Seedstock prices in general

[artesianspringsfarm]

Didn't want to hijack the thread on bull prices, but I'm wondering what people are seeing the prices do at normal fall sales? I could'nt keep my hand down this weekend as we went to a sale with extremely high quality females go for very little over what commercial replacement cost would be. I don't understand it and it was one of those mixed blessings. I'm relatively new to beef and have made no attempt to hide that, but I love registered cattle and suspect that somewhere down the road I would enjoy being a seedstock producer. Working as hard as a seedstock producer does and then not getting the premium that should bring has gotta be tough. Of course, the flipsde for me is, I got a whole lot of bang for my buck, at least I think. So, is this normal? When the market corrects a little, like it was sure to do, does everyone hide their checkbooks?

 

[Nesikep]

If you bought good females, I think even if prices fall for a year or two more, it's still a good investment... If they give you good calves for 10 or more years the little extra you pay now is nothing.

Around here we had a bad drought, and its really affected feed prices ($350/ton for ANY hay), so I think a lot of cows are getting shipped, and perhaps some bulls too. Unless the market crashes in a big way, I think a lot of people will be understocked in the spring and prices will be pretty good

 

[angus9259]

I wish I would have kept my hand down more when I was first buying and figuring things out. That said, when I was first buying I was able to buy top registered genetic pairs for $1500 - at the height of the cattle price depression.

That said, as a seedstock producer myself, I would like to assure you that correctly produced commercial cattle are frequently worth MORE than correctly produced registered animals though they often sell for less. Just like pure bred animals of any species - dogs for example - have experienced varying degrees of inbreeding that have hurt their overall performance, so have cattle of every ilk. It doesn't mean there's not value in registered animals to produce the best commercial animals, but, in my opinion, a commercial cow - properly crossbred - will generally be healthier, live longer, breed easier, have lower incidence of genetic issues (feet, udders, prolapses, fertility), etc.... than pure bred animals. :2cents:

 

[bigbull338]

as said if you bought quality cattle worth the money you did good.no 1 knows what reg prices can or will do.the last sell i went to i was bidding up to $4000 a hd and getting blown out.ended up getting 1 of my picks a summer calving cow for $3400.going to a sale in 6wks will see if prices backed off.

 

[wacocowboy]

I haven't been to a sell this fall but this spring reg. Beefmasters where high. I got blown out at two sales then paid 4,000 for a heifer. I will be going to a sale on the 14th haven't decided if I want to buy anything.

 

[Supa Dexta]

I still don't get it? Is that a typo, or the way you use that word? ha You said 'sell' in one sentence and 'sale' in the next. So you know both. I've been on dozens of forums, and this is the only board I've noticed this trend.

 

[wacocowboy]

I still don't get it? Is that a typo, or the way you use that word? ha You said 'sell' in one sentence and 'sale' in the next. So you know both. I've been on dozens of forums, and this is the only board I've noticed this trend.

Typo either I wasn't paying attention or my iPad did it for me.

 

[wbvs58]

In reality registered cows that are being sold from a herd are not worth any more than good quality commercial cows. Seedstock producers would like to think they were worth more but in a seedstock herd there is revolving door of new heifers entering and older cows leaving. Unless the breeder has a terrific reputation there is little interest in these cows from other seedstock producers as they have the same problem of surplus females. Clearing sales where the total herd is being sold creates more interest as everyone knows that the top cows are being sold as well. Over here the latest "fad" breeder flushed like crazy all his good cows then had a female sale of his entire herd of all cows over 3 years of age and that had seedstock producers from all over the country there paying big prices for cows.
Ken

 

[kjonesel]

I have been watching adds this fall for commercial cows and heifers and they aren't selling quickly. I feel the prices that they are asking are not reflecting the drop in the market. As far as seedstock being worth substantially more than commercial animals that is up to the purchaser and what your future intentions are. With registered animals you have a documented genetic trail to work from whereas with commercial cows your not so certain with what you have to work with. I believe you inadvertently made the best buy and didn't have to overpay for what you bought.

 

[Stocker Steve]

I have been watching adds this fall for commercial cows and heifers and they aren't selling quickly. I feel the prices that they are asking are not reflecting the drop in the market.

2X
Our first special bred cow sale was last week. Cows went $1100 to $1700. I expected less. Most bred heifers went $1500 to $1600.

 

[angus9259]

Be interesting to see what spring brings. With feed costs coming down (in our area), I'm surprised prices have dropped as far and as fast as they have - especially on feeder calves.

 

[kjonesel]

Finally sold my last 2 bulls of the year today. Both were registered red Gelbvieh's, one a Fullblood and the other a Purebred. I sold them at $2,500 for a 3/14 born and $2,100 for a 7/14 bull. They had been for sale for 6 months. We had a lot of lookers but eventually the right person showed up and bought them both. I offer them at what I hope to be an affordable price. If I was on the other side of the table I would have to justify the money spent and with current prices most commercial breeders are now wondering where the market will bottom out.

 

[msplmtneer]

What is the difference between fullblood and purebred?

 

[WalnutCrest]

What is the difference between fullblood and purebred?

Varies depending upon how the breed associations define it.

The actual percent of Gelbvieh blood in a purebred might be as low as 75-80 percent (this occurs when a 7/8ths female is considered 100% for upgrading proposes, and a 15/16ths bull is considered 100% for upgrading purposes ... multiplied out over many generations ... leads to a large degradation of heterosis).

The way the Gelbvieh folks do it is similar to the way other breeds do it (Lim, etc).

Aubracs, on the other hand, are set at 90-99.9% Aubrac blood to be purebred.

Fullbloods of any breed are 100% that breed.

 

[Stocker Steve]

In reality registered cows that are being sold from a herd are not worth any more than good quality commercial cows. Seedstock producers would like to think they were worth more but in a seedstock herd there is revolving door of new heifers entering and older cows leaving.

The old advise was that you should sell 25% of your cows each year if rapid herd improvement is one of your long term goals. I used to recycle some of these cows and it worked OK in a rising market. You could get a couple calves and then sell her for more than the purchase price.

Now that the US imports have increased - - our cull cow market has dropped even more than fat beef. So marketing cows a big financial issue.

I think the best value at our last cow sale was 2nd calver 3 year olds, and hopefully the price cycle will rebound before they lose their teeth. :cboy:

 

[cow pollinater]

When it's done right it's really only about ten percent of seedstock that gets used as seedstock. You can buy cows with papers all day long for just over commercial cow price because that's just what they are, just slightly better than commercial.

 

[bigbull338]

CP i know a guy that does that.he trys to pay the topside of comm prices for reg cows bred or paired out of top bulls.he gets a few bought doing it that way.ill see him this friday to look at cows as well as sat.because we both will be buying if we can get what we want at our price.