Starting Background Operation (Could use a little help)

[Dave]

If he is in the Piedmont of North Carolina he is 1000 miles from Joplin and 1200 from OKC. That's gonna be expensive hauling. There are no large stockyards in the Carolinas that I am aware of. Maybe 600 a week including cows is big there.

That is what I found on the USDA website. Most of sale reports said less than 200 head.

 

[Travlr]

I'd buy and sell on a video sale like Superior. It's going to be hard to get a couple hundred at a time doing local sales. Especially if you want something like all black steers. You could also talk to some big buyers at bigger barns in your area. I'm not sure how far you are from OKC, Joplin, or any of the bigger barns. Trucking isn't that expensive if you aren't going more than 300 miles or so. Buying out of the pasture would be ideal but would be hard to do in those numbers I would think.

Has anyone worked out the figures on whether black steers gaining 2/3/4 pounds actually makes more considering that they cost more than other animals? Does the extra cost work out when less expensive animals will still gain weight exactly the same way?

 

[kenny thomas]

Has anyone worked out the figures on whether black steers gaining 2/3/4 pounds actually makes more considering that they cost more than other animals? Does the extra cost work out when less expensive animals will still gain weight exactly the same way?

Or how about buying Charolais cross at a little less and them gaining more.

 

[Ky hills]

I see several big groups of cattle sell that are very mixed with sometimes ever breed about being represented and they sell pretty good most times. They sell a little below a uniform big bunch of black calves but the numbers makes them bring pretty good. And the reality is they were probably bought considerably cheaper as singles or 2 and 3 than black calves of similar size, so they might make more money in the long run I just don’t know for sure.
I’d say a good bunch of Charolais cross would be darn hard to beat.

 

[farmerjan]

Buyers around here also want to buy in trailer loads... 50-60 head to make load lots in the 45-50,000 lb range... bigger cattle=less # head... We like to sell in 20+ per group... buyers will buy lots like that, buy 2-3 groups to get a trailer load.
In that area, like @kenny thomas said, most sale barns have 3-800 head... so maybe 25-50 of the size this poster wants. We maybe have more per sale, 1000 to 1500 average sale at one place, 1000 to 2500 at another during the fall sale season... That's the total sale #'s.... so maybe 2-400 feeder steers in the 4-6 wts.... 500 steers total..... 2-300 feeder heifers. The rest are bigger calves, cull cows etc....

You are moving to an area that has lots of the "smaller farms" and it will be hard to cobble together 50 or more at a time... Accept that if you are going to buy local... Most farms in the eastern states, around here, run 20-50 .... maybe 75 cows..... A few run 100 or so... we run 125....more or less... split in 2 calving groups.. so say 75 calves a season... twice a year... say half are bulls,,,, You are looking at say maybe 40 steer calves, twice a year.... We are one of the larger ones here... most are in the 50-60 cow range, calve once a year... so say 50-60 calves, half heifers... several of the farmers in this area have 75-150 cows... so the same basics as we are... many calve two groups....

7-8 wts are the worst weights to sell in this area... I can get as much for a 575 lb steer calf as I can get for a 7 wt... 7 wts are few and far between... why would I feed them that long to not make much more than a 60 day weaned backgrounded one, with all the feed in them....????? Again, the buyers will pay more for a load sized lot... maybe you would have a market for them... Nearly everything that goes out of here goes west to go out on winter grazing, or goes north to go on feed and then get sold as 9+ wts to go on feed lots.

 

[farmerjan]

Or how about buying Charolais cross at a little less and them gaining more.

We are looking at doing that more and more... DS still makes up groups of the blacks for the one buyer... but we have more smokey cows than we ever had... so a few more steers to sell.... and thinking to take them to 850 or 9 since they seem to gain so good... watching the markets on them more and more...
I also am very interested in a possible hereford influence sale for these "black hereford" looking ones that have too much white for the bwf that they want... saw about 10-15 go through and they were off over $.50 from blacks...closer to .65 off.... Could we make them pay to feed and take to a hereford influence sale with the trucking taken in account...????

 

[kenny thomas]

Being in the Piedmont of North Carolina he should be fairly close to Siler City, NC. 5 hours from here but when I bought my Wilson gooseneck trailer that was the closest dealer. They had 444 head last Friday.

 

[kenny thomas]

Interesting fact, at one time and it still might be like this, there are no livestock markets with sales on Saturday in North Carolina.

 

[Lucky]

If he is in the Piedmont of North Carolina he is 1000 miles from Joplin and 1200 from OKC. That's gonna be expensive hauling.

Sounds like the OP needs to buy a truck then. Think of all the money he could he make.

Has anyone worked out the figures on whether black steers gaining 2/3/4 pounds actually makes more considering that they cost more than other animals? Does the extra cost work out when less expensive animals will still gain weight exactly the same way?

Calm down " all black steers" was only an example. How about all Longhorn cross bull calves?

 

[littletom]

I put to gether couple loads every winter. Say everytime not doing this again make enough talk myself into again. I don't really like it to be honest. Going to shoot you honest on this. You need a good place to work them. You need a good amount of time those first few weeks when they come in. going to be a lot of sickness. You learn pretty fast when what to pull they are so expensive. Bad can turn into a big mess fast on death loss. I want to be guy feeding everyday even when i don't have time. Can be pita to treat one. Hired guy get tomorrow . Its dead 2000 gone. So ask yourself do I have this kind of time.
Next your going to have to find a guy. This guy usually manger or mangment at a stockyard sometimes owner. He will buy for you you tell him what you want how much. It doesnt come through no problem he knows the same guy at every sale for 300 miles. He will find them. Better vette this guy when you find him. He or she going to spend few hundred thousand for you. He also big help on selling end. Take care of this guy can make or break.
I wouldn't fool with those little calves and them eating silage too. Going bigger and roll them out faster. Money tied up less time. Less market change hopefully keeping them shorter time. Its high risk high reward.
I don't really like it. Going to feed them now.

