R-CALF Poll

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CattleAnnie":2d4iyz4o said:
Irregardless of who is actually responsible for the higher returns experienced by the U.S. cattlemen and women, I am happy for their good fortune.quote]

The only reason that your happy for our good fortune is that you hope that when the border opens you can take advantage of the markets the American rancher has created.

CattleAnnie":2d4iyz4o said:
Agriculture has long been an industry where the return for investments can be very dicey and often sporadic, especially for the producers.quote]

Thank you captain obvious. This might possibly the biggest understatement written on this board to date.

CattleAnnie":2d4iyz4o said:
I can only hope and pray that my fellow Canadian ranchers and farmers will be able to survive these difficult times and enjoy equivalant returns for the fruits of our labours.quote]

I honestly hope so to, but it's your countries lax laws that allowed the bone meal to be fed to your cattle that caused this whole mess. No one asked for it, we dealt with it and now your looking to us to sell your cattle.

CattleAnnie":2d4iyz4o said:
(With talk of $0.40 - $0.50 / 500 weight steer prices forecast for this fall, it will definately be an understatement to label our dilemna as a "challenge", but I am confident that if we look to our forebears who survived the "dirty thirties", we too shall overcome the obstacles placed in our paths and pave the way to better times in agriculture in Canada.quote]

The "dirty thirties" were an act of god not a blatant act of ignoring scientific evidence that feeding bone meal can spread BSE. My grandpa who is still alive and ranching with me went through the dirty thirties, last year we recieved 1.5" less than the driest year of the thirties. Don't tell me about hardships. CREATE your OWN markets.

CattleAnnie":2d4iyz4o said:
(Hang in there, boys and girls. Keep pestering the CCA, your MLAs, MPs, Ministers of Agriculture (both Provincially and Federally). It's important to keep reminding them that we need them to work with us to find a viable option out of this mess.)

Take care.

I applaud you, it is you and your fellow Canadians obligation to pressure your government to find oversees markets for your cattle. Some people (Texans) think that we need to leave the government out of our business. Sorry the government makes your business their business. Are you Mr. TX-AG going to go over to Japan and conduct trade talks to open our beef export markets?? I doubt it. Wouldn't you say that this is the governments role and obligation to the tax paying American farmer to go to bat for us?? Our ag products are bartered and sold from country to country. They are used as "pawns" in the political arena. Is this right??
 
BLACKPOWER":uc7tyjsl said:
CattleAnnie":uc7tyjsl said:
Irregardless of who is actually responsible for the higher returns experienced by the U.S. cattlemen and women, I am happy for their good fortune.quote]

Blackpower wrote
The only reason that your happy for our good fortune is that you hope that when the border opens you can take advantage of the markets the American rancher has created.
BlackPower
I have known some sorry,ignorant, arrogant, obnoxious people, but I have serious doubts that you belong to the human race.

Cattle Annie and our other Canadian friends, I hope you don't judge all Americans by what you can read from this P.O.S.
 
Blackpower,
As much as this particular pot does not need stirring, I'd like to respond to two things you posted.

1. My feelings of goodwill towards my US ranching neighbours has nothing to do with "The only reason that your happy for our good fortune is that you hope that when the border opens you can take advantage of the markets the American rancher has created", as you put it. Sorry if you can't understand the difference between sincere congratulations and envy.
It is my hope that we can turn away completely from supplying the US demand for our beef and in turn open new markets overseas. I would however like to see the border open to breeding stock, as many breeders have shopped cross border for bloodlines for years. But, if shipping embryos and semen become the norm, so be it.

2. In response to "I honestly hope so to, but it's your countries lax laws that allowed the bone meal to be fed to your cattle that caused this whole mess. No one asked for it, we dealt with it and now your looking to us to sell your cattle. ".
We Canadians have a feed ban regarding SRMs in place. After reading the attached news release, it would appear that you sir, should perhaps not be so hastily throwing stones, because apparantly the superior house you believe that you reside in is constructed of glass.

