Master cattlemen

[denoginnizer]

My wife has been attending a "Master Cattlemen" class at the local community college. I like the idea of her, and me, becoming more knowledgable about cattle but am concerned that everything they teach her may not apply to our situation.

Last night the topic was getting on a 90 day calving season. Now , I will be the first to admit that a 90 day calving season would be excellent but the one thing the speakers didnt discuss was how much money we might lose switching over to a 90 day season.

My concern is that we will lose more money , by culling cows that are out of sinc, than we will make by getting on the 90 day schedule.

Currently, I introduce the bulls late jan or early feb and remove them when I get the calves ready to sell in august or sep.
My thinking is that it is better to have a late calf than no calf at all.
My average cost for a pair is about 1300 dollars and a my cull cows usually bring about 500-550.

Any thoughts?

 

[dun]

Why would anyone want a calving season that long? Folks around here that have tightened their calving season have let the late calvers from the spring claving slip till fall and have started 2 calving season, each about 60 days long. The first year you;ll lose a llittle money, but by shortening the calving season there are more calves available at one time that are more uniform and will bring a better price.

dun

 

[cypressfarms]

I'm attending a similar class given by LSU (14 3 hour parts). If you do want to go to a 90 day breeding season, why not do your normal breeding this year, and when you preg check cull the cows that are not heavy bred. That way you could get more for the cow; or you could wait until she calves and sell her as a pair.

To get all of your cows in sync, your right, your gonna lose at first. Sometime book/class learning is great, but it has to be practical for your operation.

Just some thoughts.

 

[Jeanne - Simme Valley]

I understand a lot of people calve "year round". They must not have a health or management program. It would be total nightmare trying to vaccinate, let alone being a responsible breeder watching for calving difficulties.
It is recommended to breed your heifers 2 weeks prior to the cows. One reason is so they have enough time to cycle & get bred on time. But the other reason is because after the first two weeks, producers aren't as "on top" of calving because they get tired & lax. So obviously, if you calve "forever" you are not checking very close.
Would NEVER work for me. If a cow was too good to ship, she can be bred for a fall calving. We shoot for a 45 day calving season for our cows (strickly AI). This year first COW is due 2-2, last 3-28, so you can see we didn't make it! but we keep trying! 90 days sounds waaay too long for me.

 

[denoginnizer]

I'm attending a similar class given by LSU (14 3 hour parts). If you do want to go to a 90 day breeding season, why not do your normal breeding this year, and when you preg check cull the cows that are not heavy bred. That way you could get more for the cow; or you could wait until she calves and sell her as a pair.

To get all of your cows in sync, your right, your gonna lose at first. Sometime book/class learning is great, but it has to be practical for your operation.

Just some thoughts.

I hope they have some discussion on how much extra some of the practices are going to cost. I am not saying the presenters are not right I am just wondering why they dont have extra cost vs extra profit broken down on a chart or two.

 

[dun]

One thing to keep in mind also is that what works for one farm/ranch/management methids or styles isn't right for everyone.

dun

 

[Nowland Farms]

Denoginnizer,

I too started the Master Cattle Producer class last night and we talked about Marketing and Economics of the cattle business. We had a speaker who was an Argiculture Economic Professor from Auburn University and he had a good presentation on getting to understand how to calculate the real cost per pound of calf you raise on your farm.

This Guy had the charts & data to show that you were better off holding and selling at the 650-750 lb range instead of the 350-450 lb range eventho you rec'd less per pound.

Tommorrow night we will discuss forages. I have homework to do before then, read a chapter and answering a dozen or so questions before class.

 

[MikeC]

Listen closely to Dr. Ball. He is one of the most knowledgeable forage gurus in the southeast. He can save you money!

 

[Aero]

Currently, I introduce the bulls late jan or early feb and remove them when I get the calves ready to sell in august or sep.

why even remove the bull? 8 mos of exposure isnt that far from 12 mos.

 

[MikeC]

My concern is that we will lose more money , by culling cows that are out of sinc, than we will make by getting on the 90 day schedule.

The ideas presented are for "Long Term" economics. You might miss a few months from some cows gestation periods but it should pay off in the long run.

Some people calve year round to save on "Bull Power". :?:

But have no idea what his cows' calving intervals are.

Tighten up your calving season........you'll be glad you did.

 

[alabama]

You don't have to switch to a 3-month calving season all at once. You might consider taking the bulls out for 3 months the first year then take them out for 6 months the second year and the on the third year take the bulls out for 9 months. You can either hold over some cows that calve early for 3 months each year of sell them as open.
If you hold the cows over. You will lose 3 months production on 1/4 of your cows for 3 years. This works out to a 5% loss for three years. Think about it.

Now I am calving Jan Feb March but I want to calve Oct Nov Dec. Can some one help me work that out ??

