Over Conditioned

[Boot Jack Bulls]

That heifer (she is big, your trademark) is not over conditioned. BTW: calf already has her nursed and looking for more. I like that. Nice calf.

So what was the bulges at her tail head and brisket?

I could see the outline of her pelvis. Udder was not fatty. I didn't see an overly fat brisket. There were some fat patches around the tail head. Maybe between a 6 and 7.

Her udder is not fat because she is NURSING! I'm sorry, but that cow is over-conditioned. She has a fat brisket, her tail head is drowning in pone fat and she has rolls behind her shoulders. :deadhorse: She's too stale for a show ring, and that's saying something.

The fact is, some like their cattle to carry more or less condition than other breeders do. I won't preach on who is right (what do I know?), but I absolutely can't stand when people try to tell me (or others) that a fat cow is isn't fat or a skinny cow isn't skinny. When it is an fairly extreme case, there isn't much room left for speculation....

 

[Bright Raven]

So what was the bulges at her tail head and brisket?

I could see the outline of her pelvis. Udder was not fatty. I didn't see an overly fat brisket. There were some fat patches around the tail head. Maybe between a 6 and 7.

Her udder is not fat because she is NURSING! I'm sorry, but that cow is over-conditioned. She has a fat brisket, her tail head is drowning in pone fat and she has rolls behind her shoulders. :deadhorse: She's too stale for a show ring, and that's saying something.

The fact is, some like their cattle to carry more or less condition than other breeders do. I won't preach on who is right (what do I know?), but I absolutely can't stand when people try to tell me (or others) that a fat cow is isn't fat or a skinny cow isn't skinny. When it is an fairly extreme case, there isn't much room left for speculation....

I rated between 6 and 7. Where do you put her?

 

[Boot Jack Bulls]

I would call her a solid 8. I agree that you can see her hooks to a degree, but for me, the overwhelming presence of fat deposits and lack of muscle definition overall make her score more an 8 than a 7 .... :2cents:

 

[Bright Raven]

I would call her a solid 8. I agree that you can see her hooks to a degree, but for me, the overwhelming presence of fat deposits and lack of muscle definition overall make her score more an 8 than a 7 .... :2cents:

I have at least 2 that I consider solid 8. Here is something odd and I attribute it to genetics. I have two cows that share common ancestors. They have huge brisket deposits but if you score the rest of the body. - a solid 6. Very distinct hook and pin. No pones. No tailhead fat. Even see a faint rib. But brisket. - like a football.

 

[Boot Jack Bulls]

I would call her a solid 8. I agree that you can see her hooks to a degree, but for me, the overwhelming presence of fat deposits and lack of muscle definition overall make her score more an 8 than a 7 .... :2cents:

I have at least 2 that I consider solid 8. Here is something odd and I attribute it to genetics. I have two cows that share common ancestors. They have huge brisket deposits but if you score the rest of the body. - a solid 6. Very distinct hook and pin. No pones. No tailhead fat. Even see a faint rib. But brisket. - like a football.

The brisket can be misleading. There is a ton of extra skin and tissue in that area on most animals. My daughter's old Limi cow has a large-ish brisket. The rest of her earns her a much lower BCS though. The twins are taking everything she has to give. They may end up weaned a bit early just so she has a really good chance to get condition back before snow flies. When assessing BCS on an animal, I consider the age, breed and gestation/lactation (if applicable) too. If an older SImmi cow, for example, has a larger brisket, but other wise trim physique, I would not increase her score on the brisket alone....

 

[TennesseeTuxedo]

That collar accentuates her weight gain and the camera is adding 200 pounds so it's really not fair to judge.

 

[Bright Raven]

That collar accentuates her weight gain and the camera is adding 200 pounds so it's really not fair to judge.

Good point. Every fashion conscious woman knows what she wears can influence her BSC. LOL

 

[Boot Jack Bulls]

That collar accentuates her weight gain and the camera is adding 200 pounds so it's really not fair to judge.

:lol: said every 20 something female on social media....

 

[CattleMan1920]

That collar accentuates her weight gain and the camera is adding 200 pounds so it's really not fair to judge.

Good point. Every fashion conscious woman knows what she wears can influence her BSC. LOL

She gave us such a beautiful calf that we are going to upgrade mommas collar with rhinestones.

 

[CattleMan1920]

So what was the bulges at her tail head and brisket?

Baby fat. LOL!

That is Pure Alpha's 1/2 sister

She's nice, I had cows like that 5 years ago....and definitely miss looking at them.

Thank you TG

 

[CattleMan1920]

So what was the bulges at her tail head and brisket?

