Roundup Ready Alfalfa

[iowafarmer]

Has anyone read this? Thoughts?

One of the nation's senior soil scientists alerted the federal government to a newly discovered organism that may have the potential to cause infertility and spontaneous abortion in farm animals, raising significant concerns about human health. Dr. Don Huber, professor emeritus at Purdue University, believes the appearance and prevalence of the unnamed organism may be related to the nation's over reliance on the weed killer known as Roundup and/or to something about the genetically engineered Roundup-Ready crops. In a letter to Secretary of Agriculture Tom Vilsack, the professor called on the federal government to immediately stop deregulation of roundup ready crops, particularly roundup ready alfalfa.

Text of letter here:

http://farmandranchfreedom.org/gmo-miscarriages

Hate to say it but your source seems to be pretty biased there. Go read the About Us on the website. The bios about the people running the web site give me the inclination that they want nothing to do with genetically modified anything. If the website was run by several people with phd's in agronomy I would be concerned. If there was a concern, a letter like that would not be released to the public due to the nature of its contents and the affect of what a letter like that could do to the industry. Google the name of the professor that sent the letter. I didn't see one paper or article written by him that has anything good to say on glyphosate. I have never heard nothing on this issue here at Iowa State University. News like that would be all over the industry if it was true. The man that wrote that letter claims in a different article I found by him that glyphosate kills plants by shutting down their defense mechanisms so that soil pathogens can mobilize and kill the plant. That is not how glyphosate works. Glyphosate works by binding to EPSPS enzyme which is needed in the synthesis of aromatic amino acids. Plants needs to synthesise all of the amino acids that the plant needs for growth. By blocking the synthesis of amino acids the plant cells are starved of necessary amino acids and the plant dies. Thats how glyphosate works.

 

[Douglas]

My office firewall blocks that site as being:
Verified fraudulent page or threat source.

 

[iowafarmer]

Has anyone read this? Thoughts?

One of the nation's senior soil scientists alerted the federal government to a newly discovered organism that may have the potential to cause infertility and spontaneous abortion in farm animals, raising significant concerns about human health. Dr. Don Huber, professor emeritus at Purdue University, believes the appearance and prevalence of the unnamed organism may be related to the nation's over reliance on the weed killer known as Roundup and/or to something about the genetically engineered Roundup-Ready crops. In a letter to Secretary of Agriculture Tom Vilsack, the professor called on the federal government to immediately stop deregulation of roundup ready crops, particularly roundup ready alfalfa.

Text of letter here:

http://farmandranchfreedom.org/gmo-miscarriages

Hate to say it but your source seems to be pretty biased there. Go read the About Us on the website. The bios about the people running the web site give me the inclination that they want nothing to do with genetically modified anything. If the website was run by several people with phd's in agronomy I would be concerned. If there was a concern, a letter like that would not be released to the public due to the nature of its contents and the affect of what a letter like that could do to the industry. Google the name of the professor that sent the letter. I didn't see one paper or article written by him that has anything good to say on glyphosate. I have never heard anything on this issue here at Iowa State University. News like that would be all over the industry if it was true. The man that wrote that letter claims in a different article I found by him that glyphosate kills plants by shutting down their defense mechanisms so that soil pathogens can mobilize and kill the plant. That is not how glyphosate works. Glyphosate works by binding to EPSPS enzyme which is needed in the synthesis of aromatic amino acids. Plants need to synthesise all of the amino acids that plants need for growth. By blocking the synthesis of amino acids the plant cells are starved of necessary amino acids and the plant dies. Thats how glyphosate works.

Sorry, I had a typo in my first post that I have now corrected as I was unable to edit my original post.

 

[MarkM]

Thanks for the input, guys. So, iowafarmer, what is your personal take on RR Alfalfa, and other GM crops? I don't believe Monsanto has any interest other than their own profit motives and that it will be unwise in the long run to give agribusiness one more means of control over producers. It feels good at first, but there is the potential for many unintended consequences in the long run.

 

[iowafarmer]

Well I think RR alflafa has its place. It may not be for everyone but it is another tool to help farmers if they properly manage it. The problem is producers got slack when roundup came out thinking it was a cure all and that is all they used year after year and now we have roundup ready resistant weeds. With proper management it is a helpful tool to farmers. Monsanto I think in general has good intentions they are looking out 50 yrs from now and are thinking that land isnt going to increase but the population sure is. Monsanto has dropped the price of Roundup to compete with glyphosate from China. They are not going to make money off from Roundup but instead are going to use it to support their seed. I know that without GMO corn and soybeans we would not be getting the yeilds that we are now and with increasing demand, every bushel counts. Yes, conventional corn can outyeild gmo corn if you have no disease, no insects, and perfect weather. How many places have no diseases, no insects, and perfect weather? So there is no perfect solution but if we hope to feed the world we are going to need to utilize every advantage we can or else implement population control. No matter what happens someone is always goin to be pissed off and upset and be on the loosing end. JMHO they are a good thing if managed and properly used right.