 

[Travlr]

Sounds like the OP needs to buy a truck then. Think of all the money he could he make.

Calm down " all black steers" was only an example. How about all Longhorn cross bull calves?

I don't care what kind of animals make money. Backgrounding may make more with anything as long as they are bought right, gain weight appropriately, and sell right. If you can buy something for six cents a pound less and sell it for six cents a pound less... but it gains ten pounds more than anything else on the same feed, I call that a win.

 

[RDFF]

Sounds like the OP needs to buy a truck then. Think of all the money he could he make.

Nobody ever said that the trucker was making all the money on that "hauling" deal. Just that it doesn't and CAN'T come cheap. Trucking costs money... the longer the haul, the cheaper PER MILE it gets, because of waiting/loading/unloading time. Your only making money when the wheels are turning. Hauling livestock often means alot of time that the wheels aren't turning.

I wouldn't want to be a trucker too bad... and I do own a semi with a grain trailer, and sometimes haul for aquaintances with the PU and stock trailer or the flatbed. Bought the semi for "making money hauling my own grain" when I was row cropping and I used it to haul from the field to storage then too, which was a big positive. And it paid for itself for sure. But when hauling for hire, yeah... not so much. When hauling for yourself, you usually are "working for free" (you probably don't count your time or directly pay yourself $30-$40/hour for it), but I can't give away my time to somebody else's operation. And it's often "more convenient time-wise" to do your own trucking (well OK... SOMETIMES it's more convenient... you can't always count on hired trucks being where you want them when you want them... ).

 

[Heronfish]

If you're going to be in the stocker business, take a sell/buy course before doing much else.
It will give you a fundamental understanding of how the market functions and how to purchase your animals

 

[Lucky]

Nobody ever said that the trucker was making all the money on that "hauling" deal.

I was just funnin. I have cattle trucked at times it isn't cheap and the guys I know in the trucking business aren't getting rich, especially the ones trying to stick with cow haulin.

 

[RDFF]

If you're going to be in the stocker business, take a sell/buy course before doing much else.
It will give you a fundamental understanding of how the market functions and how to purchase your animals

Get "Thoughts and Advice From An Old Cattleman" by Gordon Hazard.

 

[Dave]

Buying cattle in numbers involves a lot of time and travel commitment. There is also the knowledge and ability to pick the right cattle. The solution for someone starting out is getting a good honest buyer to buy for you. Which is a whole other issue....... finding a good honest buyer who will work for you. The OP is on the other side of the country. If he were in this area I could introduce him to some good ones and also point out ones to avoid. I didn't learn the who to trust and who not to in a week or two. I go to 2 sale nearly every week. I bought my first cattle at a sale in 1967. The education I have received over the years hasn't always been cheap.

 

[Brute 23]

If you're going to be in the stocker business, take a sell/buy course before doing much else.
It will give you a fundamental understanding of how the market functions and how to purchase your animals

I have heard those discussed on several podcasts. They sound interesting.

 

[Brute 23]

http://castbox.fm/app/castbox/feed/...rack/51257ab46d908cbb6f68cd48d8dca6b7d347b0e0

 

[RDFF]

 

[Warren Allison]

I recently just bought 140 acres (110 cleared) in the piedmont of North Carolina. My plan is to plant Forage Sorghum and attempt to get 2 cuts (around 20 TNs) through summer and then plant some annuals for the fall and spring. I’m planning on chopping and putting in a ag bunk for silage.

The goal would be to background around 200 head (3-4 weights) - twice a year. The first herd I’d graze in the fall and then bunk feed the Sorghum Forage in the winter on a 70/30 mix utiltiing Soy Hulls for the 30%. The second herd, I’d bring in during the spring to graze and then bunk feed during the summer harvest.

Ideally I’m keeping both herd 5+/- months and trying to add 2-2.5 pounds per day.

A couple of questions- Does anything about this seem like unreasonable assumptions? And I’m having a very difficult time figuring out what broker /order buyer or whomever to contact to try and create a relationship to buy the calves by the truckload - any help?

Thanks

Where we are located here in the Southeast you will be hard pressed to find 200 similar calves, from one place, twice a year. When are you planning on getting the first ones? You can get 200 similar calves alright, but you may have to get them from a few places....10-20 at a time. If you want to start with a fall herd in 2026, there is plenty of time. Especially if you are looking for Angus or Angus-crosses. There are just a lot more of them being produced. Do you already have your cattle trailer, working pens, a chute and headgate, etc.? If you want to fool with any with a little ear, there are a lot more bigger operations further south, like south Ga, Florida, and south Alabama. Most people around here, though, are going to wean at 6 months or more, so the calves will be closer to 500lbs or better, especially with any that are also Char or Simm crosses. Just do some talking to folks (like you are doing here), going to sales....just networking and meeting people. Once you get set up with your vet, they can be a great source for finding who has calves, etc. I think what you are wanting, is very do-able.