I could see the outline of her pelvis. Udder was not fatty. I didn't see an overly fat brisket. There were some fat patches around the tail head. Maybe between a 6 and 7.

Her udder is not fat because she is NURSING! I'm sorry, but that cow is over-conditioned. She has a fat brisket, her tail head is drowning in pone fat and she has rolls behind her shoulders. :deadhorse: She's too stale for a show ring, and that's saying something.

The fact is, some like their cattle to carry more or less condition than other breeders do. I won't preach on who is right (what do I know?), but I absolutely can't stand when people try to tell me (or others) that a fat cow is isn't fat or a skinny cow isn't skinny. When it is an fairly extreme case, there isn't much room left for speculation....

Wait till you see how her calf turns out.

I could care less about the show ring. What matters to me is how they function. That heifer settled with sexed semen first try, calved a big, healthy female with no assistance, and will be ready to breed back in about 75-90 days. She has excellent feet, her back is VERY straight, she isn't washed, combed and pampered, she's a real functioning female. Best of all, I bet she makes it to 14 years old and is still producing.

If that doesn't cut the mustard, oh well....

I've had a person approach me to show one of our President daughters, I declined. The show circuit seems too myopic, focusing on things that have nothing to do with anything other than vanity. She told me that the competition is fierce, and not in a pleasant way.

Put some show winners out on our place or Ron's for a year and see how they fare, especially after the past winter we had. They will look like a bunch of hung over sorority gals the morning after a homecoming party.

 

[Bright Raven]

I could see the outline of her pelvis. Udder was not fatty. I didn't see an overly fat brisket. There were some fat patches around the tail head. Maybe between a 6 and 7.

Her udder is not fat because she is NURSING! I'm sorry, but that cow is over-conditioned. She has a fat brisket, her tail head is drowning in pone fat and she has rolls behind her shoulders. :deadhorse: She's too stale for a show ring, and that's saying something.

The fact is, some like their cattle to carry more or less condition than other breeders do. I won't preach on who is right (what do I know?), but I absolutely can't stand when people try to tell me (or others) that a fat cow is isn't fat or a skinny cow isn't skinny. When it is an fairly extreme case, there isn't much room left for speculation....

Wait till you see how her calf turns out.

I could care less about the show ring. What matters to me is how they function. That heifer settled with sexed semen first try, calved a big, healthy female with no assistance, and will be ready to breed back in about 75-90 days. She has excellent feet, her back is VERY straight, she isn't washed, combed and pampered, she's a real functioning female. Best of all, I bet she makes it to 14 years old and is still producing.

If that doesn't cut the mustard, oh well....

I've had a person approach me to show one of our President daughters, I declined. The show circuit seems too myopic, focusing on things that have nothing to do with anything other than vanity. She told me that the competition is fierce, and not in a pleasant way.

Put some show winners out on our place or Ron's for a year and see how they fare, especially after the past winter we had. They will look like a bunch of hung over sorority gals the morning after a homecoming party.

James, James, James

You cut me deeply! :shock:

I have about 6 exshow girls in my herd. I heard all that malarkey that they would fail in a normal pasture environment. Guess what, they hold more condition than the other cows that did not come up through the show ranks. In fact, my three cows that have a BSC of 8 are all exshow girls. I personally don't believe that show stock is any less fit for the pasture than anything else. And all my cows are treated the same.

 

[Boot Jack Bulls]

Branded, I have several that have hung respected banners that are still working well into their teens. I only made the show ring comment as a reference to the common mis-conception that all show cattle are fat. You cannot fairly assess how show cows work in your herd if you have never put any of them on the tan bark.

The fact is, I couldn't care less how her calf turns out. I don't intend to buy it, so the point is rather moot.... You posted a female, and there was discussion on her BCS. I joined in that discussion. If you do not like people doing so, do not post them.

 

[CattleMan1920]

Her udder is not fat because she is NURSING! I'm sorry, but that cow is over-conditioned. She has a fat brisket, her tail head is drowning in pone fat and she has rolls behind her shoulders. :deadhorse: She's too stale for a show ring, and that's saying something.

The fact is, some like their cattle to carry more or less condition than other breeders do. I won't preach on who is right (what do I know?), but I absolutely can't stand when people try to tell me (or others) that a fat cow is isn't fat or a skinny cow isn't skinny. When it is an fairly extreme case, there isn't much room left for speculation....

Wait till you see how her calf turns out.

I could care less about the show ring. What matters to me is how they function. That heifer settled with sexed semen first try, calved a big, healthy female with no assistance, and will be ready to breed back in about 75-90 days. She has excellent feet, her back is VERY straight, she isn't washed, combed and pampered, she's a real functioning female. Best of all, I bet she makes it to 14 years old and is still producing.

