sick scottish highland steer

[allyson]

I have an 11 year old steer who is a pet with diarhea and weight loss...He is my only cow...I have had a stool sample to the vet and they have given him SMZ 10 days, probiotic paste 14 days, Bolluses for the runs and Endosorb Suspension which he has had for 5 days....no better with the runs...He is eating and acting normal...except for the stool and weight loss...He has been on bute for 4 years... 4grams ...his hip is bone on bone...The vets are clueless and at this point are no help...I don't know if it is his age or if he has ulcers...when they did the stool culture they said there was no blood in his stool....any suggestions on what to do...someone said possibly Johnes but there is no way he could have come in contact with the bacteria...

 

[hillsdown]

I have an 11 year old steer who is a pet with diarhea and weight loss...He is my only cow...I have had a stool sample to the vet and they have given him SMZ 10 days, probiotic paste 14 days, Bolluses for the runs and Endosorb Suspension which he has had for 5 days....no better with the runs...He is eating and acting normal...except for the stool and weight loss...He has been on bute for 4 years... 4grams ...his hip is bone on bone...The vets are clueless and at this point are no help...I don't know if it is his age or if he has ulcers...when they did the stool culture they said there was no blood in his stool....any suggestions on what to do...someone said possibly Johnes but there is no way he could have come in contact with the bacteria...

Did you test for Johne's ?

 

[chippie]

It could be his age and it could be from the Bute. It should not be used long term because it can cause ulcers.

I have had horses with ulcers and had good results with U-gard http://tinyurl.com/u-gard-pwd

Ask your vet about if you can give it to your steer. Good luck.

 

[Keren]

Why is he on the bute?

Bute is very hard on the stomach.

11 isn't exactly ancient for a pampered pet steer. My two theories would be that its the bute, or johnes. I'd have the johnes test done just to make sure, and ask about an alternative medication to bute, or the ulcer treatment as chippie mentioned.

 

[hillsdown]

Why is he on the bute?

Bute is very hard on the stomach.

11 isn't exactly ancient for a pampered pet steer. My two theories would be that its the bute, or johnes. I'd have the johnes test done just to make sure, and ask about an alternative medication to bute, or the ulcer treatment as chippie mentioned.

I totally missed the bute part, there is no way an animal should be on it that long it is very invasive . A NSAID called Metacam/Meloxicam is now approved for use in Cattle, it is relatively safe for a somewhat long term use . Check into it with your vet.


Now off to check Lady Lola , the feet are out .

 

[kerley]

If your animal is this sick don't you think the humane thing to do is put him down. Is'nt it cruel to make him suffer?

 

[allyson]

I want to thank everyone who is replying to my post....If he were acting sick yes I would have him put to sleep without any question .... but he still walks around the yard and does everything he has done for 11 years...sick he is not acting...in fact he seems to be more perky...he is my special pet..
I have not done the Johnes test because the vet did not suggest it as there are no other cows here on my land and he has not been in contact with any...also since there is no cure if he has it I would do nothing different...I will not let him suffer...I am still confused because the vet told me he did not think it was the bute since there was no blood in his stool...

 

[hillsdown]

Calves can acquire Johnes from infected manure at a very young age ( like days old ) , as well as from infected milk or colostrum ..

I am confused here, how did you acquire him ,did you buy him, were you given him , did you calve him out ? In any case your steer could be infected with Johnes.

Good luck with him .

 

[Keren]

Hi allyson, as hillsdown said, cattle can pick up johnes pretty much from birth, but they typically don't show signs until later in life. There is also some research that suggests that they can contract it in utero (ie. from the mother before birth). Johnes is more prevalent in dairy cattle than beef cattle, and I agree with your other circumstances, Johnes is unlikely however his symptoms do fit, and I guess if it were me I just like to know the reason behind things. The tests aren't too costly.

Regarding the bute, its not only very hard on the stomach but also on the liver (oh wait, or maybe the kidneys. Gosh I've just had a brain fart moment and I can't remember which it is. Think its the kidneys actually). Metacam/meloxicam is a very gentle drug which essentially does the same thing, its a little more costly but in the long term its safer for the animal. I'd talk to your vet about trying it. Just out of curiosity, why does he need the bute?

I'm assuming you and the vet have ruled out the more basic causes of diarrhoea, such as worm burden, bacterial infection, and diet?

 

[Keren]

I also want to say, good on you for doing your utmost for your boy. Cows (steers) can and do make lovely pets. I'd love to see a pic and hear his story if you have time I love highlands, never had any though

 

[chippie]

He has been on bute for 4 years... 4grams ...his hip is bone on bone..

Alfalfa can help calm a stomach with ulcers too.

