Hungry cattle turn to acorns, face poisoning

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Pica could cause cattle to eat acorns for the first time, and well, if they get the taste of them, then there's no stopping them anymore, so something that could help with animals who haven't gotten the taste yet is a good phosphorus level so they don't go chewing... Just a thought.

I've had a heifer who wouldn't eat a potato, carrot or apple for ages until I repeated forced her... now she loves them... still hates grain though
 
circlew":3bh2u4z1 said:
I've never had a problem with cows eating acorns. I do know goats love acorns. They will be on one side of the place and when the wind blows they head straight to the oaks. :cowboy:
Ever wondered why acorns "can" kill cattle yet make deer fat? ;-)
 
TexasBred":12ml47ob said:
circlew":12ml47ob said:
I've never had a problem with cows eating acorns. I do know goats love acorns. They will be on one side of the place and when the wind blows they head straight to the oaks. :cowboy:
Ever wondered why acorns "can" kill cattle yet make deer fat? ;-)


Cause that is the way God made it. TB don't over think this. ;-)
 
"Ever wondered why acorns "can" kill cattle yet make deer fat?"

I touched on this earlier in the thread. Browsing species, like deer and goats, as well as squirrels, voles, mice, etc., have large parotid salivary glands that produce proline-rich salivary proteins(PRSPs) which bind and inactivate tannins. Cattle and sheep, being principally grazers, do not produce these PRSPs in any significant amount
Additionally, these animals, by virtue of the things that they consume also have well-established populations of forestomach/intestinal bacteria that have very active tannase enzymes.
 
Lucky_P":1x53bost said:
"Ever wondered why acorns "can" kill cattle yet make deer fat?"

I touched on this earlier in the thread. Browsing species, like deer and goats, as well as squirrels, voles, mice, etc., have large parotid salivary glands that produce proline-rich salivary proteins(PRSPs) which bind and inactivate tannins. Cattle and sheep, being principally grazers, do not produce these PRSPs in any significant amount
Additionally, these animals, by virtue of the things that they consume also have well-established populations of forestomach/intestinal bacteria that have very active tannase enzymes.
Right on.......in short being exposed to the tannins much more frequently and in higher concentrations the parotid salivary gland of a deer is much more active in producing higher concentrations of PRSPs than an animal like a cow would produce even tho the cow produces a huge amount of saliva daily.
 
interesting read... especially since my little acreage has over 100 mountain oak trees on it.... maybe the ground squirrels have a job after all (besides contributing to erosion)

what about the branches of the oak trees? my steers chew every branch they can reach
 
MacB":2cvs2e08 said:
interesting read... especially since my little acreage has over 100 mountain oak trees on it.... maybe the ground squirrels have a job after all (besides contributing to erosion)

what about the branches of the oak trees? my steers chew every branch they can reach
Mine have the trees trimmed as high as they can run out their tongue....love the oak leaves. Not a problem.
 
We have one english oak on our place (still small), is there any concern for us with just 1 oak tree??.. cows would only be around it in the springtime too...
 
do a topic search this has been addressed before-my vet said the acorns get packed in their stomachs so tight, they die from it.
 
GMN":21r72fqo said:
do a topic search this has been addressed before-my vet said the acorns get packed in their stomachs so tight, they die from it.

You're serious?? He was serious??? I'd find another vet.
 
TexasBred":1d9x5jhh said:
GMN":1d9x5jhh said:
do a topic search this has been addressed before-my vet said the acorns get packed in their stomachs so tight, they die from it.

You're serious?? He was serious??? I'd find another vet.


TB I just walked in from the deer stand and my cows were packing acorn's like candy. Ground is covered in Swamp White Oak acorns. If acorns were that bad there would have never been a cow in East Texas survive every pasture from here to Fla is full of them.
 
Wow, this acorn debate is intense. I've got a handfull of oaks, mostly blackoak and redoak and haven't noticed my cattle showing much interest in them ever. On another note I've also heard of cattle getting poisoned from eating wilted wild-cherry leaves which my woods is FULL of as I just had my woods logged and the cattle have full access to the woods which is littered with treetops. Anyone have experience with the cherry leaf poisoning?
 
Caustic Burno":efc84qw3 said:
TexasBred":efc84qw3 said:
GMN":efc84qw3 said:
do a topic search this has been addressed before-my vet said the acorns get packed in their stomachs so tight, they die from it.

You're serious?? He was serious??? I'd find another vet.


