Feeding cows

[J]

Quick question, if I can buy a good ration for $130 a ton, you feed 5lbs a day that's only around $10 a month. How is that so bad. If I am lacking the grass I will feed, and I save on my hay bill by feeding a little extra to the calves. I figure I will either feed more of one and less of the other, or the other way around.

It's all about controlling cost on the front end you spend 10 dollars a month over 6 months I spend nothing and hold the calf an extra month on grass and pocket 70 more dollars.

I agree on controlling costs but I think it also comes down to what oakcreekfarms said about lacking grass. Sometimes its hard to spend nothing and hold the calf an extra month on grass when there ain't enough grass to go around. Now on the other hand maybe the grass issue needs to be looked into. Could it be poor to start with or maybe its just overstocked?

Not enough info for me to take one side or the other. (but I do agree if you have the grass, then feeding out of a sack is bad news)

 

[mnmtranching]

Did you know, That the US slaughters and consumes about 100,000 head of fed cattle per day? This is just the domestic supply, not imports. Unless its live cattle coming down from Canada under 30 months old to be slaughtered in US plants.

All these cattle are coming from feedlots, all feed a high consentrated ration of grain, mostly corn.

Even many thin cull cows go on feed, to add weight.

Why do Ya'll suppose all use grain to feed cattle. and not grass or hay?Grain is the most efficient way to add wight to cattle.
6 pounds of ration 1 pound of beef.

Besides there's not enough grass or hay to come close, to feeding all these cattle. In many areas of the US there's a hay shortage.

Up here corn is about the same price as good hay, and corn is about 90% digestable. Much higher then the best of hay.

mnmt

 

[WORANCH]

Quick question, if I can buy a good ration for $130 a ton, you feed 5lbs a day that's only around $10 a month. How is that so bad. If I am lacking the grass I will feed, and I save on my hay bill by feeding a little extra to the calves. I figure I will either feed more of one and less of the other, or the other way around.

It's all about controlling cost on the front end you spend 10 dollars a month over 6 months I spend nothing and hold the calf an extra month on grass and pocket 70 more dollars.

I agree on controlling costs but I think it also comes down to what oakcreekfarms said about lacking grass. Sometimes its hard to spend nothing and hold the calf an extra month on grass when there ain't enough grass to go around. Now on the other hand maybe the grass issue needs to be looked into. Could it be poor to start with or maybe its just overstocked?

Not enough info for me to take one side or the other. (but I do agree if you have the grass, then feeding out of a sack is bad news)

If he 's short on grass he has to many cows . In a drought you have to cut back . Selling that slow breeder or oldcow will make you money instead losing money by feeding her .

 

[WORANCH]

Did you know, That the US slaughters and consumes about 100,000 head of fed cattle per day? This is just the domestic supply, not imports. Unless its live cattle coming down from Canada under 30 months old to be slaughtered in US plants.

All these cattle are coming from feedlots, all feed a high consentrated ration of grain, mostly corn.

Even many thin cull cows go on feed, to add weight.

Why do Ya'll suppose all use grain to feed cattle. and not grass or hay?Grain is the most efficient way to add wight to cattle.
6 pounds of ration 1 pound of beef.

Besides there's not enough grass or hay to come close, to feeding all these cattle. In many areas of the US there's a hay shortage.

Up here corn is about the same price as good hay, and corn is about 90% digestable. Much higher then the best of hay.

mnmt

A feed lot is a different deal .

 

[MikeC]

Whether I feed or not varies from year to year. Some years the rain hits at the right time and I don't feed at all.

Some years.......not so good.

A cow needs a balanced ration year round to be productive.

Some years mother nature don't cooperate.

 

[Caustic Burno]

Whether I feed or not varies from year to year. Some years the rain hits at the right time and I don't feed at all.

Some years.......not so good.

A cow needs a balanced ration year round to be productive.

Some years mother nature don't cooperate.

Mike I agree with most everthing you post, it is still about pasture managment,controlling inventories and cost.
We have been in a drought since 98 the cycle seems to be easing up on us this year.
Looking at my grass I could double my herd right now and if the rain quits I would be feeding out of a sack. You have to plan for bad years and adapt, a sack is not adapting its proping up which is a loser.

 

[ALACOWMAN]

id say this would have too be that year she aint cooperating.

