Turn out cattle...

[Caustic Burno]

All,

I want to ask a question regarding my purchase of some commercial black angus based cattle (black and black white face). These cows are 3-5 yrs old. I have not seen them other than some pictures...but the seller says they need groceries. Some look better than others. I was thinking of purchasing a couple as the price is pretty low ($1250 ea). As you all know, I am building from nothing...and am not "flush" with cash...so I am thinking this may be a way to build my herd slowly and generate some income by breeding them. What are the thoughts here? I will look for the calm cows with good udders, and in the best body condition...is this plan something I should avoid? All comments welcome!!! Thanks for everything!

Tim

I buy some bred opportunity girls every year. Never pay more than slaughter price for the cow.
Put some groceries in them and sell the pair. If the cow looses the calf,with some pounds on the cow
you can break close to even plus or minus a few bucks. If they are not bred I wouldn't touch them.
By the time you pay that price get the cow in condition on a maybe she will breed and have a calf you are going to have a lot of nickels in her.

 

[denvermartinfarms]

Like CB pointed out, you say buy them and breed them, you don't need to be buying open cows to take a chance on. I assume they are bred because most people aren't trying to sell open cows off the farm to individuals.

if they are good young bred cows that just need a little improving I think it would be a very good deal for you.

 

[skyhightree1]

Tim,
I buy bred older cows that may need groceries or fell out of someone's calving sync program from the sale barn. I would HIGHLY recommend not touching open cows as was stated before and agree with. If it were me I would buy older bred cows from the barn to get me started good.

 

[Dave]

Thinner cows that they claim to be 3 - 5 year olds. I would want to pop their mouth open and look at their teeth. I would just look to make sure they have all their teeth and not someone selling broken mouth cows that they say are young and just need feed. Not that I am against buying broken mouth cows because I have done well doing that. But if they are old cows I want to pay old cow price. And I agree with everyone else bout them being bred. Again I have made money with thin open cows but the purchase price needs to reflect the fact that they are open.

 

[skyhightree1]

Again I have made money with thin open cows but the purchase price needs to reflect the fact that they are open.

This is very true - I can get older bred cows short bred that price all day long.

 

[Caustic Burno]

Quickest way to double your money on this deal is fold it over and put it in your back pocket.

 

[skyhightree1]

Quickest way to double your money on this deal is fold it over and put it in your back pocket.

I like that saying... :lol2:

 

[skyhightree1]

OK...thanks fellas...all very good points. I don't think they are bred...so I guess I will pass. What I liked about this was the ability for me to walk among the cows to see how they behaved, etc. I am very worried about buying crazy cattle from the sale barn...I don't want to deal with that LOL. Checking the teeth is a great suggestion. CB...and others...why not buy if open? Because they may not ever breed back? I take it this is a common problem...

Once again, thanks everyone for helping my decisions.

Tim

Tim,
When I go to the barn I go early and try to watch the animals get unloaded and see how they act. I also look for the farmer who brought them and if im interested in them I will ask him why he is selling them and about them. They are mostly honest about the reasoning. The main barn I buy in I am able to walk the alleys and go in the pens if I so choose. If you sit and watch them being handle or after they are in a pen you can see how calm they are. I have bought a cow that was trying to get all the people it came in contact with she was short bred I bought her for 800 bucks she was about 7 years old at the time the vet said I think maybe 8 but brought her home left her in a corral with another cow I had bought she calmed down after 2 weeks and to this day she is calm cool and collected. I think she came from some farm that had a bunch of cows that the person never interacted with the herd much. I see mine 2 times a day so that may have helped. I don't have a problem buying an open thin cow if all I plan on doing is getting her fat and then selling to make some $ off of her. I personally want to see that what im buying can be bred if I plan on putting her in my herd. Some of us here buy cows thin and fatten them up then ship them. With you wanting to put them in the herd you need to make sure they are functional by buying them bred because if you have a live calf and she raises it you can sell the calf and be ahead of the game so if she doesn't breed back that's money you are to the good when you sell her. I hope I explained it well

 

[Caustic Burno]

OK...thanks fellas...all very good points. I don't think they are bred...so I guess I will pass. What I liked about this was the ability for me to walk among the cows to see how they behaved, etc. I am very worried about buying crazy cattle from the sale barn...I don't want to deal with that LOL. Checking the teeth is a great suggestion. CB...and others...why not buy if open? Because they may not ever breed back? I take it this is a common problem...

