Heterosis (hybrid vigor)

[icandoit]

Heterosis (hybrid vigor) - Amount by which measured traits of the crossbreds exceed the average of the two or more purebreds that are mated to produce the crossbreds.


Allright, give me a down to earth definition of this.

Dick

 

[dun]

First thing to remember is that heterosis actaully has 2 effects.
Individual heterosis is the expressed difference between the average to be expected of the 2 parents.
There is all kinds of scientific ways to calculate it, but what it boils down to is you can expect an individual calf to grow X more then if the same sire and dam were bred to similar animals of they're particular breed.
Maternal heterosis is the real winner in the deal. A F1 cow expresses heterosis by weaning a larger calf (it would probably be larger at yearling too but I'm not real sure how much is maternal and how much is individual) then similar cows of a single breed of the two parent breeds.
After reading that over it makes foggy sense to me but may be just more confusion.
I read somewhere in one of the myriad studys that I've read on the subject that individual heterosis contributes something like 11% but maternal contributes 30%. Not exactly sure of the %s but that's close.

dun

 

[Medic24]

Ok, here it goes in a nutshell.....

My wife marries me, I am ugly, she was and is still excedingly beautiful (from a loooong line of beautiful people)......we 'mate' and have a child, the ugly genes(recessive) that I contributed were superceded by the beauty genes,(dominant) and thus we have a continuation of the beautiful people lines in our daughter (Thank Goodness!), Now the same thing goes for intellegence......much the same, I have never been too bright, but No.1 is a near genious... and thus.... our daughter is 12 going on 21!

Thats how that works!...lol :cboy:

 

[bwranch]

Just trying to get my poor mind around this thing Medic. The Hillbilly breed originated in the Smokies and has been refined over the years by intensive linebreeding. Now you were talking about a cross with an Aussie. Is the Aussie a continental or a british breed?

 

[MikeC]

Just trying to get my poor mind around this thing Medic. The Hillbilly breed originated in the Smokies and has been refined over the years by intensive linebreeding. Now you were talking about a cross with an Aussie. Is the Aussie a continental or a british breed?

Aussies are a British breed that originated in Britian, transported to Australia, to remove them from society (a penal colony). They cross very well with Hillbillies but...........create an undeterminable amount of "Moonshiners" in the pedigree thus perpetuating the need for more prisons.

 

[bwranch]

I hear that those "shiners" have a high scrotal epd but don't grow out real well because their "mama's milk" isn't real high in protein. Also heard that it often takes a whole "force" of trained individuals to pen 'em up and even after you get 'em penned, working them is darn near impossible.

 

[MikeC]

I hear that those "shiners" have a high scrotal epd but don't grow out real well because their "mama's milk" isn't real high in protein. Also heard that it often takes a whole "force" of trained individuals to pen 'em up and even after you get 'em penned, working them is darn near impossible.

Bloodhounds are the dogs of choice in "penning" these animals. Coonhounds are known to lay on the porch and await their release from the "pen".

 

[Ryder]

Ok, here it goes in a nutshell.....

My wife marries me, I am ugly, she was and is still excedingly beautiful (from a loooong line of beautiful people)......we 'mate' and have a child, the ugly genes(recessive) that I contributed were superceded by the beauty genes,(dominant) and thus we have a continuation of the beautiful people lines in our daughter (Thank Goodness!), Now the same thing goes for intellegence......much the same, I have never been too bright, but No.1 is a near genious... and thus.... our daughter is 12 going on 21!

Thats how that works!...lol :cboy:

Medic that sounds more like simple dominance than heterosis (thank goodness).
Do you sometimes feel dominated?

 

[Ryder]

Heterosis (hybrid vigor) - Amount by which measured traits of the crossbreds exceed the average of the two or more purebreds that are mated to produce the crossbreds.


Allright, give me a down to earth definition of this.

Dick

How can you mate more than two purebreds? I thought matings were a twosome thing. :???:

 

[dun]

Heterosis (hybrid vigor) - Amount by which measured traits of the crossbreds exceed the average of the two or more purebreds that are mated to produce the crossbreds.


Allright, give me a down to earth definition of this.

Dick

How can you mate more than two purebreds? I thought matings were a twosome thing. :???:

There are 3 way crosses, four way crosses, but after that I think any one part is getting pretty diluted.
An F1 isn;t the only crossbreed. If you mate a crossbred (F1) to another breed different then the original two you have a 3 way cross.
That's how you would maximize heterosis. An F1 cow contributing her heterosis and the bull of the third breed kicking in to add heterosis in the calf. More corsses may get you more heterosis, I think somewhere one of the studys claimed that a 4 way cross was the maximum you could expect heterosis to play a part. I guess after that they're just mongrels.

dun

 

[sidney411]

Dun, would a brangus bull mated to a full-blood hereford be considered a 3-way cross maximizing the benefits of heterosis? Or would the cross have to be on the dam side of the equasion to maximize heterosis (ie. brangus cow mated to full-blood hereford bull)?

