Kudzu

[KNERSIE]

Does anyone have experience with/ seen calves out of or any other thoughs regarding this bull?

TRM2128 37E 121 Kudzu 4066
reg no 42516592

Does anyone have any idea of frame size, homo/heterozygous polled, or any thoughts on his pedigree?

 

[cjpherford3]

he is a good looking bull and i have talked to randa about the bull his calves are light weight at birth. but his semen cost is 30 dollars per straw and i hate paying that much for an unproven bull. cj

 

[THG]

I am staying far away from him, because old 121 was known for prolapse on some of his daughters. Doug Gerber even told me and another VA hereford breeder to stay away from Phase 121.

THG

 

[Alan]

The Oregon State Hereford Associtaion was more than promoting him (in my eyes anyway) at the last sale I was at in the spring (maybe just not geting the price on his semen they wanted). To me it seemed they were pushing him hard. Like someone said earlier, it was hard to pay the price per straw for an unproven bull.

THG,

I did a quick pedigree search and didn't run into any Vindicator lines. Is this were you are getting the prolasp history from or elsewhere? I'm serious and would like to know.

Alan

 

[oakcreekfarms]

I believe he is referring to his sire Alan

 

[Alan]

I believe he is referring to his sire Alan

If you are referring to the 121 bull, that is the bull I had a question on for Matt. I may not have been clear on it. But I was wondering about the prolaspe history on the 121(s) bull(s) he mentioned.

Alan

 

[THG]

The Oregon State Hereford Associtaion was more than promoting him (in my eyes anyway) at the last sale I was at in the spring (maybe just not geting the price on his semen they wanted). To me it seemed they were pushing him hard. Like someone said earlier, it was hard to pay the price per straw for an unproven bull.

THG,

I did a quick pedigree search and didn't run into any Vindicator lines. Is this were you are getting the prolasp history from or elsewhere? I'm serious and would like to know.

Alan

Alan, I am talking about Kudzu's sire, 121. Doug Gerber told me and another proven hereford breeder in VA sometime back about Phase 121, stay away from him.

THG

 

[THG]

I believe he is referring to his sire Alan

If you are referring to the 121 bull, that is the bull I had a question on for Matt. I may not have been clear on it. But I was wondering about the prolaspe history on the 121(s) bull(s) he mentioned.

Alan

I think if you give Doug Gerber in Indiana a phone call about Phase, I believe he will tell you what I just got done telling you abotu his daughters.

THG

 

[MikeC]

The Oregon State Hereford Associtaion was more than promoting him (in my eyes anyway) at the last sale I was at in the spring (maybe just not geting the price on his semen they wanted). To me it seemed they were pushing him hard. Like someone said earlier, it was hard to pay the price per straw for an unproven bull.

THG,

I did a quick pedigree search and didn't run into any Vindicator lines. Is this were you are getting the prolasp history from or elsewhere? I'm serious and would like to know.

Alan

Alan, I am talking about Kudzu's sire, 121. Doug Gerber told me and another proven hereford breeder in VA sometime back about Phase 121, stay away from him.

THG

This should not have been posted here in a public forum. If you have bad info on someone else's bull, whether you can substantiate it or not, do it by PM.

If this were my bull and you put this on an open forum, I would hunt you down wherever you are and whip your little a$$.

 

[1848]

Your right Mike. :clap:

I think if you readers read "Dougs own words" on 121 in "his own dispersal catalog" you will get what "Doug thought" about a bull "he owned, used and sold a son into Select Sires from".

:roll:

 

[redfornow]

The Oregon State Hereford Associtaion was more than promoting him (in my eyes anyway) at the last sale I was at in the spring (maybe just not geting the price on his semen they wanted). To me it seemed they were pushing him hard. Like someone said earlier, it was hard to pay the price per straw for an unproven bull.

THG,

I did a quick pedigree search and didn't run into any Vindicator lines. Is this were you are getting the prolasp history from or elsewhere? I'm serious and would like to know.

Alan

Alan, I am talking about Kudzu's sire, 121. Doug Gerber told me and another proven hereford breeder in VA sometime back about Phase 121, stay away from him.

