Math me, please!

[MurraysMutts]

Five and six weights will do good on wheat. Usually figured at around two acres per calf if I remember right without supplementing. Your going to have to plan for bad weather and hope for good.

What would a guy expect for gain on that type calf? Would they put on 300lbs?

 

[Warren Allison]

Thanks for that Kenny. I'll have to check into it.

Very good point! That's why I started this thread. I'm far from having any clue about this. This would be a huge step for me IF I can swing it. It's wheat pasture. It sounded absolutely ridiculous to me the first time I heard it, until I started putting some numbers to it. He used to lease the pasture on the gain. That is, what the calves gain, he got so much dollars per pound. The number escapes me. But he got tired of people buying the crappiest calves they could find and them not gaining like good calves would. So now he just does a set 20k and run as many as ya want.

Partner is already in, just gotta figure this all out before we pull the trigger. The interest on the money conveniently escaped my mind. I knew this would be a good sounding board!

Murray, is the partner and the guy you are leasing from one and the same?

 

[MurraysMutts]

Murray, is the partner and the guy you are leasing from one and the same?

O no. Just a friend with similar interests. We've about decided not to get in on this. It's a lot. Especially for the two of us who don't have a lot of experience. I went and looked at the wheat pasture. Idk if it'll feed the amount of calves it would take to be profitable.

 

[Travlr]

O no. Just a friend with similar interests. We've about decided not to get in on this. It's a lot. Especially for the two of us who don't have a lot of experience. I went and looked at the wheat pasture. Idk if it'll feed the amount of calves it would take to be profitable.

Personally, I think the ask for the rent is way too high. If you want to try this, figure out what it would have to be to make a profit and make the guy an offer. I suspect the right number would have to be a third of what's being asked... maybe less... but all you can do is put it to him. Better he rents it for a fair price than letting it sit empty.

 

[MurraysMutts]

Personally, I think the ask for the rent is way too high. If you want to try this, figure out what it would have to be to make a profit and make the guy an offer. I suspect the right number would have to be a third of what's being asked... maybe less... but all you can do is put it to him. Better he rents it for a fair price than letting it sit empty.

I tried that 2 years ago. Someone leased it and gave it a go. I guess I didn't work out or they'd be doing it again.
Leases are hard to find around here. I'd just as soon find 40 or 80 acres to lease and continue what I've been doing on a bigger scale honestly

 

[Hpacres440p]

I’d be worried about putting calves that young on an open wheat field in winter. I know you get nasty ice and cold up there, and I’ve heard wet/cold for this winter. Maybe I have spoiled calves and the luxury of warm winters….

 

[Allenw]

What would a guy expect for gain on that type calf? Would they put on 300lbs?

Two plus pounds a day with good wheat and calves, maybe more if it goes well. Bigger calves will do better then light calves in any grazing situation.

 

[Travlr]

I tried that 2 years ago. Someone leased it and gave it a go. I guess I didn't work out or they'd be doing it again.
Leases are hard to find around here. I'd just as soon find 40 or 80 acres to lease and continue what I've been doing on a bigger scale honestly

What happened last year? Did it sit dormant?

 

[gcreekrch]

Do you think good calves would go from heavy 3 wts to 650 by March 15th on wheat pasture and hay? It's all a bit new to me. I've always just raise calves on cows. I've been happy with 5wt calves off the cow.

Kind of a unique situation. He used to run cow calf and sold out. He stays so busy farming, cutting hay, and real estate he don't even own a single cow any more. But I agree. If he advertised, I would think it would rent quickly.

No experience with wheat pasture but with right feed 3 weights will do 2 lbs. I would maybe gamble on less, bigger calves for first go round. If exchange and cost of gain factored in you need roughly 7000 lbs of gain to break even for what it costs to grass here. 160 5 wts would do that easy 5 x over. Your induction costs are worth the money as in vaccines and a Draxxin. Clean up horns and nuts. I like this. 3 weights are too volatile unless you are living with them every day.