* Please read the following news release: *

FDA Feed Proposal Worries Renderers

Omaha World-Herald, September 01, 2004


by Chris Clayton WORLD-HERALD STAFF WRITER


Meatpackers and feedlots in Nebraska, one of the nation's top states for slaughtering cattle, produce a lot of refuse that goes into feed for pets, poultry and other livestock.

Each year, rendering and feed companies in Nebraska dispose of about 300 million pounds of such materials, which could end up being put in landfills or illegally dumped if new federal rules are enacted.

"I think they are just jumping the gun a little bit," Tom Johnson, general manager of Nebraska By-Products in Lexington, said of the Food and Drug Administration.

Nebraska By-Products, which employs about 120 people, is one of the companies that disposes of materials people don't like to think about. The company collects dead animals from feedlots and farms, along with inedible byproducts from small slaughterhouses and meat lockers, It then converts them into protein supplements for other livestock, pets and fish.

But if the federal government prohibits the feeding of any animal parts to other animals, companies like Nebraska By-Products, which now pick up animals for free, could charge for their services.

"Now, you are talking about charging $150 to $300 to get rid of a dead cow," Johnson said.

That's why major beef, meatpacking and animal feed trade groups are pushing the FDA to delay proposed rules, announced last month, that would prohibit all animal feed from containing cattle brains, skulls, eye, spinal cords, intestines and other materials, which are collectively called specified risk materials by the industry.

Since issuance of the proposed rules, industry groups have campaigned hard, calling the proposals draconian and unscientific. The American Meat Institute maintains there is no scientific basis for the decision.

"There's reams of scientific information that this is a safe, wholesome product," said Jim Hodges, president of AMI. "What's forgotten in all of this debate is it isn't guts we are feeding to these animals, it's a processed protein product."

The AMI also points out that inspections in the feed industry show 99 percent compliance with the current feed ban.

The Nebraska Cattlemen supports better controls on how feed mills separate machinery and facilities for livestock feeds. The group also supports banning poultry litter as an ingredient for cattle feed.

But the cattlemen agree with AMI and other trade groups that there isn't enough proof to ban rendered material as a feed ingredient.

The FDA's proposal comes after last December's case of mad-cow disease. It tightens a 1997 feed ban that has prevented cattle meat and bone meal from being turned into cattle feed.

Government officials said the proposal is another step in controlling further incidents of mad cow disease.

"With these additional measures, we will make a strong system even stronger," said Lester Crawford, acting director of the FDA.

If enacted, the new ban would prohibit converting into livestock feed any specified risk materials from cattle older than 30 months. Intestines and a few other parts would be banned in even younger animals. All dead livestock from farms would be banned.

"Removing SRMs is a very costly option in and of itself, and, second, finding an environmentally safe way to dispose of them would be costly," said Johnson of Nebraska By-Products.

From meatpackers alone, there is a projected 1.4 billion pounds of product that would have to be disposed of, according to the National Renderers Association. Then there are the risk materials from more than 4.2 million animals that die before they make it to the slaughterhouse.

Such materials now used as pig, poultry or fish feed have a value ranging from about $180 to more than $330 a ton.

"It's not only going to affect us, it's going to affect the livestock producers, and it's going to trickle down and affect everybody," Johnson said.

Johnson said the new rule will translate into high costs to incinerate and dispose of the materials. Rather than paying a collection fee to Nebraska ByProducts and other companies, some producers may dispose of the animals themselves.

"That's our greatest fear. . . . Some people are going to just dump them."


Interesting?
 
CattleAnnie":2lfjitej said:
Blackpower,
As much as this particular pot does not need stirring, I'd like to respond to two things you posted.

1. My feelings of goodwill towards my US ranching neighbours has nothing to do with "The only reason that your happy for our good fortune is that you hope that when the border opens you can take advantage of the markets the American rancher has created", as you put it. Sorry if you can't understand the difference between sincere congratulations and envy.
It is my hope that we can turn away completely from supplying the US demand for our beef and in turn open new markets overseas. I would however like to see the border open to breeding stock, as many breeders have shopped cross border for bloodlines for years. But, if shipping embryos and semen become the norm, so be it.