Once again, thanks everyone for helping my decisions.

Tim

Ok lets say you buy these thin heifers for 1250 to condition.
Lets say it is 90 days before they are ready to breed @ 1.50 a day is another 135 bucks.
Introduce them to the bull, then 283 days till they hopefully have a live calf that is another 424 dollars in them.
So best case you have 1800 dollars a piece in them on a maybe that they will bred and produce.
You are BSing yourself writing a bunch of little checks.

 

[backhoeboogie]

There is no shame in going to the sale barn and dragging home an empty trailer. This is actually a sign of wisdom

 

[denvermartinfarms]

OK...thanks fellas...all very good points. I don't think they are bred...so I guess I will pass. What I liked about this was the ability for me to walk among the cows to see how they behaved, etc. I am very worried about buying crazy cattle from the sale barn...I don't want to deal with that LOL. Checking the teeth is a great suggestion. CB...and others...why not buy if open? Because they may not ever breed back? I take it this is a common problem...

Once again, thanks everyone for helping my decisions.

Tim

Ok lets say you buy these thin heifers for 1250 to condition.
Lets say it is 90 days before they are ready to breed @ 1.50 a day is another 135 bucks.
Introduce them to the bull, then 283 days till they hopefully have a live calf that is another 424 dollars in them.
So best case you have 1800 dollars a piece in them on a maybe that they will bred and produce.
You are BSing yourself writing a bunch of little checks.

And that's all assuming they don't have trich or a lepto problem that your bringing home. Why are they open?

 

[Dave]

OK...thanks fellas...all very good points. I don't think they are bred...so I guess I will pass. What I liked about this was the ability for me to walk among the cows to see how they behaved, etc. I am very worried about buying crazy cattle from the sale barn...I don't want to deal with that LOL. Checking the teeth is a great suggestion. CB...and others...why not buy if open? Because they may not ever breed back? I take it this is a common problem...

Once again, thanks everyone for helping my decisions.

Tim

Ok lets say you buy these thin heifers for 1250 to condition.
Lets say it is 90 days before they are ready to breed @ 1.50 a day is another 135 bucks.
Introduce them to the bull, then 283 days till they hopefully have a live calf that is another 424 dollars in them.
So best case you have 1800 dollars a piece in them on a maybe that they will bred and produce.
You are BSing yourself writing a bunch of little checks.

I would much rather buy a thin heifer to feed up and breed than a thin cow. The big question on these cows is why aren't they bred?

 

[Caustic Burno]

I am not buying a thin anything that is open.
Prefer SS heavies.

 

[cow pollinater]

Pass if they're open. Confirmed bred then it's a sweet deal as you can put weight on the cow and get your money back and then some AND have a few calves around to sell.

 

[BRYANT]

OK...thanks fellas...all very good points. I don't think they are bred...so I guess I will pass. What I liked about this was the ability for me to walk among the cows to see how they behaved, etc. I am very worried about buying crazy cattle from the sale barn...I don't want to deal with that LOL. Checking the teeth is a great suggestion. CB...and others...why not buy if open? Because they may not ever breed back? I take it this is a common problem...

Once again, thanks everyone for helping my decisions.

Tim

I have bought more than one Brahman cross bred cows that came in the sale blew snot and cleared everyone out most of the time I can take them home keep them in the lot with a calm cow and they will be fine and eating out of a bucket in a few days, not always but I bet I can 90% of the time. I look at their eyes and face there is some that has a certain look about them that I stay away from.
I bought a gray Brahman at the sale one day and two weeks later she was still bad maybe even worse so I took her back to another sale and she as so mean she would try to fight simi trucks while going down the highway .I thought she as going to tear the sides out of my trailer. She was young and heavy breed and the next week the man who bought her from when I sold her had her back again and that time she went to a killer buyer. You can make money on some of the wilder cows if you have good lots to hold them while you settle them down.

