Bad Beef

[AngusLimoX]

Most of the folks on here likely produce beef but few likey depend on it for their livelihood, or would consider themselves part of the industry. Lots of folks that would torpedo the whole beef industry just to promote their niche product.

I laugh at the grass fed folks thinking that they will have an advantage in years to come. Grass fed is what Brazil and Columbia do best, good job giving them a leg up! :lol:

Lots of backyard ranchers and that is just fine since this is a family oriented hobby board.

 

[Brandonm22]

As far as I am concerned there is NO "bad beef". Anytime a steak, roast, or burger is bad it is the chef's fault.

 

[Jogeephus]

I would like to say that my cows are just more betterer than other people's cows and that's why they taste so good. But anyone who has ever seen my cattle knows this is simply BS and I won't argue with them on this point. So why is my homegrown meat better? I have asked this same question many times and have come to the conclusion that the sharp penciled processors are to blame by adding stuff to the meat whether it be fat or water. My processor does neither. To further my belief I'd like you to look at the following recipe and tell me if you think this would be a healthy food to eat.

4 lb. Lean beef
4 lb. Lean veal
2 lb. Lean pork
1 pt Ice water
2 Tsp. Prague powder #1 *
1 oz. Powdered dextrose **
2 3/4 oz. Wheat flour **
3 1/2 oz. Salt **
1 Tbs. Ground nutmeg
1 Tsp. Ground coriander
1/2 Tsp. Ground cardamom
1/2 Tsp. Ground cloves

Grind finely and stuff into sheep casings.

Now compare this recipe and its ingredients to the ingredients on the side of a can of Vienna Sausages. Quite a bit of difference yet they are both Vienna Sausages or so they say.

 

[Running Arrow Bill]

Most of the folks on here likely produce beef but few likey depend on it for their livelihood, or would consider themselves part of the industry. Lots of folks that would torpedo the whole beef industry just to promote their niche product.

I laugh at the grass fed folks thinking that they will have an advantage in years to come. Grass fed is what Brazil and Columbia do best, good job giving them a leg up! :lol:

Lots of backyard ranchers and that is just fine since this is a family oriented hobby board.

Angus, some good points. However...

I don't think for a moment that "Grass Fed Beef" will ever take over the commercial feedlot type of beef. Grass Fed, Natural, No Homones, etc., is and will in all probability remain just a portion of the beef market (the same way that Kosher, Organic, and other types are). Grass fed takes longer to finish out and therefore commands a higher price for the end user. The meat packers want "cookie cutter" animals to rapidly process and be able to "grade" them by the truckload, not to be bothered with individual testing, grading.

That so...

In our case as well as hundreds of other grass fed producers, we will continue our programs. Why? Because it is much simplier to do grass fed than regularly haul range cubes, bagged feed, and other stuff to supplement their grass and hay. Those customers that like the taste of grass fed will continue to buy that. Others obviously don't want anything to do with it.

 

[3waycross]

As far as I am concerned there is NO "bad beef". Anytime a steak, roast, or burger is bad it is the chef's fault.

I hate to be the one to break this to you but you are WRONG I have spent the last 28 years selling beef of every possible grade and kind to the restuarant industry, and I will tell you for a fact it's not all good. You just have to use it the way it was intended. I sell everything from prime dry aged beef to a label called Ranch and Grill that is most likely cut only from older cows.

I am not gonna tell anyone that a chef can't wreck a piece of good meat but for the most part people get EXACTLY what they pay for on their plate in a restuarant.

Oh and BTW Dun I would be very surprised if the percentage of Dry age beef sold in this country is more than 1 tenth of 1 percentl
It's virtually ALL wet aged, and that is not necessarily a bad thing it is in many ways safer than dry age and not more disgusting to look at. I will say though when you crack that cyrovac open on a Top Sirloin that has 60 days on it yer gonna take a step backward, however the smell dissapates in a few minutes and it's all good. and also a large percentage of what you get at Wal Mart, especially, is enhanced. Mostly just with a type of saline solution.