2. In response to "I honestly hope so to, but it's your countries lax laws that allowed the bone meal to be fed to your cattle that caused this whole mess. No one asked for it, we dealt with it and now your looking to us to sell your cattle. ".
We Canadians have a feed ban regarding SRMs in place. After reading the attached news release, it would appear that you sir, should perhaps not be so hastily throwing stones, because apparantly the superior house you believe that you reside in is constructed of glass.

* Please read the following news release: *

FDA Feed Proposal Worries Renderers

Omaha World-Herald, September 01, 2004


by Chris Clayton WORLD-HERALD STAFF WRITER


Meatpackers and feedlots in Nebraska, one of the nation's top states for slaughtering cattle, produce a lot of refuse that goes into feed for pets, poultry and other livestock.

Each year, rendering and feed companies in Nebraska dispose of about 300 million pounds of such materials, which could end up being put in landfills or illegally dumped if new federal rules are enacted.

"I think they are just jumping the gun a little bit," Tom Johnson, general manager of Nebraska By-Products in Lexington, said of the Food and Drug Administration.

Nebraska By-Products, which employs about 120 people, is one of the companies that disposes of materials people don't like to think about. The company collects dead animals from feedlots and farms, along with inedible byproducts from small slaughterhouses and meat lockers, It then converts them into protein supplements for other livestock, pets and fish.

But if the federal government prohibits the feeding of any animal parts to other animals, companies like Nebraska By-Products, which now pick up animals for free, could charge for their services.

"Now, you are talking about charging $150 to $300 to get rid of a dead cow," Johnson said.

That's why major beef, meatpacking and animal feed trade groups are pushing the FDA to delay proposed rules, announced last month, that would prohibit all animal feed from containing cattle brains, skulls, eye, spinal cords, intestines and other materials, which are collectively called specified risk materials by the industry.

Since issuance of the proposed rules, industry groups have campaigned hard, calling the proposals draconian and unscientific. The American Meat Institute maintains there is no scientific basis for the decision.

"There's reams of scientific information that this is a safe, wholesome product," said Jim Hodges, president of AMI. "What's forgotten in all of this debate is it isn't guts we are feeding to these animals, it's a processed protein product."

The AMI also points out that inspections in the feed industry show 99 percent compliance with the current feed ban.

The Nebraska Cattlemen supports better controls on how feed mills separate machinery and facilities for livestock feeds. The group also supports banning poultry litter as an ingredient for cattle feed.

But the cattlemen agree with AMI and other trade groups that there isn't enough proof to ban rendered material as a feed ingredient.

The FDA's proposal comes after last December's case of mad-cow disease. It tightens a 1997 feed ban that has prevented cattle meat and bone meal from being turned into cattle feed.

Government officials said the proposal is another step in controlling further incidents of mad cow disease.

"With these additional measures, we will make a strong system even stronger," said Lester Crawford, acting director of the FDA.

If enacted, the new ban would prohibit converting into livestock feed any specified risk materials from cattle older than 30 months. Intestines and a few other parts would be banned in even younger animals. All dead livestock from farms would be banned.

"Removing SRMs is a very costly option in and of itself, and, second, finding an environmentally safe way to dispose of them would be costly," said Johnson of Nebraska By-Products.

From meatpackers alone, there is a projected 1.4 billion pounds of product that would have to be disposed of, according to the National Renderers Association. Then there are the risk materials from more than 4.2 million animals that die before they make it to the slaughterhouse.

Such materials now used as pig, poultry or fish feed have a value ranging from about $180 to more than $330 a ton.

"It's not only going to affect us, it's going to affect the livestock producers, and it's going to trickle down and affect everybody," Johnson said.

Johnson said the new rule will translate into high costs to incinerate and dispose of the materials. Rather than paying a collection fee to Nebraska ByProducts and other companies, some producers may dispose of the animals themselves.

"That's our greatest fear. . . . Some people are going to just dump them."


Interesting?

Slant, Spin, BS, whatever color you want to paint it. Dumping a dead cow in a blowout hardly equates to feeding bone meal to your cows. In all my life I have yet to see other cows circled around a deceased cow and taking bites out of her carcass! Have you?? Cattle have been disposed of forvever by cattlemen who place them in holes blowouts etc. They are coyote food, a threat to reenter the food chain? I think not. Welcome to the no spin zone.

