My stocking rate

[Bigfoot]

I've got my stocking rate to a cow to every 1.25 acres. Let some rented land go last year, and meant to do a big hard cull. I never got around to it. Going good so far, but the first dry year gonna take a toll. I think I'll just play around, and see how high I can go.

Not doing anything spectacular, here's the formula:
1. 4 rotations, stay on a field an average of 12 days
2. Healthy dose of 2 four D when the spring weeds come
3. I will hit the summer weeds if they present a problem, but haven't in a few years (that dose would be grazon next)
4. Unroll hay at about 18 pounds per cow (end of October till the green up)
5. Sow about 25% of my pasture in bin run wheat in the fall
6. Try to never clip/shred/bushhog pasture.
7. Hadn't fertilized in a great long while. Fertilize hay ground, but not pasture.
8. About all my fescue is gone. This is pretty much happening on crabgrass.

I'm very seriously considering cutting the next rotation they head to here in a few days for hay. It's so thick/tall I believe they'll waste much of it.

Just sharin

 

[kenny thomas]

Your doing great. But can you cull a little and stockpile fescue and not feed so many months. I'm still not sure where the break even on stockpile vs hay is but I hate feeding hay so my numbers may be lower than I could get by with

 

[Caustic Burno]

I've got my stocking rate to a cow to every 1.25 acres. Let some rented land go last year, and meant to do a big hard cull. I never got around to it. Going good so far, but the first dry year gonna take a toll. I think I'll just play around, and see how high I can go.

Not doing anything spectacular, here's the formula:
1. 4 rotations, stay on a field an average of 12 days
2. Healthy dose of 2 four D when the spring weeds come
3. I will hit the summer weeds if they present a problem, but haven't in a few years (that dose would be grazon next)
4. Unroll hay at about 18 pounds per cow (end of October till the green up)
5. Sow about 25% of my pasture in bin run wheat in the fall
6. Try to never clip/shred/bushhog pasture.
7. Hadn't fertilized in a great long while. Fertilize hay ground, but not pasture.
8. About all my fescue is gone. This is pretty much happening on crabgrass.

I'm very seriously considering cutting the next rotation they head to here in a few days for hay. It's so thick/tall I believe they'll waste much of it.

Just sharin

I ran a pair per acre for years until 2011. Seventy percent reduction for that drought to save the pasture.
There is always a cost, if the grass looks greener on the other side you can bet the fertilizer and water bill are higher.

 

[Bigfoot]

Your doing great. But can you cull a little and stockpile fescue and not feed so many months. I'm still not sure where the break even on stockpile vs hay is but I hate feeding hay so my numbers may be lower than I could get by with

It could probably be done. I scored a couple places close to me, to make hay. One is on the 3rds and the other is all free. In that situation, I'd rather bring the hay in. Unrolling is better than I thought it would be at building my ground up.

 

[kenny thomas]

Your doing great. But can you cull a little and stockpile fescue and not feed so many months. I'm still not sure where the break even on stockpile vs hay is but I hate feeding hay so my numbers may be lower than I could get by with

It could probably be done. I scored a couple places close to me, to make hay. One is on the 3rds and the other is all free. In that situation, I'd rather bring the hay in. Unrolling is better than I thought it would be at building my ground up.

Totally understand that part. Any good hay brought in is a plus.

 

[Bigfoot]

I've got my stocking rate to a cow to every 1.25 acres. Let some rented land go last year, and meant to do a big hard cull. I never got around to it. Going good so far, but the first dry year gonna take a toll. I think I'll just play around, and see how high I can go.

Not doing anything spectacular, here's the formula:
1. 4 rotations, stay on a field an average of 12 days
2. Healthy dose of 2 four D when the spring weeds come
3. I will hit the summer weeds if they present a problem, but haven't in a few years (that dose would be grazon next)
4. Unroll hay at about 18 pounds per cow (end of October till the green up)
5. Sow about 25% of my pasture in bin run wheat in the fall
6. Try to never clip/shred/bushhog pasture.
7. Hadn't fertilized in a great long while. Fertilize hay ground, but not pasture.
8. About all my fescue is gone. This is pretty much happening on crabgrass.

I'm very seriously considering cutting the next rotation they head to here in a few days for hay. It's so thick/tall I believe they'll waste much of it.

Just sharin

I ran a pair per acre for years until 2011. Seventy percent reduction for that drought to save the pasture.
There is always a cost, if the grass looks greener on the other side you can bet the fertilizer and water bill are higher.

Yeah, I'll get hammered if the rain ever shuts off. I never set out to graze that tight. I just kept seeing heifers i liked and put of culling.

 

[Caustic Burno]

I got away with it for decades.
Fertilizer on the other hand was less than 200 a ton as well.
I sold registered cattle for kill prices,it's part of the game.
Lost my first cows to the Bangs eradication program in the 70's.
Nothing like watching a 300 dollar cow with a B branded on her jaw bringing a nickel a pound.

 

[kenny thomas]

I got away with it for decades.
Fertilizer on the other hand was less than 200 a ton as well.
I sold registered cattle for kill prices,it's part of the game.
Lost my first cows to the Bangs eradication program in the 70's.
Nothing like watching a 300 dollar cow with a B branded on her jaw bringing a nickel a pound.

I know that feeling CB. And wasn't able to buy back for a while either.