 

[3MR]

Quick question, if I can buy a good ration for $130 a ton, you feed 5lbs a day that's only around $10 a month. How is that so bad. If I am lacking the grass I will feed, and I save on my hay bill by feeding a little extra to the calves. I figure I will either feed more of one and less of the other, or the other way around.

It's all about controlling cost on the front end you spend 10 dollars a month over 6 months I spend nothing and hold the calf an extra month on grass and pocket 70 more dollars.

Sure, but that doesnt mean you are making anymore money if you cut your stocking rate to save the 70$ per animal.

Say you both have grass for 10 cows, you run 10 head, but he supplements and runs 15. You both sell for 900 each. You make 900 X 10 = 9000. Say his supplementing cost him 100 for each animal. He still clears 800 X 15 = 12,000.

You have to run your operation like a business, which it is.

I cant believe you guys made me do math! :lol:

 

[ALACOWMAN]

I see guy's stock heavier when the grass is good but they are paying more for the cattle because of it. every one hanging on too their cattle. then a drought hits are the prices fall then they start either dispersing or cutting back losing their head not thinking and their ass. the folks that survive in the business are the one that know their limitations and stay within that area

 

[backhoeboogie]

This all comes back to planning. It is all like "saving for a rainy day" or "making hay while the sun is shining".

These are extreme times. No one in my area has hay stored since it all went in the EXTREME drought last year. Then this year it hit a little more widespread, but not quite as bad.

Yes indeed many of us are supplementing or irrigating, some are doing both.

Last year I actually sold hay in June. I should not have done so. This year people are begging me for hay and I am not parting with any. I learned the hard way.

It is not a matter of culling for many. I know folks who were in the business for years, good cattleman, who are out of the business. They went beyond culling, they sold out.

When it so dry that cactus dies (like it did last year), grass is certainly not growing to grow. Hudred year old pecan trees died and those are some deep rooted critters.

Last year there were folks who lost farms in brush fires. They lost everything including their homes, barns too. Lots of folks. This year has not been a year to rebound since the drought moderately persists.

If you have a plan that makes you money, it is a good plan.

My plans now include irrigation, surplus hay storage, and other things.

My plan is working, but now I have to say was instead of "is". The darn feral hogs are back and they have ripped up my fields since the irrigation caused them to be the only moist place for miles around. But I have a plan for those hogs as well.

 

[farm princess]

We have cow/calf pairs that we have on pasture and creep fed when the time comes and they get a bit of corn/grain every now and again and we also have a small feedlot that they only get corn/grain and hay. We don't buy from a feed mill unless we use something to make them gain faster because we raise our own corn and hay. We raise corn, soybeans, hay and some straw. Husbands family has always done the "land farming" and just getting into the cattle part several years back.
I don't know if any of this makes since but this is what we do.

;-)

 

[Dave]

Beings as we are talking the entire country here there will obviously be huge differences. Everyone has an unfair advantage and figuring out what it is will help keep you in business. If you happen to be in an area where grain is as cheap as hay it make sence to feed grain. If hay prices are going through the roof as they are in some areas it might pay to feed grain. Cheap hay that is supplemented with grain may very well pencel out.
However I will agree with CB in that grain by the sack is a loser. By the sack you are paying someone to sack it, to sell it (sorry Crowder), and it is just too costly. Grain can and does pencil at times and in places but a person has to be buying bulk for this to happen. I compared the price of some grain I feed. The difference between bulk price and bag price is 6 cents a pound. Those pennies would add up in a hurry.
Dave

 

[oakcreekfarms]

I don't grain the cows, they live through the winter on milo, a bail every now and again. The calves that I keep to raise to a year will recieve about 5lbs of grain a day and stay on winter wheat. The calves that go to the sale barn will be on a different wheat pasture recieving no grain if I am going to sell them, or the same as the heifers if I am going to raise them for my butcher meat. I am going to creep feed a little to get the bulls ready for bull tests, december and january sells. I look at the cows ratio in my herd contempary group. I like for her to stay right around 100%. Creep feed or not her calf has to stay around the average weight of the other calves year in and year out for her to stay on the place. We are a registered herd therefore about 1/2 of the calves are being raised to a year old on our farm.

 

[3MR]

I see guy's stock heavier when the grass is good but they are paying more for the cattle because of it. every one hanging on too their cattle. then a drought hits are the prices fall then they start either dispersing or cutting back losing their head not thinking and their ass. the folks that survive in the business are the one that know their limitations and stay within that area

If you got grass and you arent using it you are throwing away a commodity which translates into money. Think of yourself as a grassfarmer, cattle is just how you get paid. Stockers are a profitable way to turn that grass into cash.