Interesting........
 
la4angus":2fxl6h4p said:
BLACKPOWER":2fxl6h4p said:
CattleAnnie":2fxl6h4p said:
Irregardless of who is actually responsible for the higher returns experienced by the U.S. cattlemen and women, I am happy for their good fortune.quote]

Blackpower wrote
The only reason that your happy for our good fortune is that you hope that when the border opens you can take advantage of the markets the American rancher has created.
BlackPower
I have known some sorry,ignorant, arrogant, obnoxious people, but I have serious doubts that you belong to the human race.

Cattle Annie and our other Canadian friends, I hope you don't judge all Americans by what you can read from this P.O.S.

I quess the entire upper midwest doesn't belong to the human race then. My beliefs are a reflection of the common sense thinking of the cattlemen who enjoy the prices and are doing their part to maintain them. Your a bitter old man who Aint gettin it done anymore. How about you shut your mouth and see how this old Canadian Bag is tearing down the entire US cattle industry and not just me.
 
BLACKPOWER":1ow3qkf1 said:
Your a bitter old man who Aint gettin it done anymore.

No; Boy, You sound like a bitter little boy that the girls keep chasing away.; and your mama needs to spank your butt.
Don't blame the human population on your inadwquacies. Go find you another sheep to take home to yore mama, she may be proud of you, but no one else is. I seriously doubt the R-Calfers would claim you.
 
BLACKPOWER":270kp66b said:
Are you Mr. TX-AG going to go over to Japan and conduct trade talks to open our beef export markets?? I doubt it.

are you talking to me? if you are, you might want to get your posters straight because this is the first post i've made in this discussion.

fyi: it's Ms txag to you.
 
BLACKPOWER":1vjqyzfo said:
R-Calf states that they are opposed to the border being reopened until the Canadian's prove that they have a safe meat supply. That hasn't been done yet, and that is the reason the border is still closed.
Okay, blackpower. I think I finally understand. We all want a safe meat supply. I agree with you!

BLACKPOWER":1vjqyzfo said:
You oppose a group made up of American cattle ranchers whose sole goal is to ensure the best price for American beef??
Uh-oh. Silly me! This is where I start to get confused. I thought it was food safety?

BLACKPOWER":1vjqyzfo said:
R-Calf filed an appeal to the State Supreme Court in Montana stopping the opening. The very next day cattle prices jumped and have stayed there.
So, R-CALF is prepared to use trial lawyers and the court system to keep prices up? Well, I guess they're not really prepared. Don't they hit on the membership for contributions to their shyster lawyer fund? But if that makes prices jump..... Then it really has nothing to do with a safe meat supply?

BLACKPOWER":1vjqyzfo said:
My beliefs are a reflection of the common sense thinking of the cattlemen who enjoy the prices and are doing their part to maintain them.
You've mentioned prices more than food safety, so I guess we can assume that R-CALF is most concerned about prices? Why don't all of you just be honest about it, then?
 
BLACKPOWER":2td9djgy said:
My grandpa who is still alive and ranching with me...

Think you might have gotten that bassackwards?

BLACKPOWER":2td9djgy said:
Some people (Texans) think that we need to leave the government out of our business. Sorry the government makes your business their business.

So, it finally came out. That's what galls you about Texas and Texans. We, like so many others in the south (all over the country for that matter) don't need a bunch of politicians and trial lawyers to be successful in the cattle business. I've always wondered about your Texas complex. Now it's perfectly clear. It fits neatly with all your whining about conservatives and other people who are basically tough and independent. You're helpless and weak and resent anybody who isn't. Yup, it all adds up.

Craig-TX
 
Craig-TX":3ml8wyd8 said:
BLACKPOWER":3ml8wyd8 said:
My grandpa who is still alive and ranching with me...

Think you might have gotten that bassackwards?

BLACKPOWER":3ml8wyd8 said:
Some people (Texans) think that we need to leave the government out of our business. Sorry the government makes your business their business.

