Upgrade or Resource bull? Gelbvieh?

[Lrj505]

I am going to venture out and ai about 10 of my best angus/black cows. I called Genex and they recommended Resource if I went with angus or upgrade for Simmental. My goals are most likely to keep the best bull calves one for me and a couple to sell to family, and sell the rest. I am not breeding hiefers only cows. I am not set on either bull so I am asking for suggestions on bulls? Also was recommended to get a gelbvieh? Any experience or pics of calves? Thanks.

 

[Bright Raven]

I have used a lot of Upgrade. Ringer who rarely posts on here, has two of my Upgrade heifers. However, there are a couple big time guys that say they don't like his feet. I have not seen bad feet expressed on any of mine. His calves are heavy muscled, robust. Gain like gangbusters. Would be ideal for producing pounds.

 

[Lrj505]

How well do his calves sell? Surely I wouldn't want to take them to sale barn .

 

[Bright Raven]

How well do his calves sell? Surely I wouldn't want to take them to sale barn .

Well. In the top 10 used Simmental bulls from 2016 to 2017.

 

[Air gator]

If you google Sav Resource and Cattletoday you will get a lot of feedback from people who have used him.
Also, if you google Sav Resource and steerplanet you will get a great thread with photos.
I would opt for Resource because of birthweights.

 

[Tbrake]

I have used both bulls. Very happy with both. Upgrades flat out grow. I have some 16 month old bred heifers from him that look awesome.
Only have a handful of resource, but they have been very impressive. I'm more familiar with renown.
I have a very hard time selling simiangus bulls, I even thought they were better than the angus. That is the reason I quit using upgrade.
My renown's pretty much sell themselves. I can't raise enough of them.

 

[Tbrake]

A good black gelbvieh would do you well also. Mine grow very and my balancers are the most productive cows I have. I have never AI to gelvieh bulls, just because the lack of selection.
If your wanting to sell bulls, I would personally stick to full blood. Some people can sell composite bulls, but I sure couldn't

 

[Lrj505]

Bull barn recommended a Gelbvieh bull named Lifeline.

 

[Bright Raven]

Lrj505

I sent Fire Sweep a request to post her comments on Upgrade. She knows every American Simmental bull of any significance since the breed was established in North America. Hint: Upgrade is one of her favorites.

 

[Fire Sweep Ranch]

lol, thanks Ron.
I have used Upgrade, a BUNCH. I have even used a son of Upgrade a time or two when needed. Upgrade is a meat maker. His calves grow, and mash the scales. I have NEVER had problems selling in Upgrade sired bull, and we have ran with one to the carcass contest this year who did outstanding on the rail. You have to use him on good footed females, I have heard of the back feet having issues but have not really experienced it. I had probably 12 Upgrade females in production, all were great cows that had enough milk, however they have weeded themselves out over the years due to not breeding back in a timely manner. I still have 3, and I love those three. They will stay as long as they give a calf every year.
I will continue to use Upgrade, and have never had a problem selling Sim Angus bulls. The market is tough this year, in our area. No rain, no hay, and no one is buying right now.

 

[southernultrablack]

Bull barn recommended a Gelbvieh bull named Lifeline.

If your wanting to go with a Purebred bull, check out these two bulls

http://bullbarn.com/gelbepdAMGV.asp?ID=524

http://bullbarn.com/gelbepdAMGV.asp?ID=523

 

[Lrj505]

So if I use upgrade on my best cows would it be worth keeping one as a bull? Being that my cows are just big and have an unknown history. Would it make sense to purchase a known genetically superior cow(s) and ai them to upgrade or Chief Justice so that I can have bull(s) that make scale smashing calves ? What kind of cows should I buy or where ? I want a bull that makes heavy calves. Thanks you guys are great! I have a huge angus now but haven't got any calves out of him. And I know big at 2 doesn't mean big ww,yw,bw. I included pic of him.

 

[Bright Raven]

So if I use upgrade on my best cows would it be worth keeping one as a bull? Being that my cows are just big and have an unknown history. Would it make sense to purchase a known genetically superior cow(s) and ai them to upgrade or Chief Justice so that I can have bull(s) that make scale smashing calves ? What kind of cows should I buy or where ? I want a bull that makes heavy calves. Thanks you guys are great! I have a huge angus now but haven't got any calves out of him. And I know big at 2 doesn't mean big ww,yw,bw. I included pic of him.