THG

This should not have been posted here in a public forum. If you have bad info on someone else's bull, whether you can substantiate it or not, do it by PM.

If this were my bull and you put this on an open forum, I would hunt you down wherever you are and whip your little a$$.

Go on mike do it
I double dog dare you. ;-)

 

[THG]

The Oregon State Hereford Associtaion was more than promoting him (in my eyes anyway) at the last sale I was at in the spring (maybe just not geting the price on his semen they wanted). To me it seemed they were pushing him hard. Like someone said earlier, it was hard to pay the price per straw for an unproven bull.

THG,

I did a quick pedigree search and didn't run into any Vindicator lines. Is this were you are getting the prolasp history from or elsewhere? I'm serious and would like to know.

Alan

Alan, I am talking about Kudzu's sire, 121. Doug Gerber told me and another proven hereford breeder in VA sometime back about Phase 121, stay away from him.

THG

This should not have been posted here in a public forum. If you have bad info on someone else's bull, whether you can substantiate it or not, do it by PM.

If this were my bull and you put this on an open forum, I would hunt you down wherever you are and whip your little a$$.

I am sorry Mike C, call Doug Gerber, he will tell you that Phase wasn't as good as we all thought he was. I will admit, he was a good bull that sired great daughters with good milk flow, but he was kind of like old Vindicator, and we won't get into that decision either. I know a thing or two about Polled Herefords Mike C, been around them all my life.


THG

 

[THG]

Your right Mike. :clap:

I think if you readers read "Dougs own words" on 121 in "his own dispersal catalog" you will get what "Doug thought" about a bull "he owned, used and sold a son into Select Sires from".

:roll:

I don't know much about they Gerber Karat bull, but Doug Banks and Red Hills own a really good son jointly named Commander. Pretty good looking donor dam to Commander as well, because she is a full sib to P606, Nasdaq, and Kaboom.

THG

 

[Brandonm2]

If this were my bull and you put this on an open forum, I would hunt you down wherever you are and whip your little a$$.

THAT'S the truth!!! I doubt that I will ever be in the position to have those kinds of problems; but if I did I would be doing 75 mph on my way to Virginia right now!

 

[1848]

Your right Mike. :clap:

I think if you readers read "Dougs own words" on 121 in "his own dispersal catalog" you will get what "Doug thought" about a bull "he owned, used and sold a son into Select Sires from".

:roll:

I don't know much about they Gerber Karat bull, but Doug Banks and Red Hills own a really good son jointly named Commander. Pretty good looking donor dam to Commander as well, because she is a full sib to P606, Nasdaq, and Kaboom.

THG

Let's turn this back around again THG......you said "stay away from him".

So, is he really good or is he really bad...or do you really even know...do you know Doug....or do you know his "other brother" Doug......have you ever used either bull....even in your virtual herd? I know I know....call TRM and see if they thought it was a good idea to put allot of their eggs in a son who daddy caused prolapes? Tell Randy I said Hi

Take Care :cboy:

 

[Brandonm2]

Your right Mike. :clap:

I think if you readers read "Dougs own words" on 121 in "his own dispersal catalog" you will get what "Doug thought" about a bull "he owned, used and sold a son into Select Sires from".

:roll:

I don't know much about they Gerber Karat bull, but Doug Banks and Red Hills own a really good son jointly named Commander. Pretty good looking donor dam to Commander as well, because she is a full sib to P606, Nasdaq, and Kaboom.

THG

Let's turn this back around again THG......you said "stay away from him".

So, is he really good or is he really bad...or do you really even know...do you know Doug....or do you know his "other brother" Doug......have you ever used either bull....even in your virtual herd? I know I know....call TRM and see if they thought it was a good idea to put allot of their eggs in a son who daddy caused prolapes? Tell Randy I said Hi

Take Care :cboy:

I won't claim to be friends with Randy Owen. I shake his hand in the receiving line, thank him for his hospitality, and move on to chow down on the free food. He wouldn't remember me from Adam's house cat though I did buy a bull from him in a Dixieland Delight Sale once, and I have been to the ranch well over a dozen times over the years....Governor Riley political functions as well as cow sales and he let my judging team work out with his cattle. I probably have scratched Phase behind the ears (most of Randy's bulls are tame as lap dogs) before. I don't believe for one minute that he would promote a bull (no matter how much money was invested) that had daughters that prolapsed regularly and as many good bulls as that herd produces, I too doubt that he would be promoting the son of a known flawed bull.