So, it finally came out. That's what galls you about Texas and Texans. We, like so many others in the south (all over the country for that matter) don't need a bunch of politicians and trial lawyers to be successful in the cattle business. I've always wondered about your Texas complex. Now it's perfectly clear. It fits neatly with all your whining about conservatives and other people who are basically tough and independent. You're helpless and weak and resent anybody who isn't. Yup, it all adds up.

Craig-TX

Ok all knowing Texas dumb@$$, who the hell do you think you are to make assumption about the intricacies of my operation? Grandad is 85 has emphazema owns no land and no cattle, Yeah he helps ME out.

You are a Radical, you belittle anyone who doesn't agree 100% with your or YOUR president's political agenda. You think i'm all for career politicians and trial lawyers, sounds a lot like what makes up the Republican party. I'm sure there were no Halliburton lobbyists sitting in the White house when they were awarded 11 Billion dollars worth of army contracts, none of which were put up for public bid. I suppose you think your precious Beef Checkoff program doesn't use any of your money to fund lobbyists in Washington either?
 
I don't really know what the issue with the r-calf is so I probably should keep my mouth shut, but............ if the Canadian and I think the Mexican border being closed is part of the reason that cattle prices are up right now then we need to keep the borders closed. I am not against the Candian or Mexican people but we need to take care of the U.S. first. If the shoe was on the other foot do you think they would open their borders to help our economy, I don't think so. And if the shoe was on the other foot I would still say that the Canadian and Mexican government has an obligation to take care of their people first. Where were these countries when the U.S was attacked on 911. How many Canadian citizens are fighting with us in Iraq??? How many Mexican citizens???
 
txshowmom":dqze76pl said:
............ if the Canadian and I think the Mexican border being closed is part of the reason that cattle prices are up right now then we need to keep the borders closed.
Showmom, I think what we need to do on trade issues is what we said we would do with NAFTA and other trade agreements. We can't change our mind and break our agreements just because it suits us now, can we? Shouldn't we as a country live up to our agreements? Is it okay to use a flimsy excuse like questioning the safety of Canadian beef to further our own economic interests? I think not, but that's just my opinion. Seems like a bunch of you want a one-way sign at the borders! Export all we can, but import nothing? Interesting fantasy......

txshowmom":dqze76pl said:
How many Canadian citizens are fighting with us in Iraq???
Let's don't forget Afghanistan, Showmom. Surely you remember the Canadians helping us over there, don't you? If it helps to refresh your memory, we had an Air Force pilot accidentally bomb some of their troops and kill four of them over there. And like good neighbors, I don't remember hearing them raise a lot of Hell over that!
 
1. This "old Canadian bag" as you put it, has NEVER said or insinuated in anyway that I am "tearing down the entire US cattle industry". That, sir, is an outright LIE.

2. In regards to "Slant, Spin, BS, whatever color you want to paint it. Dumping a dead cow in a blowout hardly equates to feeding bone meal to your cows". Canada had bonemeal in cattle feed banned in 1997, same as the US. If you don't care for the content of the article posted, write a letter to the editor.

3. As to the feeding of bone meal to rumenints, for your information, sir, if you look in the USDA records, you will find a number of American feed companies that were violating that ban in 2004. So even unknowingly, it would be safe to surmise that there were some cattle in the US being fed feed containing bonemeal in it.

So do you see me on this board slandering US producers or their livestock? I don't bloody think so. They are darn good people, same as those here in Canada. They'd be welcome to come for coffee at our place any day of the week. Stay a week even, we like company. So what exactly is your problem? I don't recall ever peeing in your cornflakes, so how about you take that out on whoever did.

I respect your right to your opinion, is it so difficult to return that courtesy, instead of being so rude?
 
CattleAnnie":1yt7sjhs said:
They'd be welcome to come for coffee at our place any day of the week.
And y'all are welcome at our place, Annie. Would enjoy having you. If I was in Canada, I think I'd insist on you feeding me one of those great Canadian Ribeyes or Porterhouses, though. But then, I'm not the one who's scared of your beef. Guess that would leave more for me, huh?
 