 

[dun]

I'm curious if atrazine would kill the RR stuff or roundup resistant weeds

 

[Douglas]

"The problem is producers got slack when roundup came out thinking it was a cure all and that is all they used year after year and now we have roundup ready resistant weeds."

I think the other thing that happened was when RouundUp was so high priced that farmers tried to use too low an application rate and that encouraged resistance.

 

[Douglas]

Thanks for the input, guys. So, iowafarmer, what is your personal take on RR Alfalfa, and other GM crops? I don't believe Monsanto has any interest other than their own profit motives and that it will be unwise in the long run to give agribusiness one more means of control over producers. It feels good at first, but there is the potential for many unintended consequences in the long run.

Of course Monsanto has a profit motive. The non-gmo Alfalfa seed companies that have been fighting RR Alfalfa, who use misinformation and lies about it to protect their profits as well.
Not a shred of real independent scientific evidence of any significant unintended consequences. Round up is much safer that the chemicals it replaces. Additionally RR crops significantly increase our ability to utilize no-till to protect the land for our future. For the most part the anti-gmo crowd is a bunch of tin foil hat wearing idiot bloggers. With all due respect.
Edit to add: GMO crops have the potential to help feed millions of starving people in the world. GMO cotton for example has significantly increased yields in places like India where increased production is literally improving millions of lives.

 

[hayray]

I think even with a tech fee that high it is well worth it. I have seen stands of it that are 5 years old seeded with very low rates compared to conventional. The ability to control competition allows lower seeding rates, cleaner stands, higher RFV hay. I am buying some, will cost about $325 a bag. Glyphosate is the best herbicide out there, environmentally safe, cost effective and highly effective in comparison to other herbicides. Ther are a lot of conspiracy theories out there that are just junk based on junk science, reminds me of the raw milk conspiracy theorist.

 

[hayray]

I'm curious if atrazine would kill the RR stuff or roundup resistant weeds

I was at a seminar and they have methods to kill it. Can't remember exactly but 2-4 D based products combined with tilliage. Atrazine I don't think works that well on alfalfa. Knew a guy that dumped some Atrazine on some acreage in the fall cause he was gonna put some corn in and it killed all the grass and the alfalfa responded so well that he kept the stand around for a while. Was completely off lable of course. I have one of those Agriculture auditors trying to track me down right now to go through my records of were I sprayed all of my restricted use products.

 

[iowafarmer]

I'm curious if atrazine would kill the RR stuff or roundup resistant weeds

Yes atrazine will kill RR resistant weeds, unless those weeds are resistant to atrazine as well. Atrazine does not use the same mode of action to kill plants as what glyphosate uses.

 

[dun]

I'm curious if atrazine would kill the RR stuff or roundup resistant weeds

I was at a seminar and they have methods to kill it. Can't remember exactly but 2-4 D based products combined with tilliage. Atrazine I don't think works that well on alfalfa. Knew a guy that dumped some Atrazine on some acreage in the fall cause he was gonna put some corn in and it killed all the grass and the alfalfa responded so well that he kept the stand around for a while. Was completely off lable of course. I have one of those Agriculture auditors trying to track me down right now to go through my records of were I sprayed all of my restricted use products.

I know they use atrazine on alflafa as the standard weed chemical but it depends on when it's applied. as to how it affects the alfalfa. Don;t know of anyone that has trired to kill alfalfa with it intentionally.

 

[dun]

Since alflafa has to be re-established after some years, would atrazine kill the old RR alfalfa well enough that the new plants can grow?

 

[upfrombottom]

It is my understanding from the research that I have done myself, the rotaion still has to be performed after the alfalfa is killed. Alfalfa produces autotoxic chemicals that are left in the soil and new seedlings are severly damaged by the chemicals and cannot become well established, and if you do get a stand, the yields will be sizably low. Hence the need for rotational planting of another crop for at least a year until the autotoxicity levels are deteriorated.

It is believed that alfalfa developed this trait because it originated as a desert plant and it may have used this strategy to reduce the competition from seedlings for scarce water.

 

[dun]

It is my understanding from the research that I have done myself, the rotaion still has to be performed after the alfalfa is killed. Alfalfa produces autotoxic chemicals that are left in the soil and new seedlings are severly damaged by the chemicals and cannot become well established, and if you do get a stand, the yields will be sizably low. Hence the need for rotational planting of another crop for at least a year until the autotoxicity levels are deteriorated.

It is believed that alfalfa developed this trait because it originated as a desert plant and it may have used this strategy to reduce the competition from seedlings for scarce water.

