Sacrifice area for Hay

[Douglas]

How do you handle this and still do a good job of recycling nutrients to your pasture? If I feed hay on fescue the cows with keep eating on the fescue which is not good. If I feed where the pasture is poor the manure is wasted. If you leave them in one place it becomes a mess.

 

[wstevenl]

What's wrong with them eating fescue in your sacrifice area?
How is the manure wasted on your not so good pastures? Isn't this where you need the manure the most?

I think it's important to either, move the cattle regularly while feeding hay, or pick a small paddock to sacrifice. When Joel Salatin feeds hay from his barn, his herd has excess to the barn and about 1/10 of an acre in sacrifice area. I can't remember how many cows at a time.

 

[dun]

We use different sacrafice areas each year. In the spring we plant the area with fescue

 

[Douglas]

What's wrong with them eating fescue in your sacrifice area?
How is the manure wasted on your not so good pastures? Isn't this where you need the manure the most?

I think it's important to either, move the cattle regularly while feeding hay, or pick a small paddock to sacrifice. When Joel Salatin feeds hay from his barn, his herd has excess to the barn and about 1/10 of an acre in sacrifice area. I can't remember how many cows at a time.

I would like the fescue to regrow a little before winter, and the not so good pasture is really not pasture but more like swamp.

 

[bigbull338]

if you feed on pasture.the manure isnt wasted at all.because your building up the ground where your feeding.feed in the same places just about every year.only moving bunks when it gets super muddy.

 

[SRBeef]

I've wrestled with the same question. Even though there are folks and books that say the grass will grow back on the sacrifice areas, I don't really see enough grass growth early enough to be worth the wait.

It seems like a sacrifice area is just that - a sacrifice area. So far this fall I am feeding hay in a south sloping area alongside the edge of the woods where they will go for protection when it gets very cold and windy. This area is so shaded by trees to the south that it doesn't produce a significant amount of grazing anyway.

The fact that it slopes a bit should keep it from turning into too much of a mud pit in the spring. We are pretty well froze up for the season right now.

My plan then is to scrape the manure from this area when the cattle are put back on rotational paddocks in the spring and make a manure pile to spread when I get a chance or turn and compost or both. I'll throw some seed back out on this sacrifice area when I get done scraping but looking for cover more than grazing.

We'll see how this works.

 

[BeefmasterB]

How do you handle this and still do a good job of recycling nutrients to your pasture? If I feed hay on fescue the cows with keep eating on the fescue which is not good. If I feed where the pasture is poor the manure is wasted. If you leave them in one place it becomes a mess.

Douglas, wstevenl has good advice! If you are feeding on "poor" pasture then you are taking advantage of a prime opportunity to improve the soil in that area! Thus, making it productive down the road. The only thing I might add is that you till the manure and leftover hay into the ground, come early Spring. The nutrients can only work if they can get down into that potential root zone. Feeding in the productive area might just stifle growth in that feeding zone.

 

[1982vett]

How do you handle this and still do a good job of recycling nutrients to your pasture? If I feed hay on fescue the cows with keep eating on the fescue which is not good. If I feed where the pasture is poor the manure is wasted. If you leave them in one place it becomes a mess.

Douglas, wstevenl has good advice! If you are feeding on "poor" pasture then you are taking advantage of a prime opportunity to improve the soil in that area! Thus, making it productive down the road. The only thing I might add is that you till the manure and leftover hay into the ground, come early Spring. The nutrients can only work if they can get down into that potential root zone. Feeding in the productive area might just stifle growth in that feeding zone.

Reminds me of a spot in Mom's yard. It was about 15 foot diameter area that never had grass growing on it. I noticed when she watered the yard she didn't water this spot. I asked her why once, and she said because it didn't have any grass on it to water. :? Now this wasn't a stupid woman, but now that I take care of and water the spot, it has grass growing on it. :shock: She saw watering the spot as wasteful because grass didn't grow on it. I saw the reason the grass didn't grow, it needed more water. ;-)

 

[Jogeephus]

I have a sacrifice area that is about 10 acres in size. I've moved the hayrings around this field as the cows muck the dirt up. I keep the hayrings in a line like toy soldiers marching across the field. Once I completely cover the field, my plans are to move the sacrifice area to another field. So far this has worked really well. My original stand of grass is about destroyed but the soil has turned to a wonderful shade of black with plenty of orgainic matter in it. This spring I will kill all the grass in this field and replant it in millet and bahia and I expect this field will be very productive in the future.

 

[1982vett]

I have a sacrifice area that is about 10 acres in size. I've moved the hayrings around this field as the cows muck the dirt up. I keep the hayrings in a line like toy soldiers marching across the field. Once I completely cover the field, my plans are to move the sacrifice area to another field. So far this has worked really well. My original stand of grass is about destroyed but the soil has turned to a wonderful shade of black with plenty of orgainic matter in it...

Also known as a poor mans way to plant bermuda. :roll:

 

[Jogeephus]

Vett, that was exactly my plan but it just didn't work out that way. While I do have a few spots of Alicia, most of the acreage has become common bermuda. Where this came from I haven't a clue. I posted something about it a while back wondering if Alicia seed reverts to common or is it sterile. It weird how this worked. Due to this, I'm going to put the death ray on the field and convert it possibly this spring.

