dug itself into. My dad was doing the same things that he had done the entire lifetime of his corporation. He had money put back and tons of stocks and bonds. But when God wants to humble a person(s) and show them that there is a lot more to life than money and possessions then he will do that. Now my family has a lot less money and things but we have more than we ever had before.

Maybe I took his post wrong, but I just read into it that Camp was saying we had to have all the best or it was junk. That's why I hate reading stuff someone says instead of actually hearing it. It's easy to misunderstand what they are meaning.

Josh

 

[Campground Cattle]

I think you missed the whole point why strain a new operation buying used equipment you are going to be working on more than baling.
You can buy a ton of hay for 10,000 dollars. Even after you buy the used equipment hay still cost, I figure mine is 12 to 14 dollars a roll and I own the equipment.
It just makes better business sense to save on the front end until you can afford to buy new and use for years until its wore out.
Having hay equipment is not a have to in ranching .

 

[bigtex]

you can buy a new tractor and bailers, work real hard and after 45 years you'll break even..
the only way to make it with new costly equipment is work it everday on a paying job at your place or some one elses..

 

[jcissell]

I gotcha now Camp. Thanks for clearing that up.

Josh