What do you expect a horse to know after he's been with a trainer for 30 days? I've got a bunch of colts I'm riding, I like the way they handle but I don't know how they compare to what other green broke horses know.
30 days of training...
- Thread starter milkmaid
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chippie
Well-known member
Walk, jog, lope both ways on correct lead. Halt and back. Start moving off of leg and yielding using a direct rein.
hayray
Well-known member
I used to do it fast like that as a kid, make sure they canter both ways and such, but now I go alot slower, which is safer and better. I no pretty much make sure the ground work is great and maybe not even ride them much at all within the first 30 days. Of course I found that taking horses in training in later years was far more dangerous and time consuming then just saddle breaking your own home raised horses.
milkmaid":3qv7gp07 said:
To have no new neurosis, not be harder to catch, and to buck me off on a less regular basis than before he/she went to the "trainer". Does that tell you anything about the "trainers" in my area? :roll:
I would be ticked with just being relaxed and giving to pressure.
Sometimes you just have to be satisfied with behaving themselves and still learning how to relax and give to pressure the first 30-60 days. The smarter horses(performance bred) tend to take longer to get going in the first 30- 60 days But they make up for time lost in the next 30-60 days. And end up ahead of the early starters by day 90- 120 days.
I don't rush starting a horse- you only get to do it right once and its not a race.
Sometimes you just have to be satisfied with behaving themselves and still learning how to relax and give to pressure the first 30-60 days. The smarter horses(performance bred) tend to take longer to get going in the first 30- 60 days But they make up for time lost in the next 30-60 days. And end up ahead of the early starters by day 90- 120 days.
I don't rush starting a horse- you only get to do it right once and its not a race.
hayray
Well-known member
Well stated Howdy! Canter after 30 days does not mean anything compared to working on basics of pressure response and relaxation. Looking down the road 6 months later is a better test. A lot of horses pushed more after 30 days are still only doing the same stuff 6 months later.
spinandslide
Well-known member
This...provided the horse has been handled abit on the ground and isnt a total fruitloopchippie":3ijdqskc said:
MistyMorning
Well-known member
milkmaid":2w0cozga said:
Now I'm no trainer, there are those out there that know a lot more than I do, but IMHO a greenbroke colt shouldn't be loped during the first 30 days of training. Like others said, good ground manners, when you get up top, walk, trot, STOP on hoa!
cow pollinater
Well-known member
Are we talking doesn't know anything or greenbroke needs a few miles?
Instead of asking us, why not ask the owners up front what they expect? Be upfront and honest and tell them that thirty days isn't alot of time and that the horse is the limiting factor.
Personally, I'd rather see a horse develop slowly with no bad habits than pushed to learn alot fast. I've been around alot of really well trained horses where the limiting factors on their value were dumb stuff like not leading well or being a little cinchy. If I sent a horse to someone and they never got past getting a saddle on the horse but it got done right that's better than having a cinchy horse that sets back every time you get them out for the next fifteen years.
Instead of asking us, why not ask the owners up front what they expect? Be upfront and honest and tell them that thirty days isn't alot of time and that the horse is the limiting factor.
Personally, I'd rather see a horse develop slowly with no bad habits than pushed to learn alot fast. I've been around alot of really well trained horses where the limiting factors on their value were dumb stuff like not leading well or being a little cinchy. If I sent a horse to someone and they never got past getting a saddle on the horse but it got done right that's better than having a cinchy horse that sets back every time you get them out for the next fifteen years.
Hmmm. Interesting food for thought, thanks guys. I've seen some variations of "30 days" ...seems not all 30 day horses are made equal... but at least in my neck of the woods 30 days seems to mean 30 days of riding, and those horses are expected to lope. The colts I have here are mine... got some others in that belong to other people that just need some miles, but the ones I'm starting from scratch are mine. Just not quite sure what they ought to know; I've rode a lot of years but never started any. They currently range from 10 to 20 rides. They'll give to pressure, move off your leg, stop, back, give to the bit, walk, trot, lope... working on consistent balanced circles... and then I ride them on trails and out on the desert, sometimes alone, sometimes with a group... they handle pretty decent. Not ready for inexperienced riders by any means, but they handle good for me. Got two stud colts here (won't be studs tomorrow!) and they ride alright but are a little hotter. Finally got them both to relax by the end of the ride today, one has had some handling before, the other was essentially untouched. I rode them both on the desert with one of the local trainers yesterday; he rides a lot faster than I do and his colts were a little spooky... got one of the studs up tight and I don't think it helped either. They'd been real quiet for me. Got a gaited gelding that's real quiet and could probably let Mom ride him... she's had her eye on him for a few weeks and I think she'll confiscate him this fall rather than let me sell him... LOL.
