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boondocks

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I target practice a (very) little and come from a family of hunters (and my first cousin several generations removed is Annie Oakley). We have new guns, old guns, big guns, little guns in my family. Bayonets, black powder. etc, civil war relics, etc. Yet I was perfectly fine with saying we can do without lead ammo in national parks, wildlife refuges and other federal lands. I see that this has now been overturned. Given the toxic damage that lead can do, can anyone (without getting political please!) explain why this is necessary?
 

dun

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Cost for the shooting public and lack of science that it does anything beneficial. Just another feel good response to shut up the "environmental crowd". Same category as sensible gun control from the anti-gun bunch
 
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boondocks

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dun":22ni5ltw said:
Cost for the shooting public and lack of science that it does anything beneficial. Just another feel good response to shut up the "environmental crowd". Same category as sensible gun control from the anti-gun bunch

Well, we do know lead is toxic and tends to persist...https://www.extension.iastate.edu/fores ... ldlife.pdf It does seem to be a problem if huge numbers of people use it...

That article had the cost of lead-free as twice that of leaded, but another study said that they were fairly comparable now, as demand for lead free has gone up???

I just don't see the need for it especially in areas like wildlife refuges. I have no problem with hunting for food, but leaving behind toxic waste that will kill animals (and persist in the human food chain) seems self-indulgent. To me,if you can afford to travel to a wilderness area to hunt, you can pay a few pennies more for a lead-free bullet..But I'm still thinking about this and learning about it. I guess what people do on their own property might be a different story...
 

dun

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Dabbling ducks in very shallow water would be about the only place where lard amounts of lead shot "may" have an effect. The lead free zone for the california condor has been pretty much debunked.
 

Caustic Burno

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dun":2bccsrbs said:
Dabbling ducks in very shallow water would be about the only place where lard amounts of lead shot "may" have an effect. The lead free zone for the california condor has been pretty much debunked.
It wasn't the dabbling that was killing them it was the decoys.
The non toxic is BS the EPA dreamed up. In the forks of the river over here you can hunt any and everything with lead but ducks and geese. The law was so stupid I could me squirrel hunting
along a slough not ten yards from you using lead, if you were hunting ducks you had to use steel.

Hallelujah
 

True Grit Farms

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It would be very nieve to think that a duck doesn't know the difference between a piece of lead shot and feed. I guess the use of lead paint and asbestos has really taken it's toll on the kids brains and bodies. I read where the life expectancy of kids is going the wrong way, first time in this country. The EPA needs to be abolished.
 

greybeard

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To me,if you can afford to travel to a wilderness area to hunt, you can pay a few pennies more for a lead-free bullet.

define 'wilderness area' please.
define 'travel' please.

85' from my front steps is Sam Houston Natl Forest. 2200' the other direction across my pasture, and across the river is again Nat'l Forest. Because I can walk 85' means I should be able to afford steel shot?
And I guess a person that can afford to drive 10 miles instead of just 5 miles to a grocery store can afford to pay higher prices for a loaf of bread or gallon of milk?
Yeah..that's how it works...

Why, in the USofA, should anyone's earnings power or financial stature even be considered when deciding whether they should use lead or steel shot? discrimination .......
 

Ky cowboy

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I think lead as far as waterfowl is concerned causes more wounded ducks that were not able to be recovered. Lead flies better and hits harder, which causes less lost/wounded game.
 

TexasBred

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boondocks":kfaxk72t said:
I target practice a (very) little and come from a family of hunters (and my first cousin several generations removed is Annie Oakley). We have new guns, old guns, big guns, little guns in my family. Bayonets, black powder. etc, civil war relics, etc. Yet I was perfectly fine with saying we can do without lead ammo in national parks, wildlife refuges and other federal lands. I see that this has now been overturned. Given the toxic damage that lead can do, can anyone (without getting political please!) explain why this is necessary?
The real problem was keeping the wildlife on the national parks, wildlife refuges and other federal lands. They seem to have a tendency to go where they were exposing themselves to all sort of dangers. They just would not cooperate.
 