TB I just walked in from the deer stand and my cows were packing acorn's like candy. Ground is covered in Swamp White Oak acorns. If acorns were that bad there would have never been a cow in East Texas survive every pasture from here to Fla is full of them.
Our area is full of post oaks and live oaks and some cows also eat soem of them. but CB they do not always kill every cow that eats them but if they eat enough of them long enough there is always the chance one or "some" will die. That's just a fact. Yours may not affected NOW, but I've seen many dry up and die standing under a tree waiting for the next one to fall. If they eat enough for enough days you "could" lose one.

Mu original comment was to the vet who claimed the acorns basically just fill a cow up and kill her because she cannot digest or pass them.

Are you familar with the blood thinner medication "Coumadin". Great product and hundreds of thousands of people take it. You know what the active ingredient is?? Warfarin.....increase the concentration of the warfarin and change the carrier and you know what you have??? BAR BAIT rat poison....sort of like eating a few acorns or a bushel.
 
TB you are a complete jerk!I'd trust what my Vet says over you any day of the week, so maybe if you don't got something nice to say, maybe you shouldn't say it at all-
 
ohiosteve":2zw8z91b said:
Wow, this acorn debate is intense. I've got a handfull of oaks, mostly blackoak and redoak and haven't noticed my cattle showing much interest in them ever. On another note I've also heard of cattle getting poisoned from eating wilted wild-cherry leaves which my woods is FULL of as I just had my woods logged and the cattle have full access to the woods which is littered with treetops. Anyone have experience with the cherry leaf poisoning?

I have had cattle die from eating wilted wild cherry leaves. It is prussic acid poisioning. When wild cherry leaves wilt they release prussic acid. Green leaves and dried leaves are ok. It's only when the the trees or branches are cut, or blown down and the leaves are wilting that this is a problem. Other plants also can release prussic acid such as sweet clover, young johnsongrass, and sorghum-sudangrass.
 
Qoute: Most cattle like the taste of acorns and tend to seek them out. But hungry cattle that consume too many green acorns will get sick. Their gastrointestinal tracts will be upset; they will develop diarrhea, become dehydrated, constipated and emaciated, and they might die.

Acorn poisoning is caused by chemicals called tannins. It generally occurs when acorns fall off trees in the immature green stage, followed by overconsumption by cattle. This usually occurs in pastures where there is not much grass left nor hay fed. Poisoning from oak tannins also can occur when cattle eat buds and young leaves of oaks (shrubs and trees) in early spring.

Sickness starts eight to 14 days after the cattle have started eating acorns. The amount tolerated by an animal is influenced by the protein content of its diet. If the protein intake is high, the animal can consume more acorns without having poisoning symptoms.

Cattle affected by acorn poisoning have a poor appetite, appear dull, become constipated, suffer weight loss and look gaunt or "tucked up." They also may pass blood in the manure and/or bleed from the nostrils. Profuse diarrhea may follow after the constipation. Affected animals drink large amounts of water and void excessive amounts of clear urine (urine may also contain blood).

Many animals go down and cannot rise after three to seven days of clinical signs of acorn poisoning. If these affected animals do not die, it may take as long as two to three weeks before they start to recover. Producers suspecting such a problem should contact a veterinarian as soon as possible.

To correct the protein and energy deficiencies of a stressed, thin cowherd, provide plenty of good quality hay. When feeding hay, consider both the quantity and quality fed, and supplement it if needed with the proper amounts of protein and/or energy supplements.

Providing hay that is of poor quality - even in large amounts - might provide adequate energy, but the cattle will be deficient in protein. Providing good hay but not enough of it can improve the protein deficiency but leave the cattle lacking in energy.

Treatment is of little value in severely affected cattle. However, for the other cattle remaining on the "poor" oak tree pasture, provide supplemental feed containing hydrated lime (calcium hydroxide) and protein, which are "antidotes" for the tannins.

Mix and cube the following feed formulation for breeding cattle (4 lbs. per head per day) and use it as a meal creep feed for calves (free choice lime limits consumption like salt):

> Cottonseed meal 1,040 lbs. (52 percent)

> Dehydrated alfalfa leaf meal 600 lbs. (30 percent)

> Vegetable oil 160 lbs. (8 percent)

> Hydrated lime 200 lbs. (10 percent)

Obviously, acorn poisoning can be prevented by removing cattle from areas with oak trees when acorns have recently fallen. Reserve these pastures for grazing in late fall or winter when the acorns have had a chance to age, turn brown and become somewhat less toxic.