 

[regolith]

If you were down under at this time of year no worries... but heading into winter that sounds risky as.

 

[WFfarm]

Can you lease just a part of it and maybe try 50-70 head to get your feet wet and get some experience, and maybe scale up next year?

 

[Little Joe]

O its still growing here! Admittedly this pasture isn't as nice as I've seen around here tho. Yes. Hay will be available

My experience has been in the climate you and I are in, that wheat is about to stop growing or at least grow real slow until mid February.

 

[RzrbkFarmer58]

If you have the bandwidth (time and effort) to put into this, I think you'd be crazy to not at least find your number ($) and offer it. The worst he can do is say no, then you are right back in the same boat you seem to be in now.

For the right lease price, your options open up, and you might be able to gamble on something you're more familiar with. Non-Feeder, value add options between now and March:

-Open cows to 2P
-1P cows to 3P
-Boner cows fattened up before killer cow season
-3P cows to bred back pairs

 

[mwj]

I would look for an opportunity with something with bigger forage capacity? Those peewees need a lot more than roughage to grow much. Is there a weight class that is being undervalued? Step back and rethink with an open mind. If you pass on this deal you are still in the race without any loss.

 

[Allenw]

I would look for an opportunity with something with bigger forage capacity? Those peewees need a lot more than roughage to grow much. Is there a weight class that is being undervalued? Step back and rethink with an open mind. If you pass on this deal you are still in the race without any loss.

Roughage is a very minimum element in wheat pastue this time of year. It's mostly water, energy, and protein.

 

[NIdahoShorthorns]

I would ignore the risk of future prices at first and look at it as a feed bill. You're paying $20k for ~150 days of feed for 250 animals. That's $0.53/day per head, keeping in mind they're competing for a feed source that isn't guaranteed in quantity. How much feed can you buy for $0.53/day? That would buy me about 8 pounds of alfalfa per head per day, or twice that much grass hay, at least. I think you're coming out a little bit ahead if, and it's a big if, mother nature plays nice and you get good grazing conditions. If you end up supplementing, I don't see how it works. Seems to me you should be paying half, or less, than the cost of guaranteed feed; like hay or grain.

 

[mwj]

Roughage is a very minimum element in wheat pastue this time of year. It's mostly water, energy, and protein.

I did not mean dry matter. You can not stuff enough in them on a as fed basis to meet the needs for that much gain. These calves will be harvesting there own feed out in the open with no shelter. You are asking for a loss with less than perfect conditions.

 

[midTN_Brangusman]

Murray, Ive got 850 acres in Stigler Oklahoma with a lot of stockpiled bermuda, fescue and rygrass starting to come in. I will rent it to you for $10,000 until March, that's when I start turning out.


In regards to your post, those small calves arent going to gain 2 lbs a day through the winter from my experience. If it were me I would be buying 6 weight bull calves. Thats when they are heavily discounted and they are big enough to take the winter cold and still gain weight.

 

[Dave]

I wouldn't go with anything under 450 lbs. Are those 3 weight calves late born early weaned or just dinks? Hard to tell in a few seconds in the sale ring. You want good growthy calves. A few no grow dinks will hurt a lot.

 

[gcreekrch]

I wouldn't go with anything under 450 lbs. Are those 3 weight calves late born early weaned or just dinks? Hard to tell in a few seconds in the sale ring. You want good growthy calves. A few no grow dinks will hurt a lot.

On the contrary, we’ve fed hundreds of those peewees and managed properly are the only class that will multiply their own weight by 2.5 times in 10 months when backgrounded and grassed. We once bought them at 260 lbs and had little loss. The major observation made over the years has been two calves bought as a pair, same weight, same breed, one young and very growthy from milk, the other a little set back from shortage of milk and forced to make its own living early. Unless managed very well, the older calf of the pair will outweigh the younger by 100 lbs in 10 months simply because its gut is already on a high forage diet.