Leasing land to run cattle
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Mrcopier
Well-known member
First you have to find some, which is very hard to find in E Texas
callmefence
Keyboard cowboy
Since they've started cracking down on the property tax cheaters we've been overwhelmed with people wanting us to get cattle on their place. Used to be really hard to get.
Now we pretty much pick and choose. And smaller places under 100 acres we can generally get for next to nothing.
Reputation does play a big part. People don't want someone who tries to recreate on a place or take it over.
Just run some cattle across it, maybe spray some weeds.
Picked up a place recently that the previous guy kept taking his buddies fishing and arrowhead hunting on a grazing lease.... don't work that way...
The first rule to pretty much any negotiation is you have to be able to walk away.
I see a lot of land get leased at prices that are not profitable. I will take one good lessor with a place I can make a few bucks on over 2, 5, 10 marginal places with PIA owners. Too many people want cattle... not a business that can make money.
I see a lot of land get leased at prices that are not profitable. I will take one good lessor with a place I can make a few bucks on over 2, 5, 10 marginal places with PIA owners. Too many people want cattle... not a business that can make money.
gruncattle
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I recently leased two separate tracts in East Texas. First, many from the city bought land during the pandemic. They are open to win/win partnerships. A win on their side is land improvement (getting rid of broad leaves, keeping grass mowed, etc.). If you approach someone with a plan that includes spraying and rotational grazing, your chances of success are good. I went 2 for 2. However, that is investment and you'll want a multi-year lease to justify it. I had to write one as even the local extension office couldn't produce a decent lease agreement. Reach out to me if you want a copy.
I use a similar method and run in to the same thing. For people who dont live there every day offering to keep an eye on things, putting them in contact with good local contractors, and just being kind of helpful goes a long way.
Workinonit Farm
Well-known member
On Tuesday 'Beef Daily' had an interesting, and somewhat helpful, article on this subject of leasing land & lease agreements, tips & suggestions etc.. Maybe there's something helpful there for you.
www.beefmagazine.com/beef-daily Look for the article, dated August 24 2021, by Amanda Radke "Structuring Your Lease Agreements".
www.beefmagazine.com/beef-daily Look for the article, dated August 24 2021, by Amanda Radke "Structuring Your Lease Agreements".
greybeard
Well-known member
For me, that is a must but has to apply to both parties. Lessee and lessor.
it's hard to 'make money' on a small lease and my county is currently requesting (they can't require it ) that the landowner submit how much per/ac or per/head they are receiving.
TAMU (Tx Agrilife) recommended min rate for cash lease in my county is about $9.30/ac per year for native grassland.
UnshodFilly
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Texas Ag Law has some good examples of leases, as well as great information for farmers, ranchers and landowners.
* not a paid endorsement and no affiliation
unhsod filly - still roaming my own range
* not a paid endorsement and no affiliation
unhsod filly - still roaming my own range
Curious if there is a digital marketplace for listing land open to lease for grazing, as well as, those seeking to lease. If anyone knows of such please post a link.
Researching this may build it depending upon findings.
My view for what it is worth, is that the driving factor for pricing has to be ROI for the producers. Duration of lease and renewal at producers discretion significantly impact the viability and price of a lease.
Researching this may build it depending upon findings.
My view for what it is worth, is that the driving factor for pricing has to be ROI for the producers. Duration of lease and renewal at producers discretion significantly impact the viability and price of a lease.
You would think that based off of supply and demand principals but it does not work like that here. Some people lease land at prices that does not work unless they bleed the land dry. They barely shred it any thing. The bleed them dry and then dump them to the land owner pretty much unusable.
I'm attempting to lease a place from my own family right now. We run cattle and another uncle runs cattle, 3 other family members are not involved in cattle. The other uncle use to have it leased but does not want to any more. He is up in age and has let every thing get run down.
The rest of the family comes to me to lease it. I have to sit down and show them the hard truth about what it will lease for in that condition. I bring my numbers, show them why I need a long term lease, why the annual rent is what it is, explain why things are written in the lease to cover both them and me, etc. Rememeber my mother is an owner also who is talking about turning it over to us any day so I wrote it to cover both sides in case I dont lease it we have a format for the next potential lessee.
The uncle who had it leased is fighting every one at every turn. He has not logic or number to back any thing. All he can say is no one leases like that. He brought out 3 leases he has that are trash, and only 2 are active. He is losing money on one for sure and the other only works by trashing the place out like he did ours. I brought out 5 active that looked almost identical to the one I provided, and said I could provide more upon request. Most of my family have been to all those places, they know how good they look, that's why they asked me.
All my uncle did was shoot himself in the foot and show how bad he is as making these leases and managing money as a whole. He has subsidized losing money on cattle with another job and inheritance. He likes to drive around in his dually with his cattle trailer and talk cattle though.
He is the exact problem that you will run in to leasing around here... all hat... no calculator.
I will say the tide is turning slowly IMO. More people are buying or inheriting property that are more informed and care more about the management of it, not just a check. The is to the quality lessee's advantage IMO.
greybeard
Well-known member
I see a bit of that around here, with the lessee thinking he's providing the landowner with the tax exemption plus lease payment' so he can use it till it's a dried up shell of a land worth far less than what it was when he signed the lease. In other words, thinks he's already doing the landowner a big enough favor just by leasing from him.
Those days are ending fast tho.
1982vett
Well-known member
Wow…sounds cheap. Does it even cover property tax?
greybeard
Well-known member
no.
Sounds too cheap to me too....but if there isn't any fencing on that 100 acre native grassland for $950./year lease....yeah i could see that price with no infrastructure and chock full of large 30-foot diameter Eastern Cedars. We're viewing it from 5 strand barb-wire, gates, old barn, corral standing and WATER ponds present...that's not going to be the case.
You would have to know his stocking rate to know if it's too high or too low. A pair to 3ac and it's cheap. A pair to 20ac and it's still too high.
greybeard
Well-known member
Most years, here in this county of often, "too much rain" you can run a pair per 2 1/2 acres.
