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Fire Sweep Ranch

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We have an angus heifer, sired by Pioneer, that we bought as a pair two years ago out of an OK dispersal sale. The dam was a TC Freedom cow, and a frame 6, so VERY BIG compared to most of our other cattle. We shipped the dam after weaning the calf, and got what we paid for her. The heifer calf was shown a few times, fed well, and never got very big (she is lucky if she is a 5 frame). We are OK with that! She did not lose her hair this summer (as a bred heifer), so I shaved her because we was always laying in the wet spots and panting (suspect fescue is the problem). We was AI'd to the calving ease sire Beef Maker, a purebred simmental. She has since grown back at least two inches of hair (in just a few months, and it is still hot out here), and still hangs out in the wet cool spots (usually where water is standing around the water trough). She calved last night, a whopping 49 pound heifer calf (weighed AFTER we fed her), at 283 days gestation (no bull exposure). She calved right before 11 (we watched it, the dam actually got up when the heifer was not all the way out, and ran 50 feet to the corner, where the calf fell out and hit the ground). We made sure the calf was breathing, and watched for 30 minutes to see her stand and suck. Dam licked the calf, and seemed to attach to her. We decide to get some sleep and check the heifer at 1AM to see if she stood and sucked. Went out, calf was still in the same spot, same position, still had her soft pads on her feet (so had not stood). I went in and helped her up, but the dam would not get near us when I was near the calf (to get her to suck), so we moved both to the barn under lights in a smaller pen. We tied the heifer to the panel, and I got the calf up to the udder, she will not suck. I tried squirting colostrum on her nose, and to my surprise dam has a thick, dark blood colored fluid instead of milk. I tried all 4 quarters, and all were the same. Not sure what to do, I decided to defrost my frozen colostrum (calf is now 3 hours old and no food in her belly yet) and tube the calf so we can get to bed. I gave the calf a tube of Nuresmate ASAP, tubed her, and stripped the heifer dry (which she still has a rather hard udder, but I can not get anything out but the dark blood colored thick stuff, about 8 ounces worth). The calf was up this morning, on the other side of the fence. But no signs of sucking on dam. I called the vet office at 7:45 (they open at 8, thankfully someone answered!). Talked with vet, he said dam will probably never have milk, maybe had mastitis as a heifer. He told me if we wanted this to work, to keep stripping the heifer for 48 hours to see if she comes into her milk, but we likely have a bottle baby. We have NEVER had a bottle baby! We tried to give the calf a half bottle of colostrum this morning, and she would not suck. We ended up tubing her. Vet said to give her lots of little meals, because she is so small her tummy can not handle a full bottle, and she needs to be fed often.
So, why wont the calf suck? She stands and walks around, but acts like she is not hungry (maybe she is not?). What is the likely hood this first calf heifer will have milk? My thinking is because of her small size and hair, she is a fescue cow and thus she did not feed the baby enough in utero and that is why the calf is so small. But I don't know! We have cows that we suspect are borderline fescue cows, but they have normal calves and can raise them! They just do not shed out all the way in the winter, or are always in the shade.
So what can we do differently? How can we get this calf to suck more aggressively? She will lightly suck on your fingers, but when we put the nipple in her mouth she just rolls it around and spits it out.
Any helpful advice would be appreciated! You don't need to tell me to ship the heifer, because we are pretty sure that will be the end result. My concern is the calf, and how long do we keep trying on the heifer.
 
little calf so get a horse nipple. Open the hole on the end a little plug the vent hole on the nipple( tooth pick will work just break it off on the outside so its about 1/8" long) get the calf to suck finger and slide the nipple in. you can squeeze the bottle some and get it in her mouth and it wont drown her with the vent plugged. some are just slow. bottle calves will make you cuss sometimes
 
Have you tried stimu-lyx to help with the fescue? They have a stimulyx fescue relief i had good luck with.
 
are you selinium deficient in your area? sometimes that will cause ones that won't/can't/don't suck. we had it bad in lambs a couple of years ago with ewes we bought in OK and moved to Iowa. additionally i know a breeder i know had bad issues with this a couple of years ago both of us now hits every new baby with Bose.
 
