This AI stuff is getting frustrating

[Anonymous]

One cow, one of my favorites, has had 3 calves, and the one ive been trying to fine tune my skills on, I've put 3 straws in and today she was standing again
First straw was FTAI. Felt the cervical rings and almost felt like the tip of the gun fell right in but I never did get a good feel for the cervix
2nd straw was am/pm on standing heat, and couldn't find the cervix so I blind shot it
3rd straw am/pm again, but found the cervix barely wrist deep. Not rigid, only maybe 2 inches long and thumb thick.
So I was thinking I was over shooting the cervix and felt confident about hitting the target.
This eve, she was standing again. So Ill shoot one more straw in her in the am. But I gloved up, and went in while I had no time constraints. Found the horns to be about the size of a soda straw each. And what I felt coulda been her cervix, barely wrist deep, but no real definition to it. All mush. And again, maybe 2" and little bigger than my thumb.
In the class the dang cervixes were all hard,
and thick and long.
It's almost like her rectal wall is really thick. I'm sure she will stick to a bull but indont have access to one right at this time.
What the heck do you all think is going on? At this point I have yet to get one to stick.

 

[cow pollinater]

Do the best you can with her and then get to the butcher shop and tell him you want every reproductive tract you can get your hands on and spend the next twenty one days doing it while you can see what your hands are doing. Try it with your eyes closed and then open them when you think you've got it.
Don't beat yourself up. We try to have a guy breed four hundred head before we ever start expecting them to consistantly know what they feel inside of a cow.

 

[Craig]

Try going a little deeper and "sweeping". Sometimes their cervix is in farther than you think, and what you feel might be a fold. It could be hiding tucked down along the pelvic bone. Keep trying!

 

[Anonymous]

Ill make a couple phone calls, but I don't understand how I could be missing it that bad. I was in probably 300 cows in 4 days at the class. All the tracts on every single one were obvious. All were brangus and braford crosses. most were older cull cows.

I've gone all the way to my shoulder and swept back and forth from 10-2 on a clock moving back out. I spent probably 8-10 minutes on her today trying to figure her out

 

[HOSS]

To me the hard ones to find are the ones were the cervix is dropped well over the pelvic shelf.... deep in but almost straight down....hard to find. I have an older red angus cow that is this way. Big cervix and easy to manipulate once you find it. The mini-cows are frustrating to me....itty, bitty cervix.You have to about get down on your knees to get your arm in on those midgets.

 

[Red Bull Breeder]

Hook they is alot better AI people on here than me. I will give the best advice i ever got. Relax Its not a timed event. be as relaxed as you can and take your time. Keep trying you will get one right sooner or later and when you do it will be like someone flipped a switch.

 

[dun]

To me the hard ones to find are the ones were the cervix is dropped well over the pelvic shelf.... deep in but almost straight down....hard to find. I have an older red angus cow that is this way. Big cervix and easy to manipulate once you find it. The mini-cows are frustrating to me....itty, bitty cervix.You have to about get down on your knees to get your arm in on those midgets.

I don;t have real long arms, last year we had acow that I tried to AI and I coudln;t reach her cervix. The vet came over and he bred her but he was in her way past his armpit and he's got LONG arms. He was in her so far he got shyt in his ear. I've decided from now on she gets bred by the bull.
The dun was completely inside her vagina more then a hand length

 

[Anonymous]

Thanks everyone.
When I catch her up tomorrow, I'm going to spend some more time on her before I even thaw the semen. I put more pressure on myself than needed under most situations, so I'm sure that's factoring in. Either that or this cow is just one of the weird ones.
Hopefully the other 2 don't come back in.

 

[Herefords.US]

I don;t have real long arms, last year we had acow that I tried to AI and I coudln;t reach her cervix. The vet came over and he bred her but he was in her way past his armpit and he's got LONG arms. He was in her so far he got shyt in his ear. I've decided from now on she gets bred by the bull.
The dun was completely inside her vagina more then a hand length

Freudian slip? :banana: :banana: :banana: :tiphat:

 

[Fire Sweep Ranch]

Is there any way you could have someone with experience over in the morning? It helped me when I had some one confirm what I was feeling. That way, you get her bred and get someone else's opinion on what is going on. We have had heifers that are wrist deep and older cows that were shoulder deep! Not as far as Dun's wrist and gun story..... The visual on that was just.... Well, I'll leave it at that :)

 

[regolith]

Sounds like you've got the cervix okay and the cow just never growed up yet.
The younger they are, the smaller and softer the cervix. Thickness of a pencil is quite normal in a yearling Jersey and combine that with a texture like jello...

