After first calf breeding difficulties

[Nesikep]

I thought you were a lower mainland guy... my bad, though you're closer to me than I figured... That being said, I'd also add Phosphorus to the list then.

Do your cattle go on range in the summer?

 

[Nite Hawk]

We only have a very small place and only a few critters, don't have range, and really don't like running animals on range ( my personal opinion) I know animals that ended up 50 miles from the home place, and the only way they came home was the brand on the hide. They went through drift fences etc and just kept traveling.Every year a number of cattle simply do not come in, either stolen or ate by wild animals, as often their owner never sees all of them till fall. If they get sick, unless someone sees them, and calls the owner, well they either get better on their own or die.
A fellow I know quite well used to run cattle on range, and when he got a few extra acres and stopped using range, his average fall weight gain was 100 lbs heavier on his pastured cattle than the range fed animals.
Makes quite a bit of difference at the stockyards and with the paycheck..

 

[Nesikep]

I am reluctant to look for range for the same reasons, and because I'll probably end up with wild critters that are harder to work with when I need to. I would like to be able to get rid of the cattle for 2 months of the year though, it would really help with pasture management.
Purity Feeds in Kamloops *had* good livestock mineral, I was using the 6:12 beef and it was good until they started messing with the formula... they cut the Selenium down 75%, as well as reduced copper and a bunch of other important ones, I chewed their arses out 2 weeks ago when I got home and read the tag and found out it wasn't what I was expecting... They said I could return it (and drive 300 miles to do it)... Fellow said he's working on getting the original formula again.. I'll let you know how that goes.. Perhaps there's a good feed place in Williams Lake that has something equivalent.. worth a try.
I'd look for a copper content of about 2500 ppm, Selenium at 75-125 ppm, and more phosphorus than calcium (6:12 means 6%Ca, 12%P) and is a good starting point, they also had 9:18, but cost a bunch more.

 

[Nite Hawk]

We just use a mineral plus selenium salt lick, and selenium/vit E injection at birth..
If I remember right sometimes an injectable multi-vitamin when they are run down after a long winter.
Concerning range, I realize that some people don't have enough land besides their hay pasture, but in a number of cases, it is a matter of improving the land they have to be able to gaze their animals at home.
The difference in animal health and weight gain is quite a bit.
I have seen butchered and dead animals
on a number of occasions out in the bush, I have been the bearer of bad news to the owner that they have a dead or sick animal in different areas.(most animals are branded in this area, and I have an idea of who's animals are running in a given area)
and at the current prices of cattle it is a big loss to lose an animal when it possibly don't need to happen.
Often the owner doesn't keep a close eye on things either

 

[Nesikep]

The selenium salt blocks are ok for bulls, and cows that aren't producing because they don't have any phosphorus or calcium in them... And they're expensive for what you get. They do have a good amount of Se (90ppm), but are FAR short on copper (300mg/kg while I like about 2500)

My cattle are pets, I'd be going to see them on a regular basis.. I also know each one 'personally', so I'd feel if there's one missing. As it stands, I'm looking to perhaps rent some pasture on a ranch a couple miles down the road..

 

[Nite Hawk]

pasture rental is possibly a better idea as they grow and fatten better than on range, like I said earlier, as long as you can keep 1/2 an eye on them, and no predators can harass them and cause problems.
I know what you mean they can become friendly and like to get scratched,and most of the time ours come when called.
I still keep an eye on their body language, as they can knock you around if
they are in a hurry trying to get away from another dominate animal, or being rough.
I also still expect them to respect me and my space and not walk all over me, as they are bigger and can hurt you even when not being mean.
When I bark "back up" I expect them to back up
and "give" space to us as they would to a dominate animal. And yes they know what "back up" means.
I figure if cattle can be trained to pull, and know the difference between "gee" and "haw" they can learn what "back up" means if they are getting too close.
Just the way I do things..

 

[Nesikep]

Mine come when I'm not calling them, there are just so many eyes and ears there nothing gets by them... I've trained mine to know what "Be nice" means, as well as "get out of there" (be it a fence or the feed bunk), and most know their names too... They actually listen pretty well when I tell them to get their heads out of the fence, of course for the incorrigible ones, they pull their head out, look at me, walk a couple paces, and back through the fence they go. Cattle aren't easy to train like dogs, but they're still darned smart when it suits them.

 

[Nite Hawk]

Well alot are not as dumb as some people think they are,(although I have seens some that are as dumb as a stump) but they might be a bit "bull headed" though!

 

[Nesikep]

certainly... but they tend to be smartest when it suits them. IE, how to open a gate to a nice green field... closing the gate is beyond them!

 

[branguscowgirl]

Inyati's cows can even talk! :lol:

 

[Nite Hawk]

The young cow that was having a few settling problems is too smart for her own good.
You could tie her up with a rope halter, and she knew exactly how to move to get it off and literally race to the 4-H steers grain and slide it out of his reach.I have watched her do it more than once.
We ended up double tyeing her with a neck rope to keep her out of trouble.
So some are smart.
Have seen some incredibly stupid ones too though, dumber than a stump, would not have survived if they had been out in the bush..