Point 1. Observation on the pictured bull: He does not carry heavy bone down into his lower legs. Simmental carry heavy bone. Bone =muscle.

Point 2. Breeding cows to Upgrade that have no known pedigree leaves you vulnerable to possible shortcomings in the ancestors of the cow.

Point 3. If you decide to purchase cows with known pedigrees, decide on a breed and check for reputable breeders of that breed in your area. Breed associations have directories that will get you started.

 

[elkwc]

It is hard for me to tell a lot by pictures but I would say he is above average for an Angus bull. At least in this area. He will likely sire some good calves for you. Again his bone is above average for the Angus I see. You don't see many big boned Angus. I have one and I see a few lines where they are. I like the big bone but it isn't a deal breaker with me.

 

[Bright Raven]

It is hard for me to tell a lot by pictures but I would say he is above average for an Angus bull. At least in this area. He will likely sire some good calves for you. Again his bone is above average for the Angus I see. You don't see many big boned Angus. I have one and I see a few lines where they are. I like the big bone but it isn't a deal breaker with me.

I am glad you posted that. My cows are Simmental and the cannon bone is twice that big. Not just the bulls but even the cows. It is a difference in breeds I assume. I will say, I see the Boyd's Angus. Their Angus are muscular and heavy boned. People talk about no butt on Angus. I see a lot of their bulls with massive behinds.

 

[True Grit Farms]

It is hard for me to tell a lot by pictures but I would say he is above average for an Angus bull. At least in this area. He will likely sire some good calves for you. Again his bone is above average for the Angus I see. You don't see many big boned Angus. I have one and I see a few lines where they are. I like the big bone but it isn't a deal breaker with me.

I am glad you posted that. My cows are Simmental and the cannon bone is twice that big. Not just the bulls but even the cows. It is a difference in breeds I assume. I will say, I see the Boyd's Angus. Their Angus are muscular and heavy boned. People talk about no butt on Angus. I see a lot of their bulls with massive behinds.

Can't eat bone, maybe that's another reason Angus influenced calves bring the most at the sale barn.

 

[Bright Raven]

It is hard for me to tell a lot by pictures but I would say he is above average for an Angus bull. At least in this area. He will likely sire some good calves for you. Again his bone is above average for the Angus I see. You don't see many big boned Angus. I have one and I see a few lines where they are. I like the big bone but it isn't a deal breaker with me.

I am glad you posted that. My cows are Simmental and the cannon bone is twice that big. Not just the bulls but even the cows. It is a difference in breeds I assume. I will say, I see the Boyd's Angus. Their Angus are muscular and heavy boned. People talk about no butt on Angus. I see a lot of their bulls with massive behinds.

Can't eat bone, maybe that's another reason Angus influenced calves bring the most at the sale barn.

Cannot eat bone is right. Study anatomy and you will quickly see the relationship between bone and muscle. It takes bone mass for muscle insertion. If you ain't got mass - you ain't going to have as much muscle. Bone = muscle. Now: it is not an exact relationship. If the belly of the muscle is large, finer bone will support a quantity of more muscle. But it is a generally recognized relationship. Holds true in all mammals.

 

[Stocker Steve]

I am going to venture out and ai about 10 of my best angus/black cows. I called Genex and they recommended Resource if I went with angus or upgrade for Simmental. My goals are most likely to keep the best bull calves one for me and a couple to sell to family, and sell the rest.

I don't think you will get three to five above average bulls out of AIing 10 black cows with unknow backgrounds.
You might get one keeper. You might not.
Need to revisit the goal.

 

[Lrj505]

Any recommendations as to where I can pick up some genetic powerhouse females ? Or should I just spend the cash and buy a bull? If so where ?

 

[Bright Raven]

Any recommendations as to where I can pick up some genetic powerhouse females ? Or should I just spend the cash and buy a bull? If so where ?

"Genetic powerhouse females" is a matter of opinion in the eye of the beholder! BTW: That has a nice sound to it. I might use that in listing my heifers.

Restating your objective - you want a good bull. Is the bull you have pictured not to your satisfaction? If you are not producing seedstock, you may be fine with that bull on commercial cows. Establish your objectives first. List them based on your priorities.