If that doesn't cut the mustard, oh well....

I've had a person approach me to show one of our President daughters, I declined. The show circuit seems too myopic, focusing on things that have nothing to do with anything other than vanity. She told me that the competition is fierce, and not in a pleasant way.

Put some show winners out on our place or Ron's for a year and see how they fare, especially after the past winter we had. They will look like a bunch of hung over sorority gals the morning after a homecoming party.

James, James, James

You cut me deeply! :shock:

I have about 6 exshow girls in my herd. I heard all that malarkey that they would fail in a normal pasture environment. Guess what, they hold more condition than the other cows that did not come up through the show ranks. In fact, my three cows that have a BSC of 8 are all exshow girls. I personally don't believe that show stock is any less fit for the pasture than anything else. And all my cows are treated the same.

But you baby your gals Ron!

 

[Bright Raven]

Wait till you see how her calf turns out.

I could care less about the show ring. What matters to me is how they function. That heifer settled with sexed semen first try, calved a big, healthy female with no assistance, and will be ready to breed back in about 75-90 days. She has excellent feet, her back is VERY straight, she isn't washed, combed and pampered, she's a real functioning female. Best of all, I bet she makes it to 14 years old and is still producing.

If that doesn't cut the mustard, oh well....

I've had a person approach me to show one of our President daughters, I declined. The show circuit seems too myopic, focusing on things that have nothing to do with anything other than vanity. She told me that the competition is fierce, and not in a pleasant way.

Put some show winners out on our place or Ron's for a year and see how they fare, especially after the past winter we had. They will look like a bunch of hung over sorority gals the morning after a homecoming party.

James, James, James

You cut me deeply! :shock:

I have about 6 exshow girls in my herd. I heard all that malarkey that they would fail in a normal pasture environment. Guess what, they hold more condition than the other cows that did not come up through the show ranks. In fact, my three cows that have a BSC of 8 are all exshow girls. I personally don't believe that show stock is any less fit for the pasture than anything else. And all my cows are treated the same.

But you baby your gals Ron!

I treat my cows well. I am a good Shepard but they live outside 365 days a year. No shelter. The hills are steep and muddy much of the year. Damp cold. Then humid heat. Those exshow girls stay fat.

 

[Dave]

I have said it before. Bring some of those over conditioned cows up here we will put them on a better diet plan than Jenny Craig. There is room on the one BLM allotment for another 30 cows. Hopefully they aren't too over weight because we will have to start out trailing them up a steep hill for a couple miles and it is about 3 or 4 miles to the gate they need to go through.

I'm putting together a group of candidates to breed to America, and the bull calves that I get out of them could end up at the Midland test, so we will see if they are worth anything in a hurry.

That's what I'm talking about, I hope your bulls do great and think they will. You need to put a creep feeder in with them asap so they learn how to eat out of a trough. The only problem you'll have is if the folks that buy the bulls use them on range. Charlo doesn't move well and it didn't look like America was any better. We'll see.

There is a huge difference between how much weight they gain in a feed test program and how well they preform chasing cows on habitat shared with Bighorn sheep where it is 2 or 3 miles between water holes.

 

[Jeanne - Simme Valley]

"You can be sure I'm not using that SAV America semen on infertile cattle. I don't burn money like that."

I looked up his semen expense. 40M for $40. That is CHEAP!!!

My cattle are not pampered, and a good majority of them have been shown and quite successfully.

 

[Dave]

"You can be sure I'm not using that SAV America semen on infertile cattle. I don't burn money like that."

Why would you even keep anything that you would describe as "infertile cattle"? And if you do I sure wouldn't trust enough to buy any cattle from you.

 

[Jeanne - Simme Valley]

Dave - I think you misunderstood BH - he was saying his cattle ARE fertile so he is able to use expensive semen.
I just questioned why a PB breeder would consider $40 as being expensive semen - especially when it's guaranteed 40M sperm count. Is that super high for Angus semen? How much is the certificate? We (Simmental) don't have certificates. You buy semen and everything is eligible to register.

 

[Dave]

Dave - I think you misunderstood BH - he was saying his cattle ARE fertile so he is able to use expensive semen.
I just questioned why a PB breeder would consider $40 as being expensive semen - especially when it's guaranteed 40M sperm count. Is that super high for Angus semen? How much is the certificate? We (Simmental) don't have certificates. You buy semen and everything is eligible to register.

I just saw what you had quoted so I took it out of context. I didn't have the time to go back and read every word he wrote. I just looked in the 2018 Select Sires catalog. Literally every single Angus was $40 with a certificate. There was one Hereford that was $75.