 

[icandoit]

Medic24 wrote:

Ok, here it goes in a nutshell.....

My wife marries me, I am ugly, she was and is still excedingly beautiful (from a loooong line of beautiful people)......we 'mate' and have a child, the ugly genes(recessive) that I contributed were superceded by the beauty genes,(dominant) and thus we have a continuation of the beautiful people lines in our daughter (Thank Goodness!), Now the same thing goes for intellegence......much the same, I have never been too bright, but No.1 is a near genious... and thus.... our daughter is 12 going on 21!

Thats how that works!...lol

That is an excellant way to explain it. I guess that's why my sons and grandchildren are so good looking, they got it from my wife. And heres how Merriam-Webster Onlinne Dictionary defines it:

One entry found for heterosis.


Main Entry: het·er·o·sis
Pronunciation: "he-t&-'rO-s&s
Function: noun
Etymology: New Latin
: the marked vigor or capacity for growth often exhibited by crossbred animals or plants -- called also hybrid vigor
- het·er·ot·ic /-'rä-tik/ adjective


I think the key words in that definition are "capacity for growth".

That's a dam good question Sidney.


Dick

 

[jt]

medic, i always tell people my daughter got my looks.. :roll: cause my wife has still got hers..

jt

 

[dun]

Dun, would a brangus bull mated to a full-blood hereford be considered a 3-way cross maximizing the benefits of heterosis? Or would the cross have to be on the dam side of the equasion to maximize heterosis (ie. brangus cow mated to full-blood hereford bull)?

When you get to using American breeds, i.e. Brangus, Gerts, etc., the picture gets a little murky, to me anyway. The American breeds are typically 3/8 -5/8 crosses so you you wouldn;t get the full affect of the 50:50 influence. But, ah yes, the ever poplular but, .......since the American breeds have been bred long enough to pretty much standardize the gene pool it would be pretty similar to the 50:50. And since the Brahman part of the Brangus breed is a composit of breeds that throws another turd in the genetic punchbowl that would have it's own affect.

dun

 

[Ryder]

Main Entry: het·er·o·sis
Pronunciation: "he-t&-'rO-s&s
Function: noun
Etymology: New Latin
: the marked vigor or capacity for growth often exhibited by crossbred animals or plants -- called also hybrid vigor
- het·er·ot·ic /-'rä-tik/ adjective


I think the key words in that definition are "capacity for growth".



Dick

Even though that dictionary gives that definition, some main advantages of heterosis are considered to be fertility, calf survival, adaptability, and maternal ability. This is why it would probably be better to use a purebred sire on crossbred cows in a three breed rotation.

 

[joe]

I have been trying to follow along, learn something and not ask a dumb question. I think I am failing. I have F-1 Angus X Herefords, bred to Angus bulls. I bred their calves, (which are 5/8 Angus 3/8 hereford, right?) back to angus bulls. So, if I am breeding to get good females to increase my herd size, should I be breeding these calves back to Hereford, or to a limi or ? I thought if you used a 3 way cross, that was a "terminal" calf, only for feed yard use, not replacements. Sorry if my questions are confusing. Like I said, I was trying to follow along, and learn, and I thought I had it for a minute or two, then, once again, it became clear as mud.

 

[dun]

I have been trying to follow along, learn something and not ask a dumb question. I think I am failing. I have F-1 Angus X Herefords, bred to Angus bulls. I bred their calves, (which are 5/8 Angus 3/8 hereford, right?) back to angus bulls. So, if I am breeding to get good females to increase my herd size, should I be breeding these calves back to Hereford, or to a limi or ? I thought if you used a 3 way cross, that was a "terminal" calf, only for feed yard use, not replacements. Sorry if my questions are confusing. Like I said, I was trying to follow along, and learn, and I thought I had it for a minute or two, then, once again, it became clear as mud.

The third cross can be terminal but it doesn;t have to be. In a rotational crossbreeding program, you would breed the heifers/cows to the breed of the dam.
If you're looking at a 3 way cross I would stick with breeds "noted" for maternal abilities.
If you do a google search for "catle crossbreeding heterosis rotational" you'll get so many hits that you'll get sick of reading the information. And they'll splain it a whole lot better then I can.

dun