 

[allyson]

I am going to try the U-guard...I know the Johnes test should be done but 3 vets here said it will take 8-12 weeks for an answer and I understand there is no cure so what is the point...Yes it is only 80.00 which is actually very cheap...The breeder that I bought him from had just gotten the mom from a Highland auction...so she was not his breeding...and i did not realize that this disease ...if that is it...could show up later in life...I do not give injections so that is why he is on the bute for so many years...I guess as long as he is acting his normal self I will just try the uguard and see what happens...Thanks for the head up on the alfalfa...tomorrow I am going to call around and see if anyone here in this area has it...Not many dairy cattle here mostly beef...
again thankyou for helping...I also started feeding him grain since i hope that will help with the minerals and stuff he is loosing with the loose/runny stool...but he is loosing weight very quickly now..
he does have a mineral block...

 

[chippie]

Check at feed stores that sell horse feed. Many people feed it to their horses (including me )
Start him on it gradually. Maybe half a flake.

Good luck

 

[Jeanne - Simme Valley]

But, remember, Alfalfa is high in protein - high protein makes for runny manure.
Johnes is acquired at an early age & doesn't show up til "usually" around 2 years of age (most stress time for a female). Good appetite & acting normal with diarhea & quick weight loss is actually classic signs of Johnes - still, hard to believe it hasn't shown up til now. But, Johnes can be masked completely by living a no-stress life - which sounds like that is what he has done.

 

[djinwa]

Knowing the Johnes status may not affect this steer, but I would want to know to prevent future cattle being infected on your property. If it is Johnes, your steer is now spreading the organism (M. paratuberculosis) all over your place in his manure. It takes years to get rid of the bug while they can infect other young animals.

If you plan to get more young cattle, you might want to now euthanize this steer, or isolate him in a place you can clean up well, or keep the new calves out of for a few years.

From the Merck Veterinary Manual:
http://www.merckvetmanual.com/mvm/index ... /55900.htm

M paratuberculosis is excreted in large numbers in feces of infected animals and in lower numbers in their colostrum and milk. It is resistant to environmental factors and can survive on pasture for >1 yr; survival in water is longer than in soil. The infection is usually acquired through the fecal-oral route; the dose needed to infect an animal is not known.
Infection is acquired early in life—often soon after birth—but clinical signs rarely develop in cattle <2 yr old because progression to clinical disease occurs slowly. Resistance to infection increases with age, and cattle exposed as adults are much less likely to become infected. Infection is acquired by ingestion of the organism when nursing on contaminated teats; consumption of milk, solid feed, or water contaminated by the organism; or licking and grooming behavior in a contaminated environment. In the later, bacteremic stages of infection, intrauterine infections can be seen.

Control requires good sanitation and management practices aimed at limiting the exposure of young animals to the organism.
……More general procedures to minimize fecal contamination on the farm can also help, eg, elevating food and water troughs, providing piped water in preference to ponds, and harrowing frequently to disperse feces on pasture. Herd owners should be advised that paratuberculosis control takes at least 5 yr.

 

[hillsdown]

But, remember, Alfalfa is high in protein - high protein makes for runny manure.
Johnes is acquired at an early age & doesn't show up til "usually" around 2 years of age (most stress time for a female). Good appetite & acting normal with diarhea & quick weight loss is actually classic signs of Johnes - still, hard to believe it hasn't shown up til now. But, Johnes can be masked completely by living a no-stress life - which sounds like that is what he has done.

7 years is the average age it shows up in cows and usually after calving. The fact is there are no real studies on steers affected with Johnes because most are slaughtered at a young age .

Allyson Metacam/Meloxicam can be given orally as well, but like Keren said it is very pricey .

Have you drenched him with Kaopectate , might be worth a try ?

Everything you say about him implicates Johnes . The blood, test not fecal test, as he is symptomatic already, can be done with results within a week.

Best of luck but you might want to think about euthanization if he considers to deteriorate , they can then take a sample from his brain and it will tell positive or negative with in a day . If he is positive for Johne's you will have to start a plan to clean up your land before ever having a calf on it again. When researching Johne's year ago, it said heat is the only thing that will kill the infected manure/soil .

 

[Keren]

Hi again Allyson, as hills said again, the metacam/meloxicam is an oral drug. I'd suggest trying the Uguard combined with the bute initially, to see if that makes any difference, but if not, and if your budget allows it, I'd strongly suggest trying the gentler drug (metacam/meloxicam). Re the alfalfa, make sure he's still getting plenty of grass/meadow/cereal hay as well, alfalfa and grain will both cause loose manure if they get too much of it

 

[allyson]

well I got the Uguard yesterday and gave it to him in his feed with some molasses...Today i bought some Equimax wormer since someone suggested maybe a tapeworm...will give him that in his afternoon feeding...he is still acting normal...laying here by the house in the field...

 

[dun]

well I got the Uguard yesterday and gave it to him in his feed with some molasses...Today i bought some Equimax wormer since someone suggested maybe a tapeworm...will give him that in his afternoon feeding...he is still acting normal...laying here by the house in the field...

I don;t know about Equimax but with Paanacur you need to worm again in I think it's a week if it's tapeworms. If it is tape you'll be able to tell pretty easily, just look at his piles right after you give it to him and for about a day after.