 

[1982vett]

Yep, it is mostly common that comes back. Hope some of my Giant bermuda made viable seed this fall. It's is getting a little thin. The common had a runaway year last year and put a hurt on the Giant, but it didn't fair so well compaired to the Giant this year. I was under the assumption that alicia is sterile. But then, one of my patches of alicia has some spots that is definitely a different variety. It seems to be immune from the rust that can attack alicia, is a bit larger stemed, longer and wider leafed and stays upright better. Looks to be pretty drought tolerant. Some of the spots that were 3-4 foot in diameter just a few years ago when I started noticing them are now 15 - 20 foot in diameter. They were already their before I started using some of the seeded varieties so I know I didn't spread it from anything I seeded.

 

[Jogeephus]

Yeah, I'm told Alicia is sterile too. Just wondering where all the common came from as it is always around the areas where I feed hay and I don't have common in the hay fields. I've always found this interesting but I guess birds, a stray plant or some other carrier could get it there and I guess it don't take but one seed. Sure do wish 85 would come up from seed.

 

[hillrancher]

After reading this post I feel blessed to live in these rocks and hills.We do not have any of those problems to deal with. We do feed in rings in the lot or pens, which we take a loader and clean out in the spring. When it gets muddy we have flat rocks to feed on. When it is dry take to top of the hills and turn loose make sure it will not hit a fence or building. We make outside hay lots on bermuda grass this way we sprig when when feed carry it out with the hay and have done a good job getting it on the steep slopes.
We never feed in the hay meadows because they are in the bottoms we have to move the nitrates and phosphorus off them. We do this by moving the hay off them to another location.
When the snow comes we feed in the woods in the deep hollows, most if the time they get enough shelter to stay dry.

 

[dun]

Yeah, I'm told Alicia is sterile too. Just wondering where all the common came from as it is always around the areas where I feed hay and I don't have common in the hay fields. I've always found this interesting but I guess birds, a stray plant or some other carrier could get it there and I guess it don't take but one seed. Sure do wish 85 would come up from seed.

It's pretty likely that seed has been laying in the ground for years. We had one field that was completely taken over by clover this year. The only catch is that clover hasn't been seen in that field in 5 years. It completely choked out the OG and Brome. After grazing it to the ground twice and now a ocuple of sever freezes the OG and Brome are finally starting to grow a little

 

[Jim62]

I put the rings in spots where the coastal is weak, and move them around with each new roll. Then, in the spring, disc and drag the area. Definitely have not noticed any "sacrificing" going on. Usually the best grass on the place the following year.......

 

[1982vett]

Yeah, I'm told Alicia is sterile too. Just wondering where all the common came from as it is always around the areas where I feed hay and I don't have common in the hay fields. I've always found this interesting but I guess birds, a stray plant or some other carrier could get it there and I guess it don't take but one seed. Sure do wish 85 would come up from seed.

It's pretty likely that seed has been laying in the ground for years. We had one field that was completely taken over by clover this year. The only catch is that clover hasn't been seen in that field in 5 years. It completely choked out the OG and Brome. After grazing it to the ground twice and now a ocuple of sever freezes the OG and Brome are finally starting to grow a little

Not sure but sounds like you are complaining. :shock: Here, all you have to do to establish common bermuda is break and stir the ground. Cattle have been spreading the seed for ages. The last two years I sprayed round-up on the oat land to keep it from taking over. Kind of the reason I was so shocked when Jogee fertilized his garden with all that cow manure in the spring. I've been waiting for him to post pictures of his new bermuda hay patch. :lol2:

 

[dun]

Yeah, I'm told Alicia is sterile too. Just wondering where all the common came from as it is always around the areas where I feed hay and I don't have common in the hay fields. I've always found this interesting but I guess birds, a stray plant or some other carrier could get it there and I guess it don't take but one seed. Sure do wish 85 would come up from seed.

It's pretty likely that seed has been laying in the ground for years. We had one field that was completely taken over by clover this year. The only catch is that clover hasn't been seen in that field in 5 years. It completely choked out the OG and Brome. After grazing it to the ground twice and now a ocuple of sever freezes the OG and Brome are finally starting to grow a little

Not sure but sounds like you are complaining. :shock: Here, all you have to do to establish common bermuda is break and stir the ground. Cattle have been spreading the seed for ages. The last two years I sprayed round-up on the oat land to keep it from taking over. Kind of the reason I was so shocked when Jogee fertilized his garden with all that cow manure in the spring. I've been waiting for him to post pictures of his new bermuda hay patch. :lol2:

Clover doesn;t cure well for hay around here.

 

[Stocker Steve]

How do you handle this and still do a good job of recycling nutrients to your pasture? If I feed hay on fescue the cows with keep eating on the fescue which is not good. If I feed where the pasture is poor the manure is wasted. If you leave them in one place it becomes a mess.

Seem to be three approaches that depend a lot on how much you like to work the soil and wether you have any improved pastures:
1) Feed in a lot - - haul hay in and manure out. Too much tractor time for me.
2) Feed on pasture - - haul hay in, and wait for the seed bank or apply some grass seed. Ugly for a few months but it works. My concerns are soil compaction and legume content.
3) Feed on pasture, till in an annual to use up some N, and then renovate the next year. Great looking pasture but requires access to tillage equipment.