 

[THG]

Your right Mike. :clap:

I think if you readers read "Dougs own words" on 121 in "his own dispersal catalog" you will get what "Doug thought" about a bull "he owned, used and sold a son into Select Sires from".

:roll:

I don't know much about they Gerber Karat bull, but Doug Banks and Red Hills own a really good son jointly named Commander. Pretty good looking donor dam to Commander as well, because she is a full sib to P606, Nasdaq, and Kaboom.

THG

Let's turn this back around again THG......you said "stay away from him".

So, is he really good or is he really bad...or do you really even know...do you know Doug....or do you know his "other brother" Doug......have you ever used either bull....even in your virtual herd? I know I know....call TRM and see if they thought it was a good idea to put allot of their eggs in a son who daddy caused prolapes? Tell Randy I said Hi

Take Care :cboy:

I won't claim to be friends with Randy Owen. I shake his hand in the receiving line, thank him for his hospitality, and move on to chow down on the free food. He wouldn't remember me from Adam's house cat though I did buy a bull from him in a Dixieland Delight Sale once, and I have been to the ranch well over a dozen times over the years....Republican political functions as well as cow sales and he let my judging team work out with his cattle. I probably have scratched Phase behind the ears (most of Randy's bulls are tame as lap dogs) before. I don't believe for one minute that he would promote a bull (no matter how much money was invested) that had daughters that prolapsed regularly and as many good bulls as that herd produces, I too doubt that he would be promoting the son of a known flawed bull.

I am not saying regularly, but some of the Phase daughters did proplase. DO you want me to give you the phone number to Dr. Don Richardson through PM and you can talk with him about Kudzu and the sire of Kudzu, Phase and he will tell you exactly what I am saying. Also, the same goes for Vindicator, I stay clear of that bull as well.

THG

 

[THG]

If this were my bull and you put this on an open forum, I would hunt you down wherever you are and whip your little a$$.

THAT'S the truth!!! I doubt that I will ever be in the position to have those kinds of problems; but if I did I would be doing 75 mph on my way to Virginia right now!

Well, come on, get your alls butts here, I want to see some action.

THG

 

[THG]

Your right Mike. :clap:

I think if you readers read "Dougs own words" on 121 in "his own dispersal catalog" you will get what "Doug thought" about a bull "he owned, used and sold a son into Select Sires from".

:roll:

I don't know much about they Gerber Karat bull, but Doug Banks and Red Hills own a really good son jointly named Commander. Pretty good looking donor dam to Commander as well, because she is a full sib to P606, Nasdaq, and Kaboom.

THG

Let's turn this back around again THG......you said "stay away from him".

So, is he really good or is he really bad...or do you really even know...do you know Doug....or do you know his "other brother" Doug......have you ever used either bull....even in your virtual herd? I know I know....call TRM and see if they thought it was a good idea to put allot of their eggs in a son who daddy caused prolapes? Tell Randy I said Hi

Take Care :cboy:

Randy is a darn good person and knows good cattle when he see them. But, I am just not a Fan of Phase of this reason that I have already said.

THG

 

[Brandonm2]

I am not saying regularly, but some of the Phase daughters did proplase. DO you want me to give you the phone number to Dr. Don Richardson through PM and you can talk with him about Kudzu and the sire of Kudzu, Phase and he will tell you exactly what I am saying. Also, the same goes for Vindicator, I stay clear of that bull as well.

THG

KPH Phase 121 has been around a long time so you can make an argument there; but Dr Richardson has NOT seen many Kudzu daughters prolapse. He is only 3 years old. I saw some Kudzu progeny this May. We will know more about his first daughters in a year.

http://www.agteamdirect.com/BeefDetails ... 11&uid=376

I am going to stand behind my belief that Randy Owen is NOT going to risk his reputation by pulling the wool over a few cow breeders' eyes to sell a little semen. I also think Accelerated Genetics is a good outfit that is not stupid enough to knowingly pass on flawed cattle.