Good point. I'm going to have to keep that one in mind. Thanks.
Good point. I'm going to have to keep that one in mind. Thanks.
spinandslide
Well-known member
MM-most "good minded" horses are where you want them at thirty days..w-t-l..stop, back, learning some lateral type work (sidepassing, starting turns on the haunches, starting giving their rear to me when I ask)..same as what you said above..the pukes arent..and IMO, you send them home to the owner telling them to sell..why put money into a horse that is going to fight you every step of the way. :?:
I was loping my pony after the fifth ride...first time ever out of the roundpen too. if they are ready for it, why hold them back, within reason of course.
...
she is broker now with only about 90 saddlings then some horses with a year under their belts..
the key with a young horse is not the QUANTITY of work, but the QUALITY..my pony is the perfect example. she hasnt had a bunch of saddle time..but the time she has had has been quality work, so she is advancing faster then a horse who has had more time, but not as much actual "training"
I was loping my pony after the fifth ride...first time ever out of the roundpen too. if they are ready for it, why hold them back, within reason of course.
...she is broker now with only about 90 saddlings then some horses with a year under their belts..
the key with a young horse is not the QUANTITY of work, but the QUALITY..my pony is the perfect example. she hasnt had a bunch of saddle time..but the time she has had has been quality work, so she is advancing faster then a horse who has had more time, but not as much actual "training"
Thought maybe a video would help...
20 rides on this colt, arena work is from the first couple minutes of our warm-up, and the stuff outside the arena is from ride 16.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nZcewjv7cQI
He does leg yields at a trot and will turn both directions on his haunches, it just didn't end up on the video. We're working on giving to the bit etc, he doesn't have wolf teeth but does pack his head a little. We're working on the flexibility issues. He's the stud colt-now-gelding I mentioned before, finally getting him to relax when we're working, he tends to be a little more up tight.
This one's a four year old who got himself enrolled in Attitude Adjustment 101 (I didn't start this guy!) but is handling really nice now. The video's from last week after he decided to throw a tantrum and go over backwards... but I think we might have that worked out now. I'm probably going to ride him English... he'd make a lovely dressage horse. I kinda like this colt.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HhhJn_bAbns
20 rides on this colt, arena work is from the first couple minutes of our warm-up, and the stuff outside the arena is from ride 16.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nZcewjv7cQI
He does leg yields at a trot and will turn both directions on his haunches, it just didn't end up on the video. We're working on giving to the bit etc, he doesn't have wolf teeth but does pack his head a little. We're working on the flexibility issues. He's the stud colt-now-gelding I mentioned before, finally getting him to relax when we're working, he tends to be a little more up tight.
This one's a four year old who got himself enrolled in Attitude Adjustment 101 (I didn't start this guy!) but is handling really nice now. The video's from last week after he decided to throw a tantrum and go over backwards... but I think we might have that worked out now. I'm probably going to ride him English... he'd make a lovely dressage horse. I kinda like this colt.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HhhJn_bAbns
cow pollinater
Well-known member
On that first colt, run his reins one at a time through the sturrups and tie them with just a little pressure somewhere on the back of your saddle and let him stand that way. Do one rein at a time and both for short periods. As soon as you see his head give, let him go and he'll pack his head nice from here on out.
He seams from that short video to have a good head on his shoulders.
If you like the second one, you can keep him.
I've only had one that wanted to roll over on me and I jerked him all the way back and then stepped off and let him fall and then I got him up and worked him until he couldn't hardly stand up anymore. He was a bronc and that was just one of his tricks. I never did get him to where I could trust him. I can stand some buck but goofy doesn't go away.
I find it very telling that you have his head tied down and a crash helmet on. Don't plan on that changing anytime soon. Maybe use the same trick as above but run it between his front legs and tie off to the cinch so that if he flips out he learns that it hurts. Get a good side pass on him so that if his head starts coming up you can disengage his rear end and put him back on the ground.
He seams from that short video to have a good head on his shoulders.
If you like the second one, you can keep him.
I've only had one that wanted to roll over on me and I jerked him all the way back and then stepped off and let him fall and then I got him up and worked him until he couldn't hardly stand up anymore. He was a bronc and that was just one of his tricks. I never did get him to where I could trust him. I can stand some buck but goofy doesn't go away.