Nebraska By-Products, which employs about 120 people, is one of the companies that disposes of materials people don't like to think about. The company collects dead animals from feedlots and farms, along with inedible byproducts from small slaughterhouses and meat lockers, It then converts them into protein supplements for other livestock, pets and fish.

Dumping a dead cow in a blowout hardly equates to feeding bone meal to your cows.

Black Pooer:
I don't think that says they are dumping them in blow holes. I had heard that there was some inbreeding going on down there in Nebraska, but, wow. What's it like having your parents as Brother and Sister. Less trouble with the in-laws I'd guess.
Its guys like you that cost the American people jobs. Unfortunately, reality is that we are dealing in a world economy. Putting tariffs artificial or otherwise will only be met with retaliatory tariffs. Soon suppliers will find other markets and prices will become more expensive. Not only this but retaliatory tariffs will make US goods more expensive in other countries. this causes lost jobs because less products will be shipped from the US. What do you think happens to the standard of living when the price of goods goes up but the money in the economy decreases? But like every other socialist you can't see past doing what is good for you right now and to hell with the future and everyone else.
The Americans were just charged by the WTO with unfair trading practices under something called the Byrd amendment last week. It is the first of many rulings, I would guess. You can't just go around signing free trade agreements with other countries and not honoring them.
Why don't you go back and upgrade your education so that you can at least read and take a few courses in economics instead of spouting all this uneducated gibberish all over the site. I put you in the same category as GP78 and for a long time I thought that guy had brain damage.
Have a nice day.
 
OK why are y'all responding to this nut, I know I fell off the wagon sorry.
Remember a wise man never knows all; only a fool knows everthing
 
Campground Cattle":lk3yo3lc said:
OK why are y'all responding to this nut, I know I fell off the wagon sorry.
Remember a wise man never knows all; only a fool knows everthing
I agree Campground. There are a few people on here that I have decided not to respond to,no matter what they write. Cattle Rack-I hope you don't think everyone in the Sandhills is the same. I know of some really fine people there.
 
txshowmom":2sekuxay said:
........... if the Canadian and I think the Mexican border being closed is part of the reason that cattle prices are up right now then we need to keep the borders closed.
Not picking on you Showmom, but just for informational purposes, the Mexican border is open and trading daily. These are prices for Wednesday's crossings:


Las Cruces, NM Thursday, September 9, 2004 USDA Market News
Mexico to U.S.Feeder Cattle Imports
Daily Import Total Sales
September 8, 2004



Del Rio, TX. EST: 1100

Compared to last week, steer calves and yearlings, 2.00 lower. Trade
and demand moderate. Supply consisted of steers weighing 300-500 lbs.

Feeder steers: Medium and large 1&2, 300-400 lbs 135.00-145.00; 400-500
Lbs 122.00-132.00. Medium and large 2&3, 300-400 lbs 125.00-135.00; 400-500
Lbs 112.00-122.00.


Presidio, TX. EST: 1000

Compared to last week, steer calves and yearlings 2.00 lower. Trade
and demand moderate. Supply consisted of steers weighing 300-600 lbs.

Feeder steers: Medium and large 1&2, 300-400 lbs 135.00-145.00; 400-500
Lbs 122.00-132.00; 500-600 lbs 109.00-119.00; Medium and large 2&3, 300-400
Lbs 125.00-135.00; 400-500 lbs 112.00-122.00; 500-600 lbs 99.00-109.00.

Santa Teresa, NM. EST: 2300

Compared to last week, steer calves and yearlings 3.00 lower. Trade
And demand moderate. Supply consisted of steers weighing 300-600 lbs.

Feeder steers: Medium and large 1&2, 300-400 lbs 135.00-145.00; 400-500
Lbs 122.00-132.00; 500-600 lbs 109.00-119.00. Medium and large 2&3, 300-400
Lbs 125.00-135.00; 400-500 lbs 112.00-122.00; 500-600 lbs 99.00-109.00.




Source: USDA Market News Service, Las Cruces, NM
John Langenegger,OIC 505 527-6861 FAX 505 527-6868
 

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