The american consumer talks a good game when it comes to wanting to eat right but when they count up the food budget they eat what's feasible, and affordable. What cracks me up is when someone goes to a Texas Roadhouse or similar chain steakhouse and expects to be fed a dry aged prime steak for $14.95. I have a news flash for al ya'll that steak doesn't exist. If that's what you want be prepared to pay $50 for it and by golly you better not try to order it well done cuz the high end places will laugh at you when you ask for it that way.

Well that's my rant for the day and one other thing, I agree, I think options is just lookin for a fight, or is an undercover PETA operative trying to stir the shyt.

 

[Brandonm22]

If you can cook it absolutely does not matter.

 

[Angus Cowman]

Angus, some good points. However.



In our case as well as hundreds of other grass fed producers, we will continue our programs. Why? Because it is much simplier to do grass fed than regularly haul range cubes, bagged feed, and other stuff to supplement their grass and hay.

I am not trying to start a fight here but my calves are fed grass and mommas milk basically 7 months before they ever get grain what gets me is that all you grassfed guys make it sound like all anyone who doesn't grass feed does is haul grain to their cows 24 hrs a day 7 days a week 52 weeks per yr which is not true my cows never see grain, seldom see cubes except to keep them following the truck, and yes I use protein tubs to supplement my cows sometimes mainly becasue I am a fall calver and they might need a little boost in the winter this winter I doubt it as I have alot of millet, haybeans and alfalfa hay in the barn

 

[AngusLimoX]

I don't think for a moment that "Grass Fed Beef" will ever take over the commercial feedlot type of beef. Grass Fed, Natural, No Homones, etc., is and will in all probability remain just a portion of the beef market (the same way that Kosher, Organic, and other types are).

Sorry, didn't want to sound "anti" any kind of beef - like the no hormones, antibiotics, raised "naturally" folks attack the rest of us. I just think all of this sends the fence sitting protein consumer elsewhere = to fish or chicken or the "other white meat".

We should be extolling each others virtues while giving incentive to purchase our particular flavour of BEEF.

 

[3waycross]

If you can cook it absolutely does not matter.

Is that some kind of Zen statement or what.

I sell meat(not cattle) for a living and work with every level of chef and fry cook there is. I don't make this stuff up to be amusing. If you have some special expertise that trumps my experience(and training) then trot it out. Otherwise explain yourself and/or please stop making statements like this.

I have read most if not all of your posts on here for the last 2 years and usually find you to be prety well informed, this however is not one of those times.

 

[hillsdown]

When we did prime (AAAA) tenderloin for our anniversary I could have smacked some people for requesting theirs well done. They obviously have never had a top quality cut of meat. Btw no one got theirs well done, medium was the furthest I would go to ruining a great steak like that.. :lol:

Or when people request a prime rib roast well done.. :?

The last time I ordered steak at a restaurant it was sirloin and was the special ,on for $39.99.. It was absolutely delicious but why would I pay that for something that I could have at home. That is why I would rather order something that I do not have at home. Like a fab pasta dish or seafood..

I don't think anyone on here ,I hope especially not me ,said beef was bad. When we have guests over they always get a wonderful delicious meal with BEEF as the main course ;whether it be home raised or bought.

 

[Brandonm22]

If you can cook it absolutely does not matter.

Is that some kind of Zen statement or what.

I sell meat(not cattle) for a living and work with every level of chef and fry cook there is. I don't make this stuff up to be amusing. If you have some special expertise that trumps my experience(and training) then trot it out. Otherwise explain yourself and/or please stop making statements like this.

I have read most if not all of your posts on here for the last 2 years and usually find you to be prety well informed, this however is not one of those times.

