Daddy Issues

[NEFarmwife]

One of our bulls came back, stating his daddy wasn't so.

We just started registering calves out of him...he was our cleanup bull for our Registered herd. I had pulled blood on him to send off but saw he had one on file. So I just requested it.

This bull is a 2014 model. Hoping the operation is able to figure this out. It just blows my mind, how many potential cattle are incorrect, out there. Everything should be parent verified, before ever being able to be registered.

This is what I received back...

Subject: Parentage Exclusion Report on bull, XXXXXX
Message:


This e-mail is in regard to the bull, XXXX who was DNA marker typed through Angus Genetics Inc (AGI) in file number 00000.

The bull, XXXX has a parentage problem, the sire, XXXXX is excluded as a possible parent. The pedigree has been temporarily cancelled for parentage and suspended until the parentage issue has been resolved.

If you have another possible parent please add the additional parents online in your login profile. Go to DNA, Testing Results and choose View Results menu option, or click this link: View Results. Edit the parentage to submit the additional parents to us. Once the proper parentage is determined the certificate on the bull, XXXX will need to be returned for correction.

 

[Bright Raven]

Sorry that happened. I guarantee that the cattle I produce go back to the bull I advertise as the Sire. All my products are AI sired. I always check the straw after AI. None of my products are exposed to a live bull. Thus, I don't do a DNA parentage. But I would be happy if it were required for all registered animals.

 

[Nesikep]

Hopefully it gets figured out!, that sucks.

 

[NEFarmwife]

Our goal this year is everything we've purchased in the past, be DNA typed for accuracy and parent verified.

Be interesting to see what he comes back as. The alleged sire has been selling progeny of his in the $45-$75K range the next year. We got ahold of his progeny in the first sale and "stole" him... we ain't laughing anymore. :bang:

 

[Fire Sweep Ranch]

Sorry that happened. I guarantee that the cattle I produce go back to the bull I advertise as the Sire. All my products are AI sired. I always check the straw after AI. None of my products are exposed to a live bull. Thus, I don't do a DNA parentage. But I would be happy if it were required for all registered animals.

Same here. Baby bulls are weaned at 6 to 7 months, so no way there. We check every straw we put in, after we pull out of the cow, to verify it is labeled correctly. So, unless the semen in the straw was mislabeled (not likely), our calves are sired by who we say they are. We have no neighbors with bulls, so no worries there either.

I have had TWO cows I purchased that did not DNA back. One I had already sold, and regisered two calves out of her, and sold those! When the breeder told me "hey, her grandsire is better now that it is corrected" I about flipped my lid. I will never buy from him again (he sells in many sales in MO and IA). I guess he flushed the dam to the cow (Heifer) I had bought, many years later, and when he did her genome testing it came back with a different sire. :bang:

 

[CattleMan1920]

Sorry that happened. I guarantee that the cattle I produce go back to the bull I advertise as the Sire. All my products are AI sired. I always check the straw after AI. None of my products are exposed to a live bull. Thus, I don't do a DNA parentage. But I would be happy if it were required for all registered animals.

Didn't I bring up the parentage issue at one time and was SLAMMED hard for it? This happens more frequently than not. The situation above seems like a genuine mistake, but I can almost promise with certainty, there are times when someone knows that what they are offering is not the real article and passes it off hoping that it never is checked.

 

[Ebenezer]

Sorry that happened. I guarantee that the cattle I produce go back to the bull I advertise as the Sire. All my products are AI sired. I always check the straw after AI. None of my products are exposed to a live bull. Thus, I don't do a DNA parentage. But I would be happy if it were required for all registered animals.

Didn't I bring up the parentage issue at one time and was SLAMMED hard for it? This happens more frequently than not. The situation above seems like a genuine mistake, but I can almost promise with certainty, there are times when someone knows that what they are offering is not the real article and passes it off hoping that it never is checked.

So, the breeders are crooks in the registered Angus business? Let's castigate them before a conspiracy theory develops.

 

[NEFarmwife]

Sorry that happened. I guarantee that the cattle I produce go back to the bull I advertise as the Sire. All my products are AI sired. I always check the straw after AI. None of my products are exposed to a live bull. Thus, I don't do a DNA parentage. But I would be happy if it were required for all registered animals.

Didn't I bring up the parentage issue at one time and was SLAMMED hard for it? This happens more frequently than not. The situation above seems like a genuine mistake, but I can almost promise with certainty, there are times when someone knows that what they are offering is not the real article and passes it off hoping that it never is checked.

Tact. You attacked the SAV operation and eluded to SAV purposefully selling a bull that was NOT who they stated it was because there was "no way he got a president for $6K" blah blah blah... And because of the way that thread went down...I chose not to disclose who this bull was purchased from. I spoke with the operation this morning and they're going to get on this quickly. I am just hoping they got samples on all potential sires or else I have a commercial bull and a few illegitimate children.

