Herd Bull

[TexasBred]

I love making people mad! :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :banana: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

Nobody is mad. Actually laughing my a$$ off at your immaturity and need to be noticed.

 

[RD-Sam]

I was thinking the same thing TB.

I was sorta hoping Doc would critique that bull, so I could know what not to breed. :lol2:

 

[rocket2222]

I am not impressed by this bull. He appears too small and short coupled. I hope that he sires calves that exhibit more stretch and grow than he looks. Unfortunately, I am seeing more calves that look like they were sired by that kind of bull at the sale barns.

As producers are looking for a smaller framed cows with less mature size, they are going to produce feeder steers and heifers that will meet resistance from order buyers as being too small. I got one of those "talking too's" Monday morning as we sorted the cattle bought at several sales over the weekend.

BC, I totally agree with your statement. I am told to buy as many of those type as I want as long as I keep them and just don't deliver them to my customers. Recently I have not had anyone fuss about any too tall calves just the too short or the no good.
I hate to comment on the bull, but he$$ no I would not use him. I would buy him off the farm and send him to slaughter.

Running into the same thing up this way, commercial breeders have reduced the frame size of the herd down to where they're getting docked, had 2 in the last couple of months tell me if I have anything 6.5 frame or bigger, call, otherwise don't bother.

 

[RD-Sam]

I am not impressed by this bull. He appears too small and short coupled. I hope that he sires calves that exhibit more stretch and grow than he looks. Unfortunately, I am seeing more calves that look like they were sired by that kind of bull at the sale barns.

As producers are looking for a smaller framed cows with less mature size, they are going to produce feeder steers and heifers that will meet resistance from order buyers as being too small. I got one of those "talking too's" Monday morning as we sorted the cattle bought at several sales over the weekend.

BC, I totally agree with your statement. I am told to buy as many of those type as I want as long as I keep them and just don't deliver them to my customers. Recently I have not had anyone fuss about any too tall calves just the too short or the no good.
I hate to comment on the bull, but he$$ no I would not use him. I would buy him off the farm and send him to slaughter.

Running into the same thing up this way, commercial breeders have reduced the frame size of the herd down to where they're getting docked, had 2 in the last couple of months tell me if I have anything 6.5 frame or bigger, call, otherwise don't bother.

Why do they always go from one extreme to the other? They are knocking the frame off of everything in search of a more efficient cow, then they'll get docked, then they go to the extreme the other direction so they don't loose money. What's wrong with middle of the road and staying there?

 

[Roadapple]

That's a "breed changing bull" for sure.

 

[cattleman99]

The small frame or "little dink phase" as I like to refer to it is making some people rich now. Some call them efficient cattle. Well they better be the way weining weights drop. Middle of the road is the way to go. That's why I like my 6-7 frame cattle. I noticed a different trend this spring up here on the Canadian Prairies. Bigger framed cattle got sold whether they were much good or not and the so called efficient ones had to be pretty darn good to bring any kind of money. Quite a few of the small ones ended up being served at Mcdonald's.

The bull pictured here is a total embarrasment. i would abort my cows if they got bred to something like that.

Someone mentioned EPD"s. Another total waste of time. Ever check back to an old sale catalog about 5 or 6 years after the sale and start looking up current EPD's on the one's that went to breeders. Rarely are they even similar. i can honestly say I've never checked EPD"s prior to buying an animal and seldomly ever have a customer ask either. And yes I'm in the Purebred business. About the only EPD's worth looking at are on old AI bulls. My Dad bought a bull back in 98 and we calved over a thousand head out of him over the years. His EPD's said he had no maternal numbers when he bought him. 90% of both his herd and mine trace back to that bull as he made the best females ever. We still selectively AI to him but it's hard as we don't buy into the linebreeding train of thought.

 

[EAT BEEF]

Wow :???: :? :???:

 

[DOC HARRIS]

Wow :???: :? :???:

"EAT BEEF"-

I agree with your post! Regarding "cattleman99"'s post above - - - in every group you can always find at least ONE. "What was good enough for Daddy is good enough for me! Don't confusse me with the facts!"

DOC HARRIS

 

[rocket2222]

Why do they always go from one extreme to the other? They are knocking the frame off of everything in search of a more efficient cow, then they'll get docked, then they go to the extreme the other direction so they don't loose money. What's wrong with middle of the road and staying there?

All you have to do is look back in history a little ways to know the M section in the cattle breeders dictionary's missing, Mid, Middle Moderate, there just not there, gone

 

[cattleman99]

Doc. Exactly what facts might you be referring to?

 

[RD-Sam]

Uh Oh! :cowboy:

 

[BC]

[/quote]
Why do they always go from one extreme to the other? They are knocking the frame off of everything in search of a more efficient cow, then they'll get docked, then they go to the extreme the other direction so they don't loose money. What's wrong with middle of the road and staying there?[/quote]

Nothing is wrong with the middle of the road. That is where I want to get and stay. To me middle of the road is frame 5 to 7. That would be about a 1200 to 1400 lb cow in a Body Condition Score of 5. The steer calves should mature out at about the same weight as their dams with 0.35 inch to .5 inch fat.

If you must have the proverbial small frame "efficient" cow, understand that you will produce some "dinks" that will be called a "short" . Those type cattle fit a grass fed beef niche. A niche is a part or piece of the mainstream market.

 

[DOC HARRIS]

Doc. Exactly what facts might you be referring to?

Not to 'highjack' the original thread, but I will touch on a couple of thoughts here.

The "facts" of how to "selectively" avoid ultimate negatve results by practicing "Single Trait Selection" protocols of both Phenotype and Genotype hereditary factors. By "eye-balling" seedstock traits only, one unavoidably will focus on Phenotype characteristics ONLY, therefore losing the obvious advantages of balancing current and immediate phenotype characteristics with carefully obtained accurate Expected Progeny Differences, and enhancing the accuracy of those EPD's with DNA-Marker technology and Molecular Value Predictions. The recent exciting scientific discoveries embracing the improved protocols of Beef Cattle Production presents to the Beef Cattle Industry opportunities for not only improving breeding technics, but - and this is the MOST important factor, or element, of all - the business of increasing PROFIT.

By doggedly and obstinately refusing to accept proven scientific methods that will enhance one's business efforts, for whatever so-called or unknown "justifiable" motives, the results, in my opinion, are specious and unreasonable. To put it bluntly, you are cutting off your nose to spite your face! In spite of the obvious successes you have had in your breeding business, that does not preclude the fact that you could improve your seedstock quality with an acceptance of an agenda that would enhance the Phenotype and Genotype of your sale cattle, and exponentially increase the desirability of your product (cattle), and therefore your bottom line PROFIT!

These are the "Facts", not out-of-reach pipe dreams. It just takes Faith, Confidence and Belief in your Products, Services and Ideas. Hundreds of millions of dollars and hundreds of millions of man-hours have been expended to give YOU (and any others who are willing to think and accept the work accomplished in this effort) the God-given opportunity to improve your chosen lot in life.

All you have to do is be OPEN-MINDED and reach out and take it!

Those are EXACTLY the facts to which I am referring!

DOC HARRIS

 

[ANAZAZI]

Good hijack dr harris!

 

[3waycross]

To answer the original post. The bull is just not any good. There's no kind way to say it. You have an opportunity to buy better bulls every week at the sale than that poor old fella.

BTW there are folks that are members her that live in your state or near it that produce real good bulls at a very reasonable price. Why do you want to buy an old sorry washed bull like that anyway.

He's worth $.62 a lb and only worth that to go to work for McDonalds.