People run into problems when they forget to sell those extra cows or hold on to them until the last possible moment. You have to adjust your stocking and retention rate by what you can support at the time you have to support it, thats what culling is all about. Its not a bad word, its good business. You cull when you need to and stock when you can. Its a continous cycle.

 

[Herefordcross]

CB, the only thing i would disagree with craig on is that if you don't have quality/quantity of forage in your pasture you can buy a Black Hided $50,000 cow and she won't do any thing if she doesn't have the food to do it with. Sometimes pasture grass needs revamping or total replacement to give an animal a fair shot.

 

[plbcattle]

I believe that it is the type of cattle operation that one runs dictates the amount of feed. Registered breeders who consign cattle to sales, put on production sales, sell replacement bulls, or sell private treaty ALL FEED GRAIN. to survive in the seedstock business you have to have your cattle a little fatter than most. Is it right or wrong, I don't know. I do know that the extra feed that is put into a animal will be rewarded usually. The average in the Registered Brangus breed last year was around $4000 so you have a little more feed in the animal but the price you receive is generally greater. This is not a issue of my cows will preform on grass or not. It is an issue of having to compete with the others. Don't believe me, take a cow to a registered consignment sale that has had no grain, you will have the lowest selling lot of the day. For a commercial man that needs his cow to produce the largest calf at the lowest input, I understand not feeding grain. Some of the high weights in registered breeds are attributed to extra feed, you just have to know that. I agree some are pushed to far and fall apart, both heifers and bulls. I think it is how the animals are feed that determines how they hold there BC. Genetics obviously plays a role in this also. Just my 2 cents worth

 

[plbcattle]

just to add another spin to this. what is the difference in graining cattle or putting in irrigation/fertilizer/net wrapping/aerating the ground. It is spending money to improve something that you are feeding cattle.
I don't practice this but for arguments sake, what if you didn't fertilize and used that money to buy grain. I know most spend thousands on fertilizer. the grain would give them more protein than that fertilizer would give the grass. I know the fertilizer puts back to the ground but I know farmers that don't fertilize ever and they have grass and noce cows??

 

[backhoeboogie]

just to add another spin to this. what is the difference in graining cattle or putting in irrigation/fertilizer/net wrapping/aerating the ground. It is spending money to improve something that you are feeding cattle.
I don't practice this but for arguments sake, what if you didn't fertilize and used that money to buy grain. I know most spend thousands on fertilizer. the grain would give them more protein than that fertilizer would give the grass. I know the fertilizer puts back to the ground but I know farmers that don't fertilize ever and they have grass and noce cows??

Good question. The answer I would pose is that fertilized grass will be better rooted and more suited for next season. Boron in the trace minerals drives the roots deep. Where as grain is a one shot deal. My pastures improve every year.

Irrigation is not a "norm". It is a drastic measure. I could sell out the herd and sell horse quality hay for a premium, but that is only this year. Next year everyone could have hay. Especially the folks who have now sold completely out.

We have had less than a half inch rain since late April and its been over 100 degrees for something like 28 days.

 

[arkcowman]

My plan is working, but now I have to say was instead of "is". The darn feral hogs are back and they have ripped up my fields since the irrigation caused them to be the only moist place for miles around. But I have a plan for those hogs as well.

Backhoe - are you going to trap the feral hogs and relocate them to a safe enviroment ?

 

[ALACOWMAN]

I see guy's stock heavier when the grass is good but they are paying more for the cattle because of it. every one hanging on too their cattle. then a drought hits are the prices fall then they start either dispersing or cutting back losing their head not thinking and their ass. the folks that survive in the business are the one that know their limitations and stay within that area

• If you got grass and you arent using it you are throwing away a commodity which translates into money

. Think of yourself as a grassfarmer, cattle is just how you get paid. Stockers are a profitable way to turn that grass into cash.

People run into problems when they forget to sell those extra cows or hold on to them until the last possible moment. You have to adjust your stocking and retention rate by what you can support at the time you have to support it, thats what culling is all about. Its not a bad word, its good business. You cull when you need to and stock when you can. Its a continous cycle.

heard all the grass farmer songs, but i bale all my extra grass or stockpile it for winter grazing. cant see taking on extra head of cattle that i may or maynot be able too support. now if things would work like the cattlemen needed good grass and cheap cows too add to the herd thats another story