Remember she's just one cow. Sometimes they ain't going to catch no matter what. I kept my best four yearlings at home to AI this year. One I've AI'd three times, she's been mated by the bulls twice, fully expect to see her back on heat again in a fortnight and it'll be too late for her at that point. She'd had an extra chance already because she has 17 day cycles.
The other three caught first time to AI.
And sometimes they do catch on their fourth or fifth chance.

Barely wrist deep is the most likely place to find the cervix on an open cow, I reckon, unless she's full of poop. I only reach further in if it's not right there or if the inseminator gun slides further in - I guess you know that if you slide the gun in as far as it'll move forward easily, it's going to stop when it touches the cervix.
I *hate* those ones you have to work with elbow inside the cow, it makes moving around so much more difficult.

 

[dun]

I don;t have real long arms, last year we had acow that I tried to AI and I coudln;t reach her cervix. The vet came over and he bred her but he was in her way past his armpit and he's got LONG arms. He was in her so far he got shyt in his ear. I've decided from now on she gets bred by the bull.
The dun was completely inside her vagina more then a hand length

Freudian slip? :banana: :banana: :banana: :tiphat:

Must be the g and the d aren;t even that close on the keyboard

 

[Anonymous]

Is there any way you could have someone with experience over in the morning? It helped me when I had some one confirm what I was feeling. That way, you get her bred and get someone else's opinion on what is going on. We have had heifers that are wrist deep and older cows that were shoulder deep! Not as far as Dun's wrist and gun story..... The visual on that was just.... Well, I'll leave it at that :)

The only 2 that I know of that could help have previous obligations this morning.

 

[snake67]

AI rates of conception - in my opinion - are statistically much lower than most people think.

This is why we keep a cover bull around.

While a bull is not always an option for the small holder, if the cow is a problem - and you believe that you and your technique are not the issue - then it is time to ditch her.

Money wasted is never regained. While many keep cattle as a hobby - if you are prepared to finance them on a regular basis that is fine - in the end I still look upon cattle as a business.

Make me money or get your azz down the road so I can replace you with something as good or better.

Best to all

Bez

 

[Anonymous]

I hear ya bez

I just got in from shooting her up again. Before I even thawed the semen out I went in and found the horns, the uterus,the bifurcation and the cervix. She is indeed really shallow, but this time everything had good tone to it. Not rock hard, but nice and firm. Her cervix was still a little soft, but much easier to find. I'm thinking in the future I just won't stick her until she has tone. Yesterday everything was absolute mush.
Today's whole process couldn't have gone any better and I have 100% confidence I did my part right. If she doesn't stick this time she goes to friends bull for one cycle and that's it. We will see.
Thanks again everyone

 

[inyati13]

Hook, your post above this one and the one from snake really make me think about cancelling my AI class for March 6,7,8. I have a small operation and may be more hobby than most on here but I don't want to waste money either. I had thought if I did AI I could maybe do w/o a bull. But I would hate to send a cow I like down the road because she needs natural breeding. From what I read here, you really still need a bull. I have 12 cows and heifers now and plan to go up to about 18.

 

[Anonymous]

Don't cancel your class inyati. It's just that I'm still in the learning curve. I don't regret it. It will pay off in spades before too long

 

[dun]

Hook, your post above this one and the one from snake really make me think about cancelling my AI class for March 6,7,8. I have a small operation and may be more hobby than most on here but I don't want to waste money either. I had thought if I did AI I could maybe do w/o a bull. But I would hate to send a cow I like down the road because she needs natural breeding. From what I read here, you really still need a bull. I have 12 cows and heifers now and plan to go up to about 18.

Until a coupel of years ago we AIed 50-75 head a year and never used a bull. Arthritis and other issues made it impractical to keep AIing without a bull. In thirty plus years of doing my on AI work I only had 2 cows that wouldn;t settle to AI. Onewas mine and one a customers. Mine I sold and thr guy ran with a bull for almost a year andshe never settled. But any cow that goes totally nuts when I try to AI her I've never AIed a second time becuase she found her way to the salebarn or slaughter.

 

[Anonymous]

Your just buckin for a trip to florida aren't you? :cowboy:

 

[wbvs58]

When you have trouble Hook, go back and read your book again, amazing what little points you pick up each time. Remember it's a two stage operation, follow the rod through the vagina and up to the cervix and that will usually locate the cervix for you, from there the rod stays put and the cervix is worked over the the top of the rod. I know you already know all this but it can't be reminded enough, when you have trouble the tendency is to start poking with the rod. When you have trouble take a rest regroup and go back to the basics.
Keep up the good work and as you get the inseminations under your belt the problem ones will be fewer and further between but not totally eliminated.
Ken