No matter when the cattle are turned onto "poor" oak tree pasture, remember that they still could be affected if they eat too many acorns.
 
GMN":bb6ybvxw said:
Qoute: Most cattle like the taste of acorns and tend to seek them out. But hungry cattle that consume too many green acorns will get sick. Their gastrointestinal tracts will be upset; they will develop diarrhea, become dehydrated, constipated and emaciated, and they might die.

Acorn poisoning is caused by chemicals called tannins. It generally occurs when acorns fall off trees in the immature green stage, followed by overconsumption by cattle. This usually occurs in pastures where there is not much grass left nor hay fed. Poisoning from oak tannins also can occur when cattle eat buds and young leaves of oaks (shrubs and trees) in early spring.

Sickness starts eight to 14 days after the cattle have started eating acorns. The amount tolerated by an animal is influenced by the protein content of its diet. If the protein intake is high, the animal can consume more acorns without having poisoning symptoms.

Cattle affected by acorn poisoning have a poor appetite, appear dull, become constipated, suffer weight loss and look gaunt or "tucked up." They also may pass blood in the manure and/or bleed from the nostrils. Profuse diarrhea may follow after the constipation. Affected animals drink large amounts of water and void excessive amounts of clear urine (urine may also contain blood).

Many animals go down and cannot rise after three to seven days of clinical signs of acorn poisoning. If these affected animals do not die, it may take as long as two to three weeks before they start to recover. Producers suspecting such a problem should contact a veterinarian as soon as possible
.

To correct the protein and energy deficiencies of a stressed, thin cowherd, provide plenty of good quality hay. When feeding hay, consider both the quantity and quality fed, and supplement it if needed with the proper amounts of protein and/or energy supplements.

Providing hay that is of poor quality - even in large amounts - might provide adequate energy, but the cattle will be deficient in protein. Providing good hay but not enough of it can improve the protein deficiency but leave the cattle lacking in energy.

Treatment is of little value in severely affected cattle. However, for the other cattle remaining on the "poor" oak tree pasture, provide supplemental feed containing hydrated lime (calcium hydroxide) and protein, which are "antidotes" for the tannins.

Mix and cube the following feed formulation for breeding cattle (4 lbs. per head per day) and use it as a meal creep feed for calves (free choice lime limits consumption like salt):

> Cottonseed meal 1,040 lbs. (52 percent)

> Dehydrated alfalfa leaf meal 600 lbs. (30 percent)

> Vegetable oil 160 lbs. (8 percent)

> Hydrated lime 200 lbs. (10 percent)

Obviously, acorn poisoning can be prevented by removing cattle from areas with oak trees when acorns have recently fallen. Reserve these pastures for grazing in late fall or winter when the acorns have had a chance to age, turn brown and become somewhat less toxic.

No matter when the cattle are turned onto "poor" oak tree pasture, remember that they still could be affected if they eat too many acorns.
GMN sorry you feel I'm a jerk because I said your veterinarian didn't know what he was talking about (this was based strictly on your post).....now you go and give us a very long post which proves my point. If you ever see a cow suffering from acorn poisoning look a the manure. Nothing but water and acorn hulls.
Sorry I offended you and/or your vet but he was wrong. Put me on your enemy list and you won't hear from me anymore. Better yet maybe I need to leave. :wave:
 
Caustic Burno":1umfhm58 said:
My cattle have access to woods 365 and there is any kind of oak you want to find. I am deer hunting the same woods, never lost one to acorn's.

Me neither!!! . . . . till this year. Hope your string lasts longer than mine.
 
Caustic Burno":11xyptj8 said:
TB I just walked in from the deer stand and my cows were packing acorn's like candy. Ground is covered in Swamp White Oak acorns. If acorns were that bad there would have never been a cow in East Texas survive every pasture from here to Fla is full of them.

I have an acorn rich pasture - never had a problem. This year, 4 bulls out of a group of 10 got all the symptoms. One dead. Had the dead one posted. All the symptoms. I'm a believer that 1. it's real, 2. it's random - doesn't affect all animals the same, 3. it's heavily dependent on the year/season, 4. not all animals will even eat the things, 5. It's a ticking time bomb - I could run that pasture another 10 years and never see a problem - then have another "acorn year" with "acorn cattle" and disaster. Good luck to you . . . . I'm changing my use of that pasture.
 

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