Black Walnut trees do the same thing. I sure wish pig weed would

 

[john250]

I read way too much on the internet.
If NPR or CNN or a newspaper does any story about agriculture, a condemnation of Monsanto will show up in the first two or three comments. There are a lot of people on the internet hating Monsanto. Monsanto has become the focus of all the resentment of "industrial agriculture".
As a farmer I want to dicker over the money they charge for their products, but I want the products. I don't like Microsoft much either, with their continuous fees for everything.
I can't think of a herbicide I would rather handle than Roundup, r.e. safety.
Monsanto is out for a buck, fersure. Most of the critics are selling something, too. Books, movies, "donate to our cause" .

 

[upfrombottom]

It is my understanding from the research that I have done myself, the rotaion still has to be performed after the alfalfa is killed. Alfalfa produces autotoxic chemicals that are left in the soil and new seedlings are severly damaged by the chemicals and cannot become well established, and if you do get a stand, the yields will be sizably low. Hence the need for rotational planting of another crop for at least a year until the autotoxicity levels are deteriorated.

It is believed that alfalfa developed this trait because it originated as a desert plant and it may have used this strategy to reduce the competition from seedlings for scarce water.

Black Walnut trees do the same thing. I sure wish pig weed would

Funny that you say that. Resistance to Roundup is a genetic trait that has been bred in to crops. Those genes where found and identified from plants that were known to resist the chemical. So if you were Monsanto where would you go from here? I suspect the next "miracle" chemicals will alter the genetic makeup of the seeds produced by weeds such as pig weed. It may not wipe it out this year or next, but after three, in theory pig weed infestations could be nearly wiped out.

Chemicals developed to alter the development of offspring of mosquitoes have been around for generations. But you don't hear much flack about those.

 

[hayray]

That is a good point. I would think they are thinking generations ahead for the next break through in weed control. Ther term is called alleopathy. Black walnut trees are considered alleopathic and the chemical is called juglans.

 

[MarkM]

For those of you using the RR alfalfa, did you sign the Monsanto Technology Stewardship Agreement? It is a legal document. Did you have legal counsel explain your liability to you?

 

[dun]

Emphasis is mine

Appeals court overturns sugar beet injunction

EmailPrint..By MICHAEL J. CRUMB, Associated Press Writer Michael J. Crumb, Associated Press Writer – Fri Feb 25, 11:55 pm ET
DES MOINES, Iowa – Environmental groups failed to show that seed plants for sugar beets genetically modified to withstand the popular weed killer Roundup would cause irreparable harm, a federal appeals court said Friday in overturning an injunction that called for the destruction of the plants.

The 9th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals in San Francisco said it disagreed with a federal district court decision last fall granting the injunction against the planting of the seed plants, also called stecklings.

"We conclude the district court abused its discretion in granting a preliminary injunction requiring destruction of the steckling plants," the court wrote. "Plaintiffs have not demonstrated that the ... plants present a possibility, much less a likelihood, of genetic contamination or other irreparable harm. The undisputed evidence indicates that the stecklings pose a negligible risk of genetic contamination, as the juvenile plants are biologically incapable of flowering or cross-pollinating before February 28, 2011, when the permits expire.".

The decision was the latest in the ongoing dispute over the genetically altered sugar beets, which were developed by Monsanto.

Last summer, a federal judge in California halted the planting of the sugar beets until the U.S. Department of Agriculture completed an environmental impact study on how the beets could affect conventional crops. A month later the USDA's Animal and Plant Health Inspection Service, issued permits to four companies to plant the stecklings in select areas in Oregon and Arizona. The groups that filed the initial lawsuit challenging the sugar beets filed another suit challenging the permits, and in November a federal district court judge in California granted the temporary injunction.

The federal appeals court stayed the injunction pending appeal until Feb. 28.

The ruling had a widespread impact since nearly all the nation's sugar beets come from the genetically altered seed and produce nearly half the nation's sugar supply. Sugar beets are grown on more than 1 million acres in 10 states with Idaho, Minnesota and North Dakota being the top producers.

Earlier this month, the USDA partially deregulated the genetically modified sugar beets, saying that they could be planted under strict conditions with no risk to the environment. The USDA continues to work on completing an environmental impact statement called for in last summer's decision.

The appeals court said it concluded that the permitting by APHIS was sufficiently limited and the "risk of gene flow ... could be virtually nonexistent."

Paul Atchitoff, an attorney for Earthjustice, which represents the groups that challenged the sugar beets, said he is disappointed with the appeals court's decision but called it a temporary setback.

"The 9th circuit seemed to be saying the point at which the plaintiffs should seek an injunction is when the agency APHIS makes a decision to allow the crop to flower. APHIS has made a decision, so from my understanding the time is ripe now for the plaintiffs to seek an injunction," he said.

Telephone and e-mail messages left Friday night for USDA officials and Monsanto were not immediately returned.