Pharo Influenced Heifers ?

[Stocker Steve]

Do you see them sold for replacements in your area, and what price premiums do Pharo influenced opens and breds bring ?

What happens with the steer feedlot calves ? :|

 

[RanchMan90]

My dad raises some. Seem to sell for same price as other registered red Angus, with input costs being lower. May bring a premium to a niche market.

 

[dun]

Friend of mine has some, the heifers sell like everything else. The steers he gets killed on when he markets them.

 

[Stocker Steve]

Friend of mine has some, the heifers sell like everything else. The steers he gets killed on when he markets them.

Does he breed some smaller frame Pharo influenced females to terminal bulls to avoid calf discounts?

 

[Stocker Steve]

A hobby guy in this area has been buying expensive Pharo RA bulls for a while. He is a poor grazer - - set stocking pastures that are shorter than golf courses... His cows take it fairly well but some of the calves do look small and/or short. Thinking about buying some of the bigger heifer calves for potential replacements, and later crossing them with black simi for market calves. What am I missing?

 

[HDRider]

I saw this...

If you are interested in purchasing some top-sort PCC-Influenced cows and heifers, you need to make plans to attend our Ohio Bull Sale. We will be selling 80 cows and heifers immediately after our bull sale. For more information call James Coffelt

And this...

Nebraska Bull Sale - Unofficially… it looks like we sold 83 bulls for an average price of $5900. We sold 47 Angus and Red Angus bulls for an average price of $6800. We sold five private treaty bulls immediately after the sale for an average price of $4000.

 

[Muddy]

A hobby guy in this area has been buying expensive Pharo RA bulls for a while. He is a poor grazer - - set stocking pastures that are shorter than golf courses... His cows take it fairly well but some of the calves do look small and/or short. Thinking about buying some of the bigger heifer calves for potential replacements, and later crossing them with black simi for market calves. What am I missing?

I would pass on the bigger heifer calves as replacements, unless you like to raising dink calves no matter what breed the sire is. I've found that small framed cows bred to a terminal bull often produce a mix sizes of calves.

 

[angus9259]

What's the difference between Pharo and Ohlde? I hear people speak down about Pharo but not Ohlde. Aren't they the same principles? Never seen Pharo cattle. The Ohlde look like dandies.

 

[Ky hills]

What's the difference between Pharo and Ohlde? I hear people speak down about Pharo but not Ohlde. Aren't they the same principles? Never seen Pharo cattle. The Ohlde look like dandies.

I am not entirely certain so please forgive me if I have it figured wrong. From what I understand the Pharo cattle are what most would consider very small frame, and Ohde cattle are of a frame size more in line with the smaller to moderate mainstream cattle.

 

[Ebenezer]

Either one: do some studying. Know you markets. Follow your head and not your heart. The average order buyer in our local barns do not read newletters from either would be my guess. The reason to raise cattle is to make a profit and not to make somebody else a hefty profit at your expense.

Why is an easy keeping bull from an easy keeping cow in an easy keeping herd that is smaller going to cost more to produce less? I think you call that good salesmanship.

You can cherry pick on the semen and do OK but just know what to expect, which to use and how many times to use it. Generally one time is plenty and then back to normal stuff. Ask around.

A term that somewhat bothers me in the discussions is "fleshing". I think of flesh as muscle. Some use the word flesh to refer to fat.

 

[City Guy]

Ebenezer, Would you be so kind as to indulge my confused pea brain and explain your second paragraph, please.

 

[City Guy]

I too would like to know what "fleshing" means-- muscle or fat or combo?

 

[City Guy]

Muddy, Do you think the mixed sizes of the small cows and terminal bull are the cows' fault or the bull's fault?

 

[HDRider]

I need to change my location to the state of confusion. I normally can recognize hype for what it is. Maybe my deep shade of green on my cattle badge blinds me here.

How can a guy be the 11th largest seed stock outfit if he sells what no one wants or needs? It can't be first time buyers. His frame size ranges from 3 to 5 I believe. His weights match larger framed animals, they just have less leg room. Other than Mr. Coffelt, who seems to be successful in his own right, no one has defended, or endorsed Pharo's cattle.

I don't like living in the state of confusion. No doubt Pharo's a good salesman, marketer, and writer. I can't see how those things alone would create the level of success he is enjoying.

http://beefmagazine.com/seedstock-100-1 ... le-company

http://beefmagazine.com/2016-seedstock-100

 

[Stocker Steve]

His weights match larger framed animals, they just have less leg room. Other than Mr. Coffelt, who seems to be successful in his own right, no one has defended, or endorsed Pharo's cattle.

I said the Pharo influenced cows looked good on golf course pastures. I think they would be the ticket for grass fed beef.
I think the biggest frame size confusion factor is $/head vs. $/acre. My neighbor brags up his 800# weaning wts. but he has to send his wife to work in town so he can pay for all the creep feed.

I am not happy with the efficiency available with big bull stud BA AI bulls. I have looked into sampling Pharo semen on heifers. We have been using mostly Accelerated or Genex RA recently.

 

[RanchMan90]

A pot load of 4 weight steers will bring more than a pot load of 5 weight steers is the theory. Due to there being more head on that load and the lighter weights bringing more per pound. Works the same with stocking rates, I haven't jumped on that bandwagon myself yet.

 

[Ebenezer]

Why is an easy keeping bull from an easy keeping cow in an easy keeping herd that is smaller going to cost more to produce less? I think you call that good salesmanship.

What's the bragging point after a sale? High prices. Yet the system is supposed to have more cows per acre, more calves produced, forage fed (maybe some soy hull pellets are forage), smaller bulls yet the costs are high. If all was working and the bulls were being produced in larger numbers, for less, fed cheaper, smaller, ... why are they not as cheap as any or cheaper? Less overhead, less cost, ... Or is it merely a merely profit driven sales pitch?

Here's the question for the deal: is PCC or OCC breeding and selling to match the box or for a side industry? If not for the box, then owners are going to either lose money or be forced into alternative marketing efforts which requires a lot of time and another hat to wear. Not bad, just don't know.

Around here, you better have the FS and the weight is less important. A big hurdle when the average mainstream commercial guy is the scapegoat in the straw man argument of being wrong all of the time.

 

[Muddy]

A pot load of 4 weight steers will bring more than a pot load of 5 weight steers is the theory. Due to there being more head on that load and the lighter weights bringing more per pound. Works the same with stocking rates, I haven't jumped on that bandwagon myself yet.

There is a huge difference between the price of a 4weight 5 framed calf and a 4weight 3 framed calf.

 

[HDRider]

Looking at Gardiner -

GAR Momentum - The shining star of our recently completed sire evaluation test. Elite calving ease, early growth, bottom 25% stature, breed leading end product merit, top 15% heifer pregnancy.

GAR Advance - Special calving ease status, limited but valuable growth as he is the #3 bull of the breed for Marbling. Bottom 5% stature! Advance is a modest sized, big footed, high volume bull that specializes in live calves that consistently garner the highest value premiums at USPB!

Here he touts the smaller frame.

 

[RanchMan90]

A pot load of 4 weight steers will bring more than a pot load of 5 weight steers is the theory. Due to there being more head on that load and the lighter weights bringing more per pound. Works the same with stocking rates, I haven't jumped on that bandwagon myself yet.

There is a huge difference between the price of a 4weight 5 framed calf and a 4weight 3 framed calf.

Yes there is. They gotta have frame