I find it very telling that you have his head tied down and a crash helmet on. Don't plan on that changing anytime soon. Maybe use the same trick as above but run it between his front legs and tie off to the cinch so that if he flips out he learns that it hurts. Get a good side pass on him so that if his head starts coming up you can disengage his rear end and put him back on the ground.
First colt... yep, I did do that for the first couple days, more so I could turn him and/or get his head around if he tried to blow up when I first got on. I'm one really lousy bronc rider. Just haven't done it since and probably ought to re-visit it. I've got side reins left over from my English days and might just use those.
Second colt... if my folks had their way, I'd have the helmet every time I was riding. I rode English - Pony Club - for a lot of years and the USPC motto was "Every time, every ride." Used the cross-country vest for jumping too. Nowdays I'll put the first couple rides on a colt with the helmet and vest, or the ones that have given me problems... ie the sorrel had bucked me off the day before that video. His head's not tied down, just have a running martingale on, same as the bay colt. We'll see but he's been handling really nice. Really nice ride now, been quiet and does what he's told immediately. Giving the bay colt the day off today and taking the sorrel on a ride up in the mountains, need to find out how he'll cross bridges, water, etc.
Second colt... if my folks had their way, I'd have the helmet every time I was riding. I rode English - Pony Club - for a lot of years and the USPC motto was "Every time, every ride." Used the cross-country vest for jumping too. Nowdays I'll put the first couple rides on a colt with the helmet and vest, or the ones that have given me problems... ie the sorrel had bucked me off the day before that video. His head's not tied down, just have a running martingale on, same as the bay colt. We'll see but he's been handling really nice. Really nice ride now, been quiet and does what he's told immediately. Giving the bay colt the day off today and taking the sorrel on a ride up in the mountains, need to find out how he'll cross bridges, water, etc.
cow pollinater
Well-known member
My apologies, milkmaid. After reading back through here today I realize that I may have come accross as even more of a jerk than I really am.
In summary of what I saw on the video without telling you how to do it (since I also noticed that you do know how to sit a horse),
the first colt looks like he'll only get better. He's paying attention to what you ask him to do and thinking clearly, at least from what I saw yesterday.
The second one acts like he's still in panic mode, at least from what I saw yesterday. That will get you hurt bad if he doesn't learn to get out of that mode.
I have road-rash scars up one side of my body and slight hearing loss from the multiple cuncussions caused by an accident on a young horse that nearly killed me.
I still never wear protective gear(I also don't ride anything but broke horses and nice minded colts) but I'll never think less of anyone that does and my apologies if my coments made you embarrased of the gear.
In summary of what I saw on the video without telling you how to do it (since I also noticed that you do know how to sit a horse),
the first colt looks like he'll only get better. He's paying attention to what you ask him to do and thinking clearly, at least from what I saw yesterday.
The second one acts like he's still in panic mode, at least from what I saw yesterday. That will get you hurt bad if he doesn't learn to get out of that mode.
I have road-rash scars up one side of my body and slight hearing loss from the multiple cuncussions caused by an accident on a young horse that nearly killed me.
I still never wear protective gear(I also don't ride anything but broke horses and nice minded colts) but I'll never think less of anyone that does and my apologies if my coments made you embarrased of the gear.
Oh, no worries - no offense was taken. Here's the sorrel colt today, he's riding pretty quiet now.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_qroFObjayw
I'm always open to suggestions... I find you can gain useful information from almost everyone. :lol: No offense taken, hope you didn't think I'd gotten my hackles up too far. lol. ;-)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_qroFObjayw
I'm always open to suggestions... I find you can gain useful information from almost everyone. :lol: No offense taken, hope you didn't think I'd gotten my hackles up too far. lol. ;-)
Wish you were closer- I'd send you a horse
I too liked the first horse better- for the same reasons. I'm old and not into excitement anymore.
although the third video of him walking over the bridge looked just fine.
Everytime I see a young horse hyper collected it raises red flags as to WHY? usually the answer is that the horse is pushing himself into the bit. I like a relaxed mind and the collection and controlled power coming from me asking for it over time.
I too liked the first horse better- for the same reasons. I'm old and not into excitement anymore.
although the third video of him walking over the bridge looked just fine.
Everytime I see a young horse hyper collected it raises red flags as to WHY? usually the answer is that the horse is pushing himself into the bit. I like a relaxed mind and the collection and controlled power coming from me asking for it over time.
hayray
Well-known member
Hey nice ride on that video. That is a nice horse and riding sure is nice. What is that fancy arena that you are riding in?
