springs and artesian water

[baldy]

I just closed the deal on my first quarter of pasture. There are several improvements I need to make in the spring(fencing, planting trees,a pole barn and pens etc.) but my first concern is water. There are a few artesian wells within 1/2 mile of mine and with a little luck I could find one. There is also a pool about the size of a p/u box that must be spring fed as it is still open and it has been in the teens below zero for the last two weeks. I have never been around "easy" water before, especially in the winter and am wondering if anyone has any ideas to best use the spring water without ruining it or any advice or links to information on artesian wells. Ideally I would like to have winter water without any elements or floats to mess with.

 

[r and s peckman]

Get with your local NRCS office.

 

[baldy]

I plan on talking with the county agent when I can and also the neighbors. I try to avoid the NRCS when possible. I want nothing to do with their programs. The ones I have checked into...cross fencing, cost share on dugouts, etc for my parents land come with to many strings attached for me. Don,t get me wrong they have probably heped out many thousands of people. I just don't want to get mixed up with the government any more than I have to.

 

[Jogeephus]

We locate underground creeks with clothes hangers. This can give you the location as well as indicating the width and the direction of flow of the underground creek. Once you locate one in an area that you wish to have water, we wash a well down. Care should be taken in the placement of the well since creating an artesian well can make the area where it is dug extremely wet and stopping its flow is nearly impossible. Locating the well in a natural trough or intermittant stream bed would be advisable if the area is know to have pressured water.

 

[luke strawwalker]

We locate underground creeks with clothes hangers. This can give you the location as well as indicating the width and the direction of flow of the underground creek. Once you locate one in an area that you wish to have water, we wash a well down. Care should be taken in the placement of the well since creating an artesian well can make the area where it is dug extremely wet and stopping its flow is nearly impossible. Locating the well in a natural trough or intermittant stream bed would be advisable if the area is know to have pressured water.

Hey Jogee how do you find 'underground creeks' with a coat hanger?? I'd like to try that!

I hear ya baldy!! I looked into cost share with NRCS twice and each time I couldn't get out of there fast enough... too much red tape for me, and the way they wanted everything done would have ended up costing me at least three times as much to do it as I planned on spending to do it, which means I'd have been in the hole even with 50% cost sharing, and had them looking over my shoulder for the next 20 years to boot... cheaper to just 'poor-boy' it and do what you can as you can afford to do it...

BTW the 400 foot 3/4 water line they said would never work to supply two cow troughs is working perfectly. Laid it myself for about $100 or so worth of materials and 30 minutes pulling the subsoiler with homemade boot. So much for the eggheads...
OL JR

 

[Jogeephus]

Luke, they call it witching but I don't think its anything magic about it since the running water will mess with the magnetism of the earth. The way most people are able to do it is to cut and straighten two coat hangers about 2.5 foot long. Bend the last six inches at 90 degrees to the main run thus forming two wires that look something like the number 7. Holding both of the small ends loosley in your hand and with the both in front of your body, you merely have to walk slowly across the land until the wires move and cross. When you hit a stream, instead of the wires being parallel to each other they will be pulled back toward you and cross - sometimes they will swing back an hit you if you cross at just the right speed. (If you think you are influencing this movement, you can also put the wire in the cardboard tubes that come with some coat hangers so you hands will not be in direct contact with the wire. This acutally works better since you have less resistance on the wire)

Once you have found the edge of the creek, walk towards the areas again in the opposite direction and mark the spot where the wires first cross again. this is the other side of the stream. Then using only one wire, walk toward it again and the direction it points is the direction the water is flowing.

I can't say this works throughout the US but it has worked for me everywhere I have used it. It is also real handy in locating buried pipes IF the water is running.

I also use this method in locating underground pipes in the event I decide to add a spigot. Just turn the water on and locate with the wire. Its kept me from digging up the world.

 

[J. T.]

At the risk of hijacking this thread, let me share with y'all a story about an artesian well. My brother was lead man for a survey team back in the '80's. They were surveying some property that had an artesian well that had been capped and fitted with a shut off valve. The pressure of this well was enormous. Anyway, my brother told this new guy to stand in a particular location so he could sight in the transit. While he was doing this, the other guy on the team opened the valve on that artesian well and blew that poor fella off of his feet and knock him back several yards. The pressure was so strong the boy couldn't stand up and every time he'd try he was knocked back in the mud. My brother and the other guy had a big laugh over it and the new guy was properly initiated!