Caustic Burno

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Ky cowboy":3ucyayxa said:
I think lead as far as waterfowl is concerned causes more wounded ducks that were not able to be recovered. Lead flies better and hits harder, which causes less lost/wounded game.
Ducks you used to drop DRT with lead when hit with steel feathers fly and the feathers fly off. You knew they were hit hard and kept flying
Unless you wanted to use hevishot at about three bucks a shell.
You will never convince me it was a way for the antis to make it too expensive to be worth it.
Ducks you could smoke with a 28 gauge needed a 12 gauge payload of steel.
 

Caustic Burno

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Jogeephus

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I don't like how the steel shot cripples the birds. Its almost like the steel just goes right through them. I last duck I shot with steel shot I wounded it even though I nailed it good. The same shot with no 8 birdshot I feel sure would have killed the duck but it lay their flopping in the water. I shot it again from the same range and it finally died but it was like mince meat.
 

Caustic Burno

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Jogeephus":u6fhnu19 said:
I don't like how the steel shot cripples the birds. Its almost like the steel just goes right through them. I last duck I shot with steel shot I wounded it even though I nailed it good. The same shot with no 8 birdshot I feel sure would have killed the duck but it lay their flopping in the water. I shot it again from the same range and it finally died but it was like mince meat.

Jo I agree it's garbage Ammo I refuse to shoot no telling how many die a slow death from the stuff
 

Jogeephus

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Caustic Burno":25s1a918 said:
Jogeephus":25s1a918 said:
I don't like how the steel shot cripples the birds. Its almost like the steel just goes right through them. I last duck I shot with steel shot I wounded it even though I nailed it good. The same shot with no 8 birdshot I feel sure would have killed the duck but it lay their flopping in the water. I shot it again from the same range and it finally died but it was like mince meat.

Jo I agree it's garbage Ammo I refuse to shoot no telling how many die a slow death from the stuff

I've all but quit duck hunting because of it. Shells are too expensive, then the stamps and all that other stuff. Just doesn't seem worth it. And the limit for what I can shoot here is 2 ducks. Those are some expensive ducks.
 
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boondocks

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Jogeephus":2v8ltyif said:
Caustic Burno":2v8ltyif said:
Jogeephus":2v8ltyif said:
I don't like how the steel shot cripples the birds. Its almost like the steel just goes right through them. I last duck I shot with steel shot I wounded it even though I nailed it good. The same shot with no 8 birdshot I feel sure would have killed the duck but it lay their flopping in the water. I shot it again from the same range and it finally died but it was like mince meat.

Jo I agree it's garbage Ammo I refuse to shoot no telling how many die a slow death from the stuff

I've all but quit duck hunting because of it. Shells are too expensive, then the stamps and all that other stuff. Just doesn't seem worth it. And the limit for what I can shoot here is 2 ducks. Those are some expensive ducks.

Do you like the taste? Went to a fancy work dinner once where they served it. Thought it was kinda greasy and meh. Maybe I didn't have a "refined" enough palate (didn't care for the steak tartare appetizer either). We all pushed it around on our plates then went out for deep dish pepperoni.
 

True Grit Farms

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boondocks":s82imfvu said:
Jogeephus":s82imfvu said:
Caustic Burno":s82imfvu said:
Jo I agree it's garbage Ammo I refuse to shoot no telling how many die a slow death from the stuff

I've all but quit duck hunting because of it. Shells are too expensive, then the stamps and all that other stuff. Just doesn't seem worth it. And the limit for what I can shoot here is 2 ducks. Those are some expensive ducks.

Do you like the taste? Went to a fancy work dinner once where they served it. Thought it was kinda greasy and meh. Maybe I didn't have a "refined" enough palate (didn't care for the steak tartare appetizer either). We all pushed it around on our plates then went out for deep dish pepperoni.

Can anything beat a deep dish pepperoni?
 

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