 

[stocky]

Your calving season all depends on your management situation, If you have a short spring calving season, you can put all your attention to those cows at that time. You also rope yourself into having to wean that calf crop because they will come off the cow at the cheapest time of the year. Lately, weaning has been paying off for some people. You also end up culling good cows and selling them cheap. Most everyone in my area leaves the bulls in year round. You have calves available to sell year round and you are not locked into weaning to get a better market. You are not locked into culling good cows and you can have top bulls service alot more cows. In the deep south, it is too hot to calve in July and August and in the north it is too cold to calve in Jan-Feb, so your calving season must fit you management style and location. I leave the bulls in year round because it works much better for me with the dollars situation when it is all said and done

 

[ALACOWMAN]

To me a calving season is just good all around management practice. you know when to prepare,your calves or more uniform the replacement go here the steers & cull heifers at the same time if your like most a long haul to the sale barn is not economical several times a year you can tighten & adjust any season but i would want one regardless .

 

[bigbull338]

ok im all for learning new ways.but the 1st thing that comes to my mind is this the teacher isnt a rancher.b/c he is teaching from the book.an most stuff in the book wont fly. controlled breeding is good.but you will lose your butt fast doing that.culling the non breeders.you need 2 90 day breeding seasons to do that.if you dont calve in spring an fall youll cull half your herd the 1st yr.losing your butt.

 

[DiamondSCattleCo]

Last night the topic was getting on a 90 day calving season. Now , I will be the first to admit that a 90 day calving season would be excellent but the one thing the speakers didnt discuss was how much money we might lose switching over to a 90 day season.

In my area, bred cows usually sell pretty good, at least twice the price of culls. So my bulls stay with the cows for 8 months of the year. If a cow doesn't make it in within the first two cycles, she gets culled and shipped to a bred cow sale. She'll likely fit into someone's breeding plans somewhere, just not mine.

Once I get my herd built up better, and some bills paid down, those lates will not be sold at bred cow sales. If a young cow is late, there is likely a reason for it, and I'd hate to take a chance that her genetics will make it into someone else's cattle herd.

Rod

 

[novaman]

ok im all for learning new ways.but the 1st thing that comes to my mind is this the teacher isnt a rancher.b/c he is teaching from the book.an most stuff in the book wont fly. controlled breeding is good.but you will lose your butt fast doing that.culling the non breeders.you need 2 90 day breeding seasons to do that.if you dont calve in spring an fall youll cull half your herd the 1st yr.losing your butt.

I beg to differ that you will have large numbers of non-breeders. We run our calving season 75 days and very seldom have a cow that is open. Now that might have something to do with the breed of cow and fertility. It is definately nice to have an established calving season. Sure there is a lot of stress and lack of sleep but once that 75 days are gone I don't have to worry about an unexpected birth and the like.

 

[ALACOWMAN]

ok im all for learning new ways.but the 1st thing that comes to my mind is this the teacher isnt a rancher.b/c he is teaching from the book.an most stuff in the book wont fly. controlled breeding is good.but you will lose your butt fast doing that.culling the non breeders.you need 2 90 day breeding seasons to do that.if you dont calve in spring an fall youll cull half your herd the 1st yr.losing your butt.

I beg to differ that you will have large numbers of non-breeders. We run our calving season 75 days and very seldom have a cow that is open. Now that might have something to do with the breed of cow and fertility. It is definately nice to have an established calving season. Sure there is a lot of stress and lack of sleep but once that 75 days are gone I don't have to worry about an unexpected birth and the like.

Thats one of my personal favorite parts about a breeding season. get it done and over with. like ive said before if you decide to go some where are do something thats when they decide to have trouble

 

[cypressfarms]

ok im all for learning new ways.but the 1st thing that comes to my mind is this the teacher isnt a rancher.b/c he is teaching from the book.an most stuff in the book wont fly.

The LSU course that I'm taking is very well put together. They even give us books and reading materials every week that are specifically designed for our area. The whole class is designed from the commercial cattleman's point of view, and all relevant information presented is from years of field trials and study done by LSU. Broken down into 14 parts, and economics is emphasized heavily. The speakers vary almost every week, and most of them do raise cattle themselves.

If the "book" is written by someone who knows their stuff, there's nothing wrong with learning from it. I never want to get to the point where I think I can't learn something every day, with cattle or life!

 

[MikeC]

ok im all for learning new ways.but the 1st thing that comes to my mind is this the teacher isnt a rancher.b/c he is teaching from the book.an most stuff in the book wont fly.

The LSU course that I'm taking is very well put together. They even give us books and reading materials every week that are specifically designed for our area. The whole class is designed from the commercial cattleman's point of view, and all relevant information presented is from years of field trials and study done by LSU. Broken down into 14 parts, and economics is emphasized heavily. The speakers vary almost every week, and most of them do raise cattle themselves.

If the "book" is written by someone who knows their stuff, there's nothing wrong with learning from it. I never want to get to the point where I think I can't learn something every day, with cattle or life!

That's right CP. If we go a day and don't learn something, it's pretty much a wasted day. Listen to everything presented and use the parts you feel are beneficial to you.

 

[cypressfarms]

That's right CP. If we go a day and don't learn something, it's pretty much a wasted day. Listen to everything presented and use the parts you feel are beneficial to you.

Even from Crowder, Mike???