 

[CattleMan1920]

Sorry that happened. I guarantee that the cattle I produce go back to the bull I advertise as the Sire. All my products are AI sired. I always check the straw after AI. None of my products are exposed to a live bull. Thus, I don't do a DNA parentage. But I would be happy if it were required for all registered animals.

Didn't I bring up the parentage issue at one time and was SLAMMED hard for it? This happens more frequently than not. The situation above seems like a genuine mistake, but I can almost promise with certainty, there are times when someone knows that what they are offering is not the real article and passes it off hoping that it never is checked.

So, the breeders are crooks in the registered Angus business? Let's castigate them before a conspiracy theory develops.

Oh Ebenezer, you are SO given to hyperbole! I was just saying that there are breeders out there that have clientele that don't check things quite as closely as you and I do, and they know what they can get away with.

 

[CattleMan1920]

Sorry that happened. I guarantee that the cattle I produce go back to the bull I advertise as the Sire. All my products are AI sired. I always check the straw after AI. None of my products are exposed to a live bull. Thus, I don't do a DNA parentage. But I would be happy if it were required for all registered animals.

Didn't I bring up the parentage issue at one time and was SLAMMED hard for it? This happens more frequently than not. The situation above seems like a genuine mistake, but I can almost promise with certainty, there are times when someone knows that what they are offering is not the real article and passes it off hoping that it never is checked.

Tact. You attacked the SAV operation and eluded to SAV purposefully selling a bull that was NOT who they stated it was because there was "no way he got a president for $6K" blah blah blah... And because of the way that thread went down...I chose not to disclose who this bull was purchased from. I spoke with the operation this morning and they're going to get on this quickly. I am just hoping they got samples on all potential sires or else I have a commercial bull and a few illegitimate children.

Didn't you see where I mentioned to Ron that your situation was most likely a "genuine" mistake, not intentional? If you were dealing with someone that purposely tried to sell you a bill of goods, then you have problems. I didn't take that as the sitution when I read your post.

 

[CattleMan1920]

Sorry that happened. I guarantee that the cattle I produce go back to the bull I advertise as the Sire. All my products are AI sired. I always check the straw after AI. None of my products are exposed to a live bull. Thus, I don't do a DNA parentage. But I would be happy if it were required for all registered animals.

Didn't I bring up the parentage issue at one time and was SLAMMED hard for it? This happens more frequently than not. The situation above seems like a genuine mistake, but I can almost promise with certainty, there are times when someone knows that what they are offering is not the real article and passes it off hoping that it never is checked.

Tact. You attacked the SAV operation and eluded to SAV purposefully selling a bull that was NOT who they stated it was because there was "no way he got a president for $6K" blah blah blah... And because of the way that thread went down...I chose not to disclose who this bull was purchased from. I spoke with the operation this morning and they're going to get on this quickly. I am just hoping they got samples on all potential sires or else I have a commercial bull and a few illegitimate children.

I never attacked SAV in any shape or form, get your facts straight. I merely said that if you want a President and you get something else, then that's a problem, at least for me. On that thread, it was obvious that it was an honest mistake and the buyer was happy with what he got instead, that's fine. However, had I sold a bull labeled as a genuine son of President and he turned out to be from Big Wayne, I would have been flambéed. No mercy!

One of our President sons may be sold soon, and I assure you that the sale is completely predicated on the fact that he is the real article, if I passed him off something else, and it was discovered later, and a sh.tshow ensued, the buyer would not be a happy camper, and would not accept a substitute. Parentage matters.

 

[NEFarmwife]

Didn't I bring up the parentage issue at one time and was SLAMMED hard for it? This happens more frequently than not. The situation above seems like a genuine mistake, but I can almost promise with certainty, there are times when someone knows that what they are offering is not the real article and passes it off hoping that it never is checked.

Tact. You attacked the SAV operation and eluded to SAV purposefully selling a bull that was NOT who they stated it was because there was "no way he got a president for $6K" blah blah blah... And because of the way that thread went down...I chose not to disclose who this bull was purchased from. I spoke with the operation this morning and they're going to get on this quickly. I am just hoping they got samples on all potential sires or else I have a commercial bull and a few illegitimate children.

Didn't you see where I mentioned to Ron that your situation was most likely a "genuine" mistake, not intentional? If you were dealing with someone that purposely tried to sell you a bill of goods, then you have problems. I didn't take that as the sitution when I read your post.

I am making reference to why you got "SLAMMED".

I assure you that this operation was a pure mistake...just as I came to defend SAV on their mistake in that other thread.

Back on topic, if we could try not to derail this and make it all about you... that would be great. :deadhorse:

When will the AAA start insisting that parentage be confirmed and as members, should we push it?

 

[TennesseeTuxedo]

Short answer, yes.

 

[Bright Raven]

Tact. You attacked the SAV operation and eluded to SAV purposefully selling a bull that was NOT who they stated it was because there was "no way he got a president for $6K" blah blah blah... And because of the way that thread went down...I chose not to disclose who this bull was purchased from. I spoke with the operation this morning and they're going to get on this quickly. I am just hoping they got samples on all potential sires or else I have a commercial bull and a few illegitimate children.

Didn't you see where I mentioned to Ron that your situation was most likely a "genuine" mistake, not intentional? If you were dealing with someone that purposely tried to sell you a bill of goods, then you have problems. I didn't take that as the sitution when I read your post.

I am making reference to why you got "SLAMMED".

I assure you that this operation was a pure mistake...just as I came to defend SAV on their mistake in that other thread.

Back on topic, if we could try not to derail this and make it all about you... that would be great. :deadhorse:

When will the AAA start insisting that parentage be confirmed and as members, should we push it?

I sense that there is a divide between those members who want it and other members who think it is a matter between buyer and seller. As has been noted on the board, some folks object to the Associations wielding too much authority over their operations.

 

[CattleMan1920]

Tact. You attacked the SAV operation and eluded to SAV purposefully selling a bull that was NOT who they stated it was because there was "no way he got a president for $6K" blah blah blah... And because of the way that thread went down...I chose not to disclose who this bull was purchased from. I spoke with the operation this morning and they're going to get on this quickly. I am just hoping they got samples on all potential sires or else I have a commercial bull and a few illegitimate children.

Didn't you see where I mentioned to Ron that your situation was most likely a "genuine" mistake, not intentional? If you were dealing with someone that purposely tried to sell you a bill of goods, then you have problems. I didn't take that as the sitution when I read your post.

I am making reference to why you got "SLAMMED".

I assure you that this operation was a pure mistake...just as I came to defend SAV on their mistake in that other thread.

Back on topic, if we could try not to derail this and make it all about you... that would be great. :deadhorse:

When will the AAA start insisting that parentage be confirmed and as members, should we push it?

I said that many months ago. Everything in AAA should be tested before a registration is issued. Every animal should be HD50K tested or Angus GS AND have the genetic bundle to start eliminating all carriers.

Now this would upset a LOT of people, but think about the clarity it would bring to the breed.

 

[CattleMan1920]

Didn't you see where I mentioned to Ron that your situation was most likely a "genuine" mistake, not intentional? If you were dealing with someone that purposely tried to sell you a bill of goods, then you have problems. I didn't take that as the sitution when I read your post.

I am making reference to why you got "SLAMMED".

I assure you that this operation was a pure mistake...just as I came to defend SAV on their mistake in that other thread.

Back on topic, if we could try not to derail this and make it all about you... that would be great. :deadhorse:

When will the AAA start insisting that parentage be confirmed and as members, should we push it?

I sense that there is a divide between those members who want it and other members who think it is a matter between buyer and seller. As has been noted on the board, some folks object to the Associations wielding too much authority over their operations.

There is absolutely no reason why any registered Angus producer should not DNA test and do the genetic bundle testing on every animal, sans steers. Period!

I for one would NEVER want to deal with explaining to a buyer "Oops, guess there was a mix up"

This business is hard enough without heading in reverse to untangle something that looks like a bait cast fishing reel that has a massive backlash.

No thanks.

 

[NEFarmwife]

Didn't you see where I mentioned to Ron that your situation was most likely a "genuine" mistake, not intentional? If you were dealing with someone that purposely tried to sell you a bill of goods, then you have problems. I didn't take that as the sitution when I read your post.

I am making reference to why you got "SLAMMED".

I assure you that this operation was a pure mistake...just as I came to defend SAV on their mistake in that other thread.

Back on topic, if we could try not to derail this and make it all about you... that would be great. :deadhorse:

When will the AAA start insisting that parentage be confirmed and as members, should we push it?

I said that many months ago. Everything in AAA should be tested before a registration is issued. Every animal should be HD50K tested or Angus GS AND have the genetic bundle to start eliminating all carriers.

Now this would upset a LOT of people, but think about the clarity it would bring to the breed.

Pop open the champagne, we AGREE on something.

 

[NEFarmwife]

I do not agree with genetic bundke testing unless it's going to stud. If one of ours comes back at potential, we test for that specific defect and clear it.

 

[CattleMan1920]

I do not agree with genetic bundke testing unless it's going to stud. If one of ours comes back at potential, we test for that specific defect and clear it.

Epic?

 

[NEFarmwife]

I do not agree with genetic bundke testing unless it's going to stud. If one of ours comes back at potential, we test for that specific defect and clear it.

Epic?

I said "unless going to stud"
Had Epic been tested before being collected and distributed, it would have halted collection.