Ok, thanks for the tips. I have not been able to get to the farm store to look for a horse nipple, but plan on it tomorrow. Today is my teaching day, so I was at the college all day, an hour away, and put my daughter in charge. She is the one that works at the dairy helping care for calves in the evening and AI's their cattle. Anyway, this morning she tried to get the calf to suck this morning, half bottle colostrum, but ended up tubing her because she would not suck. At 2:30, she came home and tried again. Again, no suck from the calf. She said the calf tried a few times and then refused. She did not tube her. I called the vet on the way home, and asked for advice. He said do not tube her tonight, but offer her the bottle again. She acts like she is not hungry, so maybe she is sucking her dam and getting something (yuck). He said if she did not try to suck the bottle by the morning, to call him again. Tonight, I went down and got her up (she is so tiny!). I tied her dam up and milked her out. The "milk" was not as dark, nor as thick, and I would almost say it had some white in it, like she might be clearing out (wishful thinking, I know). I got maybe 6 ounces when I stripped her. Her nipples were clean, and her udder is dirty (they are on a dirt floor in a small pen), so I am not sure if that is because the calf is sucking? Or she did not get them dirty when she layed down? I plan on watching her closely over the next few hours, and trying a bottle again tonight before bed, along with stripping the dam of any milk in her udder. I hate this tenuous time of not being sure if the calf is getting what she needs to survive! Scary.
Oh, and I do not think we are selenium deficient, but I will ask the vet tomorrow. I have never had to treat for it before, so I am not sure. We just switched to vita ferm concept aide last week, so nothing helpful there.
Never tried Stimulyx, never heard of it. This is the first time I have thought the fescue might be the cause of something, since we ship what ever does not conceive and raise a calf. Fescue cows usually come in open and are difficult to breed.
I'll keep you all posted. I'll try to remember to bring my camera down to the barn tonight to take a picture of her tinyness.
Thanks for all the help and suggestions so far... Lord willing she will make it through this!
 
If it's bloody milk and not mastitis it should gradually clear over the next few days... hopefully that's it.
 
Well, good news! At least, I hope. I went to strip the cow tonight, and her milk was mostly white, with a little brown. Like very light chocolate milk! And she had a bunch of it, not just a few squirts from each teat. So it looks like the heifer IS able to produce milk. The calf once again refused the bottle, and my daughter tried the entire time I was milking the cow. So, we are pretty sure she is eating something, because she was strong and fought her most of the time. Bright eyed, but one eye is a little swollen (like she got bumped).
Here is a pic of my daughter holding her tonight (my daughter is skinny, maybe 5'7", so the calf is very little). She pulled her out of the pen to try to feed her, since the cow seems to charge her (but not me, go figure!).
taylor_day_old.jpg

And a pic of the heifer in with her dam. Her dam would be lucky if she weighs 1000 pounds. I might weigh her tomorrow to see. Notice her long, not slick, coat?
taylor_and_dee.jpg

My daughter is calling the calf Taylor, since she was born on 9/11 and Taylor is the name of a victim my daughter said.
So now, we wait? I will call the vet again in the morning, and see what he recommends. Good thing he does not charge for phone calls!!!
Oh, and dam has been tested for BVD, but not the calf obviously. Not likely though, since we only showed her twice, before she was bred (she was just weaned off the cow herself).
 
OK, that is good to know. It is just one of those things that pops up in my mind when you get a dinky calf like that and one that has issues too.
 
Too bad you don't have a camera set up to see what is happening when you guys aren't watching.
Tiny little fart!!
Hope all goes well, just keep trying.
Two winters ago we had a struggle with a calf for about 3 weeks, hopefully yours won't be much longer, keep us updated.
 
I grew up on a dairy farm that liquidated when I was 10 yrs old, milked my grandmothers cows for 2 more years so am no expert. Have a few hobby 4H cows now. But, I do remember many fresh heifers have milk/colostrum that you described. Bloody in color. Not sure if from swelling or what, but I always remember it clearing up. When I first saw it I asked my Dad and he said its colostrum, not milk, so often red or yellow in color. Sounds like nature taking over when your not around, good luck!
 
