300 lbs. calves -- I just can't keep them healthy!

[raykour]

Is this normal?

This is the first year I have bought 300 weight calves. I bought 4 heifers and one steer. 2 of the heifers I fed on a bottle.

While they rarely have any notable snot, they cough. Sometimes their appetites are so-so. Sometimes they run fevers. Did I mention they cough? I have treated them all, at least once (at separate times), with a round of Nuflor. They have been poured. They can get out of the Colorado weather (sheds, even a stall in the barn is open to them) There is 10 acres of field and a paddock with a round bale and they get concentrate morning and night.

What gives that these spoiled rotten calves won't do good? Did I get unlucky enough to have a whole batch of chronics? Or is this common? If so, screw this and I will get 500 weights next year.

 

[tsmaxx47]

assuming that you did not buy sick stock; it must be something they are picking up at your place, someplace. my approach would be to get ahold of a pro and get serious about identifying the problem.........would be interested in finding out what you come up with. by the way, what breed are they?

 

[regolith]

respiratory is hard to clear up.
There's others will know more about the conditions/treatment in your area, but certainly an animal that's been sick can look not right for a long time after, even if the problem has been effectively treated. I'm thinking maybe 3 - 8 weeks would be normal, I've got calves that had a bout of scours that long ago and still don't look in top health.
The bigger question is whether the initial problem has been effectively treated. That is, are you looking at chronic pneumonia or recovering animals?
I don't know how you'd tell the difference, short of waiting to see.

 

[raykour]

There is
1 - Jersey heifer - purchased directly from a well known dairy as a 3 week old calf
1 - Black Baldy heifer (who I have had the least problems with)
1 - Hereford Steer
1 - Black Angus Heifer
1 - Maine Anjou Heifer - bottle calf, got coccidiosis but never any appreciable respiratory issues. However, she breathes like a freight train. But maybe that is just her.

What prompted me to write this is the hereford steer, who 10 days into treatment. I first used Nuflor. He first symptoms were cough and fever. If a person didn't know better, they might think he just has a cough, but you can notice his increased respirations if you watch close. Not snot or runny eyes. He eats OK (even pushes some of heifers out of the grain pans) but today I went to check them all and he had a temperature of 106.7! The angus heifer was 103.7 (with no appreciable symptoms of any kind of illness) and the jersey 103.2. The maine and the baldy, who both cough, were 102.0. I would think hereford would seem a whole heck of alot sicker with a fever like that! So I treated him with Excede. This is the first time I have busted out with that. It makes me wonder if at one time or another, one of these heifers (primarily the maine) was that sick but trying to be conservative I did not treat her and now she sounds like an airplane flying over. However, I just don't see how she would have gotten better without treatment if she had a bug like that. If this hereford steer was a on a lot, no one would be treating him right now. He would come up to the bunk to eat and not catch anyone's eye.

I live in Colorado, where the temperature swings are pretty impressive and probably a good bit of the problem. About a month ago we had some 40 and 50 degree temp swings, and when I went to check on my pastured cattle I found 2 good sized (500-600 lbs) unweaned steers in pretty sore shape. Dumpy, snotting, mamas bags tight. I brought them up and treated them with Nuflor and they were fine in 3 days. I watch these little ones like a hawk (feed 2 times per day and out there a lot more)

How do you identify the problem? Swab, culture or do you know? How do you tell a difference between a "chronic" and one with an active infections, aside from fever or they fact that despite huffing and puffing they continue to eat and don't keel over after a couple of months?

 

[regolith]

The obvious answer is to call in a vet, let him do the examination and tests and do what he advises.
After you've spent a bit doing that a few times, you might be re-thinking whether it's good advice or no.

Choosing older animals in future probably will result in their having a greater capability to shrug off stresses and pathogens without getting sick. However, that means someone else needs to have got them through the younger and more vulnerable stage healthy.

 

[Lane]

Raykour;

I have a stocker operation and buy 3 wt. calves weekly. I ride my traps twice
daily to check calves. I make all calves get up as I go by and you will learn
the calves that don't feel good. They are slow to get up, don't want to move,
and may walk with their head down and you will usually see them working a
little harder to breathe. I identify and treat them immediately. I record any
treatments and check to see if they have had any previous problems. From
experience I see chronics break back in a few weeks, or when they are stressed
from weather or being moved.

