question about calves-cows

[JHH]

I have had some free time today as some can tell.

Well the question is do 2nd calf cows generally raise a better calf than the first calf when she was a heifer? The reason I ask is that last year I was very dissapointed with the growth of two calves that were NOT out of my bull, I purchased these bred. well this year both of the cows had calves out of my bull and seem to be doing very well. They already weigh more than the calves from last year at the same age. I havent been feeding any different so I dont think thats it. JHH

 

[dun]

Generally you can expect the 2nd calf to be better then the first and the 3rd better then the 2nd. At that point they'll run about the same, given the same bull, feed, management, as the 3rd calf.
That's why BIF has adjustments for the age of dam when calculating adjusted weights

dun

 

[DiamondSCattleCo]

It will all depend on the animal of course, but often first calf heifers won't milk as heavy, nor have as much maternal instinct, all of which will lead to a calf that won't be quite as growthy. With my Angus and Shorthorns, I've noticed that the cows don't really seem to hit stride until their 3rd calf, although if the 2nd calf grows the same as the 1st calf, the animal goes down the road.

Rod

 

[kaneranch]

THe bull would obeously have alot to do with it to. Did you see what they were bred to. How were his EPDs compaired to yours Thanks Kaneranch

 

[1848]

Me too on the spare time JHH...

Yes in general they do. It has some to do with the animal being more capable of maintaining it's own body condition (all conditions being the same with the previous year) because the animals (the momas) own growth has slowed considerably. Therefore the nutritional requirement is less and so the milk flow is increased. It also has to do with better development of the mammory structure, and the animal being able to cope with the other stresses related to calving, nutritional requirements and rebreeding. Those 1st timers can be calving during their two year slump which also affects nutritional input/output and the growth of the calf. I'm sure "some" bulls can also make "some" difference...

 

[JHH]

Thanks everyone thats what I thought but didn't now.

Dun one of the cows that I am talking about is the one I posted a pic of several months back with the horrible milk EPD. Her calf really has grown good. The milk EPD may be because the canadian blood line from what I understand on the boards.I didn't think she gave enough milk last year but she seems to be doing alot better job this year.

Kaneranch- the bull of the other calves didnt have any available EPD'S, My bull is just avg and maybe alittle below on some stuff like REA.

Come to think of it He is the one in my avatar. That was when he was first born. JHH

The calf I was talking about not my bull sorry

 

[DiamondSCattleCo]

The milk EPD may be because the canadian blood line from what I understand on the boards.

Did they mean Canadian in general, or does she have some Canadienne in her?

If they mean Canadian in general, don't let anyone on either side of the border tell you that USA cows are the best, or Canadian cows are the best. Its all a bunch of bull. I've seen tremendous stock on both sides of the border, with first rate EPDs no matter where you go.

Rod

 

[txag]

The milk EPD may be because the canadian blood line from what I understand on the boards.

Did they mean Canadian in general, or does she have some Canadienne in her?

If they mean Canadian in general, don't let anyone on either side of the border tell you that USA cows are the best, or Canadian cows are the best. Its all a bunch of bull. I've seen tremendous stock on both sides of the border, with first rate EPDs no matter where you go.

Rod

i'm pretty sure he meant Canadian in general & not because they're lesser quality. when the Canadian-bred herefords are registered with the AHA, much of their past history & data isn't in the AHA database, so their epd's may not have the accuracy of animals who do have many relatives & ancestors in the database.

 

[Beef11]

i've heard that canadian herefords don't have the milk of the U.S. herefords but that isn't true enough to make a judgement on. If you wanted to make a generalizatio n far more accurately say that western herefords have far less milk and i would agree completely. There are some herds out here with high milk epds but the ones going into rough country need very moderate milk epds if they want the retained females to breed back. So i would say that ideal milk epds are geographically specific. Also if you can wean off 650lb calves off of a cow with very little milk the genetics on those critters must be pretty impressive elsewhere.

 

[JHH]

The milk EPD may be because the canadian blood line from what I understand on the boards.

Did they mean Canadian in general, or does she have some Canadienne in her?

If they mean Canadian in general, don't let anyone on either side of the border tell you that USA cows are the best, or Canadian cows are the best. Its all a bunch of bull. I've seen tremendous stock on both sides of the border, with first rate EPDs no matter where you go.

Rod

No I meant canadian from lake of past history.

Thanks txag that is what I meant.

 

[aztumbleweed]

The American Herefords don't produce the milk they used to produce and I like Herfords. You used to be able to raise a calf and milk them too. They are still the best cow I know for raising a calf even in their poorest condition, but they don't produce milk like they once did. It had been bred out of them because something else got prioritized like size. With EPDs, that may be getting fixed now.