 

[Ojp6]

There are a pile of open cows that have just lost a calf going back to the country right now. Talked to a guy that buys some for us in Aberdeen SD and he said he bought a load of three and four year olds out of the kill pen with wet bags that weigh 1100 for 1.70 and they were going to Texas to get turned out with a bull. Earlier this spring in Montana I heard about a set of 65 heifers that had lost a calf on some big ranch that got brought into the Miles City salebarn that weighed 1080 brought 1.85 also going to Texas. People are giving big money for these young open cows because if you take them to 2 months bred they are bring 2000+ a lot of places.

 

[BRYANT]

There are a pile of open cows that have just lost a calf going back to the country right now. Talked to a guy that buys some for us in Aberdeen SD and he said he bought a load of three and four year olds out of the kill pen with wet bags that weigh 1100 for 1.70 and they were going to Texas to get turned out with a bull. Earlier this spring in Montana I heard about a set of 65 heifers that had lost a calf on some big ranch that got brought into the Miles City salebarn that weighed 1080 brought 1.85 also going to Texas. People are giving big money for these young open cows because if you take them to 2 months bred they are bring 2000+ a lot of places.

I am not trying to start no fight here but these numbers don't add up , they will have to bring way over 2000.00 for these people to make any money doing what you just said
1100 x 1.70 =1870.00
1080 x 1.85 = 1998.00
plus cost to keep them till bred and sold
plus cost of shipping , I don't know what that will be but I would think it would set you back a few bucks for sure.
plus there may be some that will not breed , you never know ??? Sounds like a way to lose some money to me. :2cents: :2cents:

 

[fenceman]

I bought some cows Wednesday. 2 pairs and ,3 ss ,2 s heavy bred. I don't buy cattle that aren't bred or dragging a small calf. Like someone else said. You have to wonder why is she not bred. To many bad reason s.

One of the bred cows. A nice big black girl with big ears. 8 months bred. You could hear the yelling. Watch this cow. As she came down the alley.she put everyone in the ring on the fence. The auctioneer says I'll just sell her by the pound. I bought her. I have to look but I think I have about 1400 in her. I had her put in the front by her self. It took Me my border collie, and nearly every one at the sale to load her. I unloaded the gentler bunch in a heifer pasture by the house. I took that long eared witch and dumped her in a pasture of about 150 acres. There's 19 dry cows in there that know my program.She had room to run and brush to hide in. This morning she came to the horn with the rest of the bunch. I poured out a line of cubes. She got right in line. Ready to be put on the payroll here. She will always be A little hard to handle. But I still say " ka....ching

 

[Son of Butch]

I appreciate all of the comments and thoughts...I guess I will pass...these girls are about 950 lbs and open.
Thanks all!
Tim

The right choice. They sounded like problem breeders. When building on a shoestring budget limiting risk is key.
3 in 1's are the lowest risk.

 

[Ojp6]

There are a pile of open cows that have just lost a calf going back to the country right now. Talked to a guy that buys some for us in Aberdeen SD and he said he bought a load of three and four year olds out of the kill pen with wet bags that weigh 1100 for 1.70 and they were going to Texas to get turned out with a bull. Earlier this spring in Montana I heard about a set of 65 heifers that had lost a calf on some big ranch that got brought into the Miles City salebarn that weighed 1080 brought 1.85 also going to Texas. People are giving big money for these young open cows because if you take them to 2 months bred they are bring 2000+ a lot of places.

I am not trying to start no fight here but these numbers don't add up , they will have to bring way over 2000.00 for these people to make any money doing what you just said
1100 x 1.70 =1870.00
1080 x 1.85 = 1998.00
plus cost to keep them till bred and sold
plus cost of shipping , I don't know what that will be but I would think it would set you back a few bucks for sure.
plus there may be some that will not breed , you never know ??? Sounds like a way to lose some money to me. :2cents: :2cents:

I know one guy that takes them to two months. He sells for around 2100+ depending on quality. He said to make the numbers work he buys them under 1500. He's had one cow that didn't breed so far out of a couple hundred simply because most cows that have had a calf will breed back and that's all he buys. I'm not saying its the right thing to do but money can be made. If you can own a load of cattle for 5 months, not feed them a thing except leased pasture grass, and sell them in the fall for 600 to 1000 a head higher you are bound to make some money.
With the really high dollar ones they probably weren't going to just keep them to two months but who knows. There are a lot of guys that think four to five month cows that are true 3 years olds will be up in that 2800-3000+ range come this fall and could be higher.