Stocker Steve
Well-known member
A lot of buzz about what causes big forest fires on the west coast. Are there going to be any changes in forest management and building practices?
callmefence said:Fire is a part of nature. It's always been. Nobody has to start it. The more you suppress it the more combustible the country becomes. Tall grass allows fire to get in the canopy. At least that's how it works here.
Fire gets up in the cedars and runs off when it gets onto properly that isn't grazed down. I would think those vast tracts of government owned land being burned off on a rotation ( idk how often) but when it's safe to do so. And being stocked fairly heavy with cattle during times when the grass is growing would be a logical solution.
kenny thomas said:callmefence said:Fire is a part of nature. It's always been. Nobody has to start it. The more you suppress it the more combustible the country becomes. Tall grass allows fire to get in the canopy. At least that's how it works here.
Fire gets up in the cedars and runs off when it gets onto properly that isn't grazed down. I would think those vast tracts of government owned land being burned off on a rotation ( idk how often) but when it's safe to do so. And being stocked fairly heavy with cattle during times when the grass is growing would be a logical solution.
Good Logic doesn't play into the decisions very often. The environmentalist fussing is the logic used.
Funny how a lot of those fires broke long after that lightning storm which was nearly a month ago. I remember that lightning storm well. We were sweating it here. Only a couple fires started by it. Most were put out in less than a week. Look at a map of west coast fires. Then look at a map of fires up