We mass treat with a long-lasting antibiotic upon purchase and vaccinate and
booster all calves for upper respiratory diseases, Pasturella, and Blackleg. I
have always found that timely treatment will save most calves. If you see a
problem you need to address it immediately. Hope this helps.

Lane

 

[piedmontese]

i always use draxxin and have never been unhappy with it.i used to use nuflor and it was ok but required alot of re-treats.

 

[raykour]

Thanks for all the input.

Lane, I check these cows at least 4 times a day. I have been hesitant to automatically treat when I bring them home, because BRD can take such a long time to manifest. However, I guess it might not be bad practice, and if something gets sick later I can always treat them then.

Lucky for me I had to have the vet out today anyway, because the most troublesome calf, there hereford, was bloated and in real trouble. While I understand the mechanics of treating bloat, I have never done it before I didn't feel really comfortable. We stuck a needle in him because according to the vet he was about to pop, and then went to work tubing him and administering therabloat, etc. Now on top the respiratory issues he has the stress of the bloat to contend with too :-(. I hope he makes it but I am kind of 50/50 at this point. I don't want to go out there in 20 degrees at 10 pm and find him bloated again. THAT will be fun.

 

[HEREFORD ROADHOG]

once they bloat that bad it usually will re-occur you might go out & find him stiff the next time. I would consider getting rid of the worst ones,just to avoid another year of problems,but letting them know at the sale barn the problems,or to sell for slaughter ,so as not to dump them on someone else..

 

[raykour]

Hereford Roadhog he hasn't died yet but he has bloated again yesterday and today. Never as severe as the first time though.

Tube, relief, back to eating, repeat.

Good times!

 

[BryanM]

I by no means am an expert with cattle but have run into the same situation with a bloating calf. This is what worked for me. No more grain for 4 to 6wks only grass hay. Second, we used probiaos from a tsc. Need to reset his stomach to get the stomach organisms back too functioning the way its suppose too.

I have too tell you I learned alot about handling a calf in a short period of time. After an expensive wkend afterhours visit by the vet which she showed me how too tube for bloat. Which was done many times after the vet visit. Bloat takes time too take care of but you can get them out of trouble if presistant.

 

[Kathie in Thorp]

I have no good advice for you. I buy nothing from the sale yards - I buy direct from folks that I know, that have been raising beef for years OR local that keep darn good care and have records to back it up. So far, so good . . .

 

[dun]

We went throug ha period when we treated bloat almost everyday. It was alwasys the same few calves. A coule of them we didn;t catch in time and they died. When I wacked them open I found everyone of them had liver damage.

 

[Mid South Guy]

Whenever I had a chronic bloater, I just top dressed its grain mix with 1-2 tablespoons of mineral oil at every feeding and fed coarse stem grass hay. That seem to stop and prevent the bloating problem. Keep legumes (alfalfa, clover. etc.) away from it.

 

[raykour]

This chronic bloat thing is for the birds I tell ya. I have tubed him 2 x a day since Friday.

Today, I gave him therabloat, an entire container of Activia yogurt, and 2 scoops of probios in the mix.
Not sure of anything else I can do! He feels pretty crappy in the mornings but after I burp him he perks up. Hardly bad enough to justify tubing him in the evenings but want to make I do my best. Hopefully all this stuff will start to work out and help his rumen get back to normal.

 

[dun]

If it works maybe Janie Lee Curtis will start using you in her ads

 

[raykour]

If it works maybe Janie Lee Curtis will start using you in her ads

smart alec :cboy: It was on sale for nearly the same price as anything else and I figured it couldn't hurt!

 

[raykour]

Sign me up as an activia spokesperson.

It has been 18 hours and he is not bloated at all. Usually he is quite tight in the morning.

 

[raykour]

Update that this calf has continued to bloat. Sometimes enough I need to tube him only once a day, sometimes twice. Use of therabloat doesn't seem to make a difference.

I was able to get harvested rumen contents from a fistulated cow from Colorado STate University (the cost is not prohibitive at all) and drained a bunch of that nasty junk into the calf this afternoon. Locked him in a tiny pen with a bloat block stuck in front of him and we'll see what goes on tomorrow. If after 48 hours he is still bloating, he is getting his own handy cannula. I have put too much time and money into him to let him croak over another $50 procedure.

The other 4 calves seem to be doing well.

 

[kenny thomas]

raykour, keep posting. I have been able to stop bloat by putting the calf on dry hay and very little or no feed but as soon as I turned them back out on grass they bloat again. I have never stopped one completely. Would love to know how for sure.