I need some advice. I currently have both a spring and a fall calving herd of around 200 cows (100 fall/100 spring). I would like to go to all fall calving, just not sure how to get there. I have been debating on just selling everything that is a spring calver as soon as they finish calving, and then just take that money and buy back fall calving cows. My only issue with that is that I have really put a lot of time and effort into my cows. I can go back 3 and 4 generations on many of my cows and give you performance records on all of them. I hate to those cows and buy back a set of cows that are foreign to me. How do I get to all fall calving without a cash flow problem and without losing my cows?
spring vs fall
- Thread starter bcarty
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Bite the bullet, because there is going to be a cash flow problem either way you go. You could divide the herd up into half, thirds, or quarters, and gradually work that way over a two or three-year process. Another option would be to buy replacements that are fall calving cows or heifers as you were talking about.
back2dfuture
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Limomike":3l4p6n5g said:
I agree... I think in the long run dividing your spring herd is the way to go.. the cash flow will take a hit, but the fact that you herd's history, health , breeding etc is priceless..IMO
I'm working to develop a fall and spring calving season (mostly all spring right now) so why are you going the other direction if you don't mind me asking?
Maybe I need to rethink my strategy?
Maybe I need to rethink my strategy?
There are several reasons for wanting to go to all fall calving for me. First of all I want a uniform calf crop that allows me to get to a pot load of steers. Right now I'm not quite there so I take a small hit on price by having to sell them in less than a pot load. It also gives me more marketable pounds of calf the following fall. The calves that are born in the spring only average 400lbs and the fall calves are up around 600 when I sell them. If I can increase the weight of every calf I sell by 150 pounds then why am I not taking advantage of that. Many people would say to just keep my spring calves until the following spring, but then you are taking weaned calves through the winter and thats always tough. Thats just extra feed that I have to account for. While taking baby calves through the winter can be expensive, I have found that my cows are easier to condition than trying to keep yearlings growing all winter on stockpiled forage. Not to mention the extra space those yearlings take up. It also times where I can wean my fall calves when I have the most forage in the spring. It also has benefits in calving ease and timing. Here in Missouri we have fescue that grows really well in the fall and the calves are born in September, timing it with the onset of the fall flush of fescue. Those fall born calves are also on average a little lighter in BW so they are a little easier on the cows and esp. on heifers.
Another benefit that really has nothing to do with fall calving vs spring calving, but by converting to all one calving season I can put added pressure on my heifers to develop and breed on time therefore making my cowherd more fertile. If they wont breed on time then they cannot stay. Over time selecting for those cows that breed on time every year will make heifers that do the same. This can also be a drawback if you start with a set of cows that cannot get the job done in a 12 month interval. Could cause you to have a low conception rate the first year or two until you get rid of those cows that are not fertile enough to make it.
Another benefit that really has nothing to do with fall calving vs spring calving, but by converting to all one calving season I can put added pressure on my heifers to develop and breed on time therefore making my cowherd more fertile. If they wont breed on time then they cannot stay. Over time selecting for those cows that breed on time every year will make heifers that do the same. This can also be a drawback if you start with a set of cows that cannot get the job done in a 12 month interval. Could cause you to have a low conception rate the first year or two until you get rid of those cows that are not fertile enough to make it.
Thank you for the detailed explanation.
Lucky_P
Well-known member
bcarty,
We've been moving toward mostly Fall-calving for about 7 years - for the same reasons you stated - Fall-born calves are heavier when sold in June/July, and have benefitted from several months of optimal grazing, whereas the Spring-born calves, marketed in October, are a lot lighter;
Less heat-stress trying to get cows bred in the fall than in June/July here - easier on the cow AND the inseminator or bull, too.
Have managed to get 2/3 of the herd into the Fall group; mostly by holding late-born spring heifers and breeding at 17-18 months instead of 14-15, or by 'rolling' spring-calving 1st calvers to the Fall group, giving them a better shot at recovering and breeding back. Did it impact cash flow? Yeah, but we didn't do it all at one swell foop.
But, now, the farm manager is looking at moving to June calving to diminish nutritional strain on the cows over winter(and smaller feed bills) - and I will admit that the few cows that we have that are way out of synch, calving in June, do have calves that are bigger(more than I can attribute to just being 3 months older), and come through the winter in better condition than those calving in Sept/Oct. It'll be easy to move the Spring herd to June calving, but will take years to back the Fall herd up enough to get 'em that early - sure don't want to hold 'em over 10 months before breeding 'em.
We've been moving toward mostly Fall-calving for about 7 years - for the same reasons you stated - Fall-born calves are heavier when sold in June/July, and have benefitted from several months of optimal grazing, whereas the Spring-born calves, marketed in October, are a lot lighter;
Less heat-stress trying to get cows bred in the fall than in June/July here - easier on the cow AND the inseminator or bull, too.
Have managed to get 2/3 of the herd into the Fall group; mostly by holding late-born spring heifers and breeding at 17-18 months instead of 14-15, or by 'rolling' spring-calving 1st calvers to the Fall group, giving them a better shot at recovering and breeding back. Did it impact cash flow? Yeah, but we didn't do it all at one swell foop.
But, now, the farm manager is looking at moving to June calving to diminish nutritional strain on the cows over winter(and smaller feed bills) - and I will admit that the few cows that we have that are way out of synch, calving in June, do have calves that are bigger(more than I can attribute to just being 3 months older), and come through the winter in better condition than those calving in Sept/Oct. It'll be easy to move the Spring herd to June calving, but will take years to back the Fall herd up enough to get 'em that early - sure don't want to hold 'em over 10 months before breeding 'em.
Calving in the middle of summer is a tough time on cows, calves, and the farmer. Its really hot and flies are bad in the summer. It really stresses the cows to calve in that hot weather and subsequently will have a negative impact on the number of calves born. I can see where that would have some advantage especially for those guys that dont want to wean their calves at 7 months. For me weaning at 7 months of age puts them right in the middle of that bad weather in Feb and March. Thats a high stress time for those calves and I want them to have the best environment possible to wean in. Cold and wet mixed with stressed calves... man I can hear them coughing already. If your located where you can avoid all those issues then good for you, but I cant see that June/July calving would help me at all.
Here is some good reading on that very thing, that just came out last month:
http://oklahomafarmreport.com/wire/news ... 081748.php
http://oklahomafarmreport.com/wire/news ... 081748.php
Dr. Selk is a big proponent of having two short defined seasons in both the spring and the fall. His logic is sound in the fact that by having two seasons you are not as restricted by the market and you have two sets of calves instead of the proverbial all your eggs in one basket. He talks about needed to generate at least 20 steers to take advantage of lot size, and that is true at the sale barn. He is a smart man and his theory is true for majority of producers who have small numbers. Our operation is at a 65 year low in terms of cow numbers and we want to get back to 300-350 cow range and with than number I will be generating around 200 calves to send to market. I dont plan on using a sale barn to market my calves. I just need to get all my calves as uniform as possible so I can send them to the feedlot all as a set.
I think I am just going to start developing all heifers to calve in the fall and cull more aggressively on the spring herd. Eventually I will get rid of the last few old spring cows and be all fall calving.
I think I am just going to start developing all heifers to calve in the fall and cull more aggressively on the spring herd. Eventually I will get rid of the last few old spring cows and be all fall calving.
herefordlover
Well-known member
we do the fall and spring calving here in northeast missouri and i would love to be all fall i love the option of running the fall caves back on grass and or selling at weining in theres a need to. at least with fall caves there in the mud now when there old enuff to walk threw it