Well, she would not suck this morning, but would suck a finger. So I called the vet, he advised getting a small nipple and he would be out at 9:30 to check on them. The local store did not have a horse nipple, but had a lamb nipple and gave me an old dr pepper bottle to put it on. Lamb nipples are SMALL! Vet got here, checked the cow, and said let's try. We locked the dam in the chute to keep her still (she was very good, and did not move once she figured out what we were doing). Doc took ahold of that calf's head and forced her up in the udder. He got her sucking on his finger and basically popped her over to the nipple. After about 10 minutes of her not figuring it out, and us putting her back on a nipple, we just backed up and watched. She worked under that dam for more than 20 minutes by herself, searching and looking for any nipple. Once she figured it out, she sucked the dam dry! Doc said to offer her the bottle after the dam was dry, and the calf jumped right on the lamb nipple and drained the bottle! So I guess she figured out she was hungry :nod:
Now we just have to watch her closely. Doc was pretty sure she had not sucked on the dam before that point, by her confusion and lack of ability to actually latch on. She was basically surviving on the bottle of colostrum we tubbed in her twice before. The dams milk is still brown, but not like it was before. Before it was like chocolate syrup you put in your milk to make chocolate milk!
Now back down there for the noon check and attempted feeding :wave:
 
Fire Sweep Ranch":2dd844nb said:
Well, she would not suck this morning, but would suck a finger. So I called the vet, he advised getting a small nipple and he would be out at 9:30 to check on them. The local store did not have a horse nipple, but had a lamb nipple and gave me an old dr pepper bottle to put it on. Lamb nipples are SMALL! Vet got here, checked the cow, and said let's try. We locked the dam in the chute to keep her still (she was very good, and did not move once she figured out what we were doing). Doc took ahold of that calf's head and forced her up in the udder. He got her sucking on his finger and basically popped her over to the nipple. After about 10 minutes of her not figuring it out, and us putting her back on a nipple, we just backed up and watched. She worked under that dam for more than 20 minutes by herself, searching and looking for any nipple. Once she figured it out, she sucked the dam dry! Doc said to offer her the bottle after the dam was dry, and the calf jumped right on the lamb nipple and drained the bottle! So I guess she figured out she was hungry :nod:
Now we just have to watch her closely. Doc was pretty sure she had not sucked on the dam before that point, by her confusion and lack of ability to actually latch on. She was basically surviving on the bottle of colostrum we tubbed in her twice before. The dams milk is still brown, but not like it was before. Before it was like chocolate syrup you put in your milk to make chocolate milk!
Now back down there for the noon check and attempted feeding :wave:
Sounds like you may keep the dam after all...I think that calf was just being dumb.
 
Taurus, I agree! She nursed at 6 PM with some guidance, and just now we went down again and the calf needed a little guidance to show her where the location was and she latched on and went to town for 20 minutes. Drained the dam clean dry!!! Now of she can just do this without human intervention, they can go out to pasture with the rest. I think she is a special needs child :lol:
 
glacierridge":32gzh20x said:
Yeah...
Sometimes we get a dummy calf too...
They are annoying to deal with but what can you do?
At least if they smarten up quick it's not as bad.

I think she might be there ;-)
We got up late this morning, our pastor was over for dinner (served him some our our good t-bone steaks from the steer that graded choice) and we got to bed late. We went down to check on her around 8 AM, got her up, guided her to the udder. She played around for a few minutes, then went and laid back down. So I checked the dam, and she was just about dry, just a squirt or two in each quarter. So I am thinking she got up before us and helped herself. She did not seem hungry, and the udder empty... :nod:
We will watch her closely. I think I will try a half bottle of milk on her to make sure.
 
I wonder how much preemie calves are like preemie babies? Our son was born 2 mos early and at that stage they are basically still a fetus, developmentally. They often can't manage to breathe, eat and keep their heart rate up at the same time. It's just too overwhelming for their little systems....maybe some of these preemie calves have the same type of problems. It would kinda make sense, no?
 
Boondocks, I agree. But that was the confusing part, this calf was full term. But everything about her; her size, her lack of ability to feed herself, says she was a preemie.
But an update: she was let out of the barn yesterday after church, and by nightfall her and her dam were at the back of the pasture. I worried (needlessly, I know) that something would happen last night to her since she is so small she will slip under the poly wire and not get shocked, but be in another section of pasture without protection. But all was well this morning, and she got up while I was checking cows and ran right to her dam and started nursing. Gave me joy :)
I think she will be OK.
 
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