 

[luke strawwalker]

Luke, they call it witching but I don't think its anything magic about it since the running water will mess with the magnetism of the earth. The way most people are able to do it is to cut and straighten two coat hangers about 2.5 foot long. Bend the last six inches at 90 degrees to the main run thus forming two wires that look something like the number 7. Holding both of the small ends loosley in your hand and with the both in front of your body, you merely have to walk slowly across the land until the wires move and cross. When you hit a stream, instead of the wires being parallel to each other they will be pulled back toward you and cross - sometimes they will swing back an hit you if you cross at just the right speed. (If you think you are influencing this movement, you can also put the wire in the cardboard tubes that come with some coat hangers so you hands will not be in direct contact with the wire. This acutally works better since you have less resistance on the wire)

Once you have found the edge of the creek, walk towards the areas again in the opposite direction and mark the spot where the wires first cross again. this is the other side of the stream. Then using only one wire, walk toward it again and the direction it points is the direction the water is flowing.

I can't say this works throughout the US but it has worked for me everywhere I have used it. It is also real handy in locating buried pipes IF the water is running.

I also use this method in locating underground pipes in the event I decide to add a spigot. Just turn the water on and locate with the wire. Its kept me from digging up the world.

Ah, Ok, dousing... Dowsing, however you spell it... gotcha...

One of Dad's buddies he grew up with showed me that trick one time in the oilpatch... only he used brazing rods. Said that's how his old man used to find drilling sites for oil, because the faults under the earth where the oil pools caused the brass rods to cross. He walked the fields on the farm one time too. I'd heard about the "Y" stick trick but the brazing rods was something new, and haven't heard of that for water before, but can't say it surprises me. Maybe steel works better for water or something, and brass for oil... Interesting...

I read a book a few years back and farted around with this sorta thing in the house... pull a Tylenol capsule apart, toss the powder, stick a sewing needle thru the capsule about halfway up and then stick another sewing needle into a flat piece of foam or potato or something to make a pivot, then put the capsule and perpendicular needle over it. Put your hands on either side and concentrate and see if you can make it move. Invert a drinking glass over it and try again (this ensures air movement isn't making it spin). If you have plenty 'mind energy' you can make it move, even spin, sometimes the glass blocks it, sometimes not, and sometimes you can control it, sometimes it's more erratic. I could make it move but couldn't readily control it. Kinda neat. Played with pendulums a bit too; take 3 brazing rods and tie them together into a 'pyramid' shape, and bring a string down to the center, and tie something (screw, nut, whatever) to it to make a pendulum. Concentrate and think of a question you want answered. Watch the pendulum it will start swinging toward and away from you if the answer is 'yes' and side to side if the answer is 'no'. Kinda neat. It really does start swinging on it's own without touching it, I don't know how! There was some other stuff too but I can't remember it all now... But they also talked about dousing in there too...

Yall have a good one! OL JR

 

[Jogeephus]

Luke, welding rods will work for water too. The pyramid thing, now that's kinda neat. Might be my answer to my vet problem. ;-) :lol:

 

[gberry]

Jogeephus I am always interested in the posts you make and the one about witching is no different. I would have said that was an old wives tale. I may have to try it just to see. Will it work to find pvc water lines? Does it give you any indication of the depth of the water?

 

[Florida cattle]

hey Luke 3/4" pvc is listed as the smallest pipe size allowed by NRCS standards, all that is required is a min of 5 gallons per minute at worst case senerio trough, which is figured by a forumla that takes into account elevation changes from well to through, distance from well and pump size. I've seen 1" sch 40 PVC be used for a mile of pipeline and meet the 5 gallons per min requirement with no problem.

 

[Jogeephus]

Jogeephus I am always interested in the posts you make and the one about witching is no different. I would have said that was an old wives tale. I may have to try it just to see. Will it work to find pvc water lines? Does it give you any indication of the depth of the water?

Yes it will work on PVC but the water has to be flowing so you have to turn on the spigot of the line you want to find. Unfortunately it will not tell you the depth. It will also work on iron and concrete with iron reinforcing. To test this, just take an old harrow disc and lay it on the ground and use the coat hanger or welding rod and just walk over it and see what happens. With most people, the rods will come back on you - you'll no it when they do. These devices were also used in WWII to clear the beaches when/if the troops didn't have mine detectors.