 

[Bigfoot]

I got away with it for decades.
Fertilizer on the other hand was less than 200 a ton as well.
I sold registered cattle for kill prices,it's part of the game.
Lost my first cows to the Bangs eradication program in the 70's.
Nothing like watching a 300 dollar cow with a B branded on her jaw bringing a nickel a pound.

My grandfather banged out during that era. Never was able to build back.

 

[kenny thomas]

Bigfoot, are you drilling the wheat?

 

[Stocker Steve]

Stocked that heavy in 2014 as an experiment. Late turn out, two N applications, and rain was required. With current beef and hay prices - - the lower the cow stocking rate the higher the gross margin. :shock:

Currently, using cows to increase Ca, K, and P levels, and then producing alfalfa for sale, is the most profitable on paper here.

 

[bball]

Stocked that heavy in 2014 as an experiment. Late turn out, two N applications, and rain was required. With current beef and hay prices - - the lower the cow stocking rate the higher the gross margin. :shock:

Currently, using cows to increase Ca, K, and P levels, and then producing alfalfa for sale, is the most profitable on paper here.

MIG?

 

[bball]

The reason I ask Steve, I have some marginal sandier soil types and have been kicking around inexpensive ways to add some bio matter to the soil. Chicken manure is too costly, hog guys wont give up any. Was considering contacting the local septic pumpers and inquiring about tilling the effluent into the soil, but recall seeing it done in upstate NY...way too much plastic, feminine hygiene products, prophylactic's and syringes to a be viable option. I have read multiple testimonies about MIG improving soil and pasture quality. Any personal insights?

 

[Stocker Steve]

Yes. You can haul OM in or you can grow it. All the land I have come up was mined out to some extent, and I am an optimizer, so I have tried a number of approaches. In chronological order:

1) Classic MIG - - Lime, early spring 40# acre N app, and short 21 to 28 day rotations. OM went up about 0.1% per year. Too slow for me. Would be OK on rented ground.
2) Purchase salts - - Lime, turkey litter to meet P target and granules to meet K target. Too expensive for me. Some corn farmers are doing this now to reduce losses.
3) Bringing in bale grazing hay - - Works fast but makes quite a mess if you don't have very high quality hay. Unrolling would be better if you have the time and the climate. Takes K to about 240 ppm and P to about 48 ppm in 18 months. OM is hard to measure due to all the litter but an increase of 1.0 % per year is doable short term. Too easy for me.
4) Grow annuals as part of a complicated biological rotation - - Struggled with this because I am too cheap to buy a good no till drill. This, with bale grazing as part of the rotation, and wet (not frost) seeding is the bomb here.
5) Graze tall - - High grazing density and low grazing utilization results in a lot of dry matter and roots going back to the soil. Some of the current national "experts" recommend this for everyone. Not a total solution with my climate. Snow gets too deep and winters are too long. Midsouth data shows OM going up a couple tenths per year for 5 to 7 years.

 

[Bigfoot]

Bigfoot, are you drilling the wheat?

Naw I just broadcast it on top of the ground it always looks like 100% germination.

 

[Banjo]

You can do 1:1 in the summer most of the time if you have plenty of moisture. Will the extra cattle pay for the 5 months worth of hay? i don't know. maybe. Grazing pastures short continuously will eventually kill out your fescue leaving you no winter grazing. Ky 31 tall fescue is called "tall" for a reason.
The best thing you could do is to start where your at with the 4 rotations, cut each one in half making 8 and then as you get more comfortable/confident cut those 8 in half.... then you have 16 at 2 days each which will give you 32 days. my 2 cents

 

[Bigfoot]

You can do 1:1 in the summer most of the time if you have plenty of moisture. Will the extra cattle pay for the 5 months worth of hay? i don't know. maybe. Grazing pastures short continuously will eventually kill out your fescue leaving you no winter grazing. Ky 31 tall fescue is called "tall" for a reason.
The best thing you could do is to start where your at with the 4 rotations, cut each one in half making 8 and then as you get more comfortable/confident cut those 8 in half.... then you have 16 at 2 days each which will give you 32 days. my 2 cents

Thats good advice.

 

[kenny thomas]

Bigfoot, are you drilling the wheat?

Naw I just broadcast it on top of the ground it always looks like 100% germination.

When do you spread it?

 

[Bigfoot]

Bigfoot, are you drilling the wheat?

Naw I just broadcast it on top of the ground it always looks like 100% germination.

When do you spread it?

I probably plant too early (but I'm not making a crop, just grazing). I like it spread by end of September. Used to wait till it was calling for rain. I have found it can lay there nd wait for rain. I just go to the elevator and get bin run wheat. Plant about 100-120 pounds to the acre. I have a 500 pound cone spreader. The kids have talked me into renting a buggy this year. Partially to avoid shoveling the stuff, and partially because I'm doing more acres. I'll just have the buggy filled. Not sure it really saves much. My experience is that last 3 weeks of hay feeding when you wish you could stop, but spring just ain't there.......I can open up my wheat pasture, and the cows just quit coming to hay. I have also put up a creep gate, so fall calves could have access all the time. I wouldn't swear weaning weights were improved by that though. I have also bout quit fall calving. Still have a few every year, but it's a cow that got out of cycle. Cow leaves in the spring when the calf is weaned, so I don't fool with that, for no more fall calves than I have.

 

[kenny thomas]

I spread urea always on Labor day weekend to stockpile. Wonder what it would do if I spread that early.