I don't care how many steaks you sell. Every steak is different. Some you CAN let your fry cook toss on the grill for 100 seconds at 900 degrees flip it once and it will be fine, some you can't. Some need to be marinated for six hours. Some steaks will grill but will suck fried, some will make fajitas, some need to just go in the crock pot and cooked slow. The goofy cook needs to know their meat and be able to tell what they are working with. There is never anything wrong with the steak. It is always human screw ups if a steak is prepared improperly or somebody tries to do something with a steak that it can't do. Food service is a different world because most kitchens have the cheapest labor they can find and they are doing everything with too much speed. Poorly paid, poorly trained cooks rushing around doing twenty things at once is always a recipe for disaster. If a steak is bad, the chef screwed it up. Man did not walk out of the Ice Age eating grain fed USDA prime tenderloins. Every meat cut is edible and tasty for the person who knows what the heck they are doing and is able to take the time to get it right.

 

[3waycross]

So you come by this incredible theory HOW? What is your foodservice experience?

You actually come close to making my point when you say some steaks/beef can only be good if they are cooked in a crockpot. But the rest of your post does not make a lot of sense.

I ask you again what is your real world experience with food preparation.
Or did you just stay at a Holiday Inn last night.

and by the way a lot of those underpaid "cooks" out there are a lot better at what they do than you think

For the record you SHOULD care how many steaks I have sold since it's probably in the tens of thousands over the course of my career. I also, on an ongoing basis, train the chefs that I deal with on meat cutting and preparation. So my friend unlike you I do actually have some credentials and not just an opinion.

 

[Brandonm22]

So my friend unlike you I do actually have some credentials and not just an opinion.

That doesn't in any way change the fact that you are completely and totally wrong.

 

[3waycross]

So my friend unlike you I do actually have some credentials and not just an opinion.

That doesn't in any way change the fact that you are completely and totally wrong.

Explain it then Brandonm slowly and one point at a time. I am sure at this juncture everyone is on the edge of their seat waiting for your words of wisdom. I know I am. I am actually willing to keep an open mind and hear what you have to say. Let's begin with your main premise that their is no such thing as a bad piece of meat just bad cooks. Before you get started keep in mind that making something marginally edible does not make it a GOOD piece of meat.

Oh and by the way I am still waiting for you to lay out your "CHOPS" for all to see. If you have provable expertise I am more than willing to acknowledge it.

Please Sir, the floor is yours.

 

[Brandonm22]

"Bad beef" is just a crutch used by a sorry cook. For over two thousand years the only time most people (ie the 90% of the populous who did all the work) ate beef (as opposed to veal/baby beef) was when their ox or their milk cow got too old. The whole village would have a feast day and the villager who knew best how too cut up a carcass would slowly and carefully butcher the whole animal. The villager who was the best meat cooker they had would then cook the whole thing (refrigeration, freezing, canning, and jerky weren't available then) in a project that took him or her days. Fast forward to 19th century America. Blessed with a surplus of land, big herds of cattle were accumulated and the beef business was born. Big herds of Texas Longhorn steers were driven up from Texas to Kansas and then shipped by rail to Chicago, killed, split, and then sides of beef were shipped all over the country to butcher shops where the whole carcass was split into steaks and roasts by knowledgable butchers. "Beef" went from 14 year old oxen too ~4 year old Longhorn steers. House wives then spent hours preparing the beef into tasty meals over fire. Hereford, Shorthorn, and Angus bulls were added to the herd too improve quality. After World War II, grain finishing supplanted grass finishing so the age of the steers dropped from 4 too 2 years old. The U.S. government stepped in and created quality grades too distinguish the best carcasses from the other carcasses, dividing the kill into Prime, Choice, Good (Select today), Standard and the cow classifications. Neighborhood butcher shops were replaced by supermarkets and processors began selling boxed beef instead of whole sides allowing stores/restaurants too specialize in just the easiest too prepare cuts (ribeyes, strips, T-bones, and sirloins) and forcing the industry too grind up most of the chucks, rounds, and briskets into burgermeat (once just used for trimmings) where once those were marketed too the public as steaks and roasts. For some cook now to tell me that there is was something wrong with his 18 month old, grain finished, Angus ribeye steak makes me say "bullsh*t"!!! The problem is with the cook and it is almost ALWAYS due to laziness.

 

[dun]

For some cook now to tell me that there is was something wrong with his 18 month old, grain finished, Angus ribeye steak makes me say "bullsh*t"!!! The problem is with the cook and it is almost ALWAYS due to laziness.

Depends on what you consider bad beef. I've had tough beef from young steers but other then meat that was left too long in the case and had been "surfaced" I've never had a piece of "bad tasting" beef. Maybe a little bland but not bad.

 

[grubbie]

Maybe they are mixing your antelope with it.

lol,...now THAT would be bad beef!!!

 

[3waycross]

"Bad beef" is just a crutch used by a sorry cook. For over two thousand years the only time most people (ie the 90% of the populous who did all the work) ate beef (as opposed to veal/baby beef) was when their ox or their milk cow got too old. The whole village would have a feast day and the villager who knew best how too cut up a carcass would slowly and carefully butcher the whole animal. The villager who was the best meat cooker they had would then cook the whole thing (refrigeration, freezing, canning, and jerky weren't available then) in a project that took him or her days. Fast forward to 19th century America. Blessed with a surplus of land, big herds of cattle were accumulated and the beef business was born. Big herds of Texas Longhorn steers were driven up from Texas to Kansas and then shipped by rail to Chicago, killed, split, and then sides of beef were shipped all over the country to butcher shops where the whole carcass was split into steaks and roasts by knowledgable butchers. "Beef" went from 14 year old oxen too ~4 year old Longhorn steers. House wives then spent hours preparing the beef into tasty meals over fire. Hereford, Shorthorn, and Angus bulls were added to the herd too improve quality. After World War II, grain finishing supplanted grass finishing so the age of the steers dropped from 4 too 2 years old. The U.S. government stepped in and created quality grades too distinguish the best carcasses from the other carcasses, dividing the kill into Prime, Choice, Good (Select today), Standard and the cow classifications. Neighborhood butcher shops were replaced by supermarkets and processors began selling boxed beef instead of whole sides allowing stores/restaurants too specialize in just the easiest too prepare cuts (ribeyes, strips, T-bones, and sirloins) and forcing the industry too grind up most of the chucks, rounds, and briskets into burgermeat (once just used for trimmings) where once those were marketed too the public as steaks and roasts. For some cook now to tell me that there is was something wrong with his 18 month old, grain finished, Angus ribeye steak makes me say "bullsh*t"!!! The problem is with the cook and it is almost ALWAYS due to laziness.

Well I guess I owe you an apology. This isn't about BEEF at all it's about a chef somewhere that started a rather large fire under your rear end.

I won't argue the point anymore it's waste of time. It would have been nice to hear what your credentials were though. Oh well maybe another time. Conversation is a funny thing. Let someone talk long enough and the truth will come out.

I guess that's why my grandfather used to tell us to talk to outsiders as little as possible. His theory(and he was right) was the less you talk the less prople will know your business. Of course that all sounded much more profound and wiser in Italian. :cowboy:

Brandonm you have a good day. Me, well I am going back to bed and see if I can survive the flu.

 

[grubbie]

"All you grass fed guys",.....like we are a bunch of circus freaks or something. I am a "grass fed guy". I think the beef is healthier, but that's not why I do it, and that's another thread. The beef also tastes very good. But try and raise grass fed beef without enough grass, and it is not going to turn out very well. I recently have tasted some. We raise it that way because we have so much grass, and it is easier and cheaper to just let them graze their way to finish rather than feed them out. If I didnt have so much grass, I would have to feed grain. But my steer this year weighed 1200 lbs. on grass, so for now,..I am one of those circus freak "grass fed guys".

 

[Beckett]

For some cook now to tell me that there is was something wrong with his 18 month old, grain finished, Angus ribeye steak makes me say "bullsh*t"!!! The problem is with the cook and it is almost ALWAYS due to laziness.

I just went and told my wife that. Looks like i'll be cooking tonight.

I have had beef with a "off taste" to it.. I dont buy from the place anymore.