buying small groups to make a large group

[skip7879]

I am thinking out loud here just to see if anyone has done this or has experiance. In Iowa there are lots of small guys who have 5-10 cows on a pasture and they sell the calves in small groups off of the pasture about this time of year. I heard a guy on tv say that the bigger the group the more feed lots are interested. What if a guy bought up these small groups up then grouped them up and backgrounded them with hay and distillers (insert your opinon on feeds) get them all on the same level of vaccination. Then sell them in a few months. I realize comingling calves brings sickness and what not and could turn into headaches, but if it could be profitable I would be willing to try it.

Any opinons are welcome

 

[kenny thomas]

If you have a good health program and plenty of time it works great. Selling is easy in 50,000lb loads.

 

[Jalopy]

I have done that before. The easiest way to make money is buying at a reasonable price and it takes time to get a uniform group. Yes, there are a lot of small herds but the calves are very diverse in each small group so if you purchased all ten or fifteen you may only have five or nine that are uniform and the balance will be either heavier or lighter than the rest. Therefore what I am getting at is if you can buy direct from the farmers you may have to buy 75 head of farm raised calves in order to get a uniform group of 45 and two other groups of 15 that will be either lighter or heavier and these may be the groups that can be the difference between profit or loss. I found that buying light weaned calves 400-500 lbs in late August or mid September and getting them current on vaccinations and acclimated to the farm was good timing, then I could run them on pasture for a bit then on cornstalks and hay. Only enough concentrate(corn ddg or pelleted protein ) to keep them coming to the feed bunks so they would be easier to handle when you need to work or ship them. The best prices I got were from the calves that had developed frame from the backgrounding not put on muscle. Keep them "green". I quit because I found it easier to concentrate on my cow herd without the backgrounding cattle around. You really need a good tight pen for when you are mixing the groups to start with. If you buy any through sale barns be careful that all are healthy, introducing a few sick calves to the group can be costly. Good Luck.

 

[dun]

Our marketing group puts together groups from 15-20 producers to the tune of aorund 300 head total. They are all born within a 3 month window and weaned and vaccinated when we co mingle. They are sorted by weight, frame and muscle. Out of those we usually end up with around 12 different main groups. After they've been at the backgrounder for 30 days they're sorted again and some groups are mixed together but in each group there will be calves that fall out and go to another group of either much heavier or much lighter (based on the original weigh in).
You might want to contact an order buyer in your area, have him buy your calves for you and pay a commision.
In this area almost all of the salebarns have sales of preconditined/weaned/bunkbroke/vaccinated calves. I would think that it is the same in most areas that have decent numbers of calves.

 

[skip7879]

How many do you guys think is a minimum amount of calves it would take to make one good solid uniform group and how long do you feed them for usually before you would turn around and sell them again

 

[kenny thomas]

Here we do as Dun does, a lot of small producers market their calves together. We wean them a minimum of 45 days, give their shots, worm, ect, have them bunk broke to feed and broke to a water tank. That way even a small producer with only a few calves can take advantage of the load lot price.

 

[dun]

How many do you guys think is a minimum amount of calves it would take to make one good solid uniform group and how long do you feed them for usually before you would turn around and sell them again

It's not so much the number as the pounds. You'll want to market around 49-50k pounds as a group, that's a pot load.

 

[bigbull338]

buying stocker or feeder calves is very tricky.you better know what the potload buyers want an be able to go out an buy those cattle at a fair price to both the seller an buyer.if you have any junk calves in the load that will kill your profit in the whole load.

 

[Amo]

IDK if I would be too worried about pot loads. Ive got about 140 cows. Ive sold as few as 20 head of calves and they will $ up as good or better than some that are 80-100 hd per cut. Yes you might get a premium for a pot, but like I said Ive kept track on sale day how mine do to others and I sort very tight. Sell bout 3 times a year and the barn has to do very little cutting. I think if you get them uniform head # wont be quite so big. Then again you will have steers and heiffers of different breeds etc all mixed in. I know some guys that will do this in late spring with grass calves, and run them over the summer.

Ill agree, building frame seams to $ up way more than pooring the coals to them. The next guy always wants that compencatory gain.

 

[cross_7]

I am thinking out loud here just to see if anyone has done this or has experiance. In Iowa there are lots of small guys who have 5-10 cows on a pasture and they sell the calves in small groups off of the pasture about this time of year. I heard a guy on tv say that the bigger the group the more feed lots are interested. What if a guy bought up these small groups up then grouped them up and backgrounded them with hay and distillers (insert your opinon on feeds) get them all on the same level of vaccination. Then sell them in a few months. I realize comingling calves brings sickness and what not and could turn into headaches, but if it could be profitable I would be willing to try it.

Any opinons are welcome

my :2cents:
if you buy uniform groups of #1's worth the money and do as you have stated, the calves will bring a premium, but i think #1's are a must.
marketing will be a big part of your plan as well.
special feeder or stockers sales and pot loads for superior sales(vac-45 calves sell well) and direct to the feedyard,

 

[Stocker Steve]

Hard to make any money buying milk fat unweaned calves and then back grounding them for a couple months. They just don't look as good as when they came off the cow, and they grow apart due to the various genetics.

 

[kenny thomas]

Steve, you bring up a good point. The milk fat calves may look very different in a couple of months. But also some of the plain calves could bloom. No matter what the more consistancy there is the better off you are. And the closer to 50,000lb the better. I try to buy the better end of the plain calves up to the best calves but not the milk fat ones. I feel I am just paying for weight that I will loose on the overly fat ones. Need 54 tomorrow to finish one group going on grass until next August. They will change a lot by then. But I would like for every one of them to look exactly the same now. Not possible but I will try,
No matter if a person is weaning 400lb calves or 700 lb calves the more consistant they are the easier it is to get sold at a better price.

 

[novatech]

Buyers at the sale barn are doing this every day. It is how some of them make their living. It is how my late uncle and mentor made his living most of his life (way before I came along in the 40's.). He even bought cows to put together uniform herds of momma cows to resell. But like was said before, you had better know what you are doing and what your market wants first.

 

[TexasBred]

I am thinking out loud here just to see if anyone has done this or has experiance. In Iowa there are lots of small guys who have 5-10 cows on a pasture and they sell the calves in small groups off of the pasture about this time of year. I heard a guy on tv say that the bigger the group the more feed lots are interested. What if a guy bought up these small groups up then grouped them up and backgrounded them with hay and distillers (insert your opinon on feeds) get them all on the same level of vaccination. Then sell them in a few months. I realize comingling calves brings sickness and what not and could turn into headaches, but if it could be profitable I would be willing to try it.

Any opinons are welcome

Skip I haven't been to a sale barn in ages but from what I use to see down this way, it's pretty hard for even an order buyer to put together a complete order in one day so they too do just as you're talking about doing. Go to a different sale barn every day and buy what they can in hopes of putting together one or two large uniformgroups.

 

[skip7879]

Wow guys thanks for the replies I think I need to put a plan together if I decide to do this. My biggest problem might be I don't have time to sit at a sale barn all day all week. I oringally got this idea from seeing alot of people advertising small groups on craigslist. but I don't think I will find enough of a certain weight calves with out traveling all over the place. I like the idea but I need to put a plan together.

 

[dun]

Wow guys thanks for the replies I think I need to put a plan together if I decide to do this. My biggest problem might be I don't have time to sit at a sale barn all day all week. I oringally got this idea from seeing alot of people advertising small groups on craigslist. but I don't think I will find enough of a certain weight calves with out traveling all over the place. I like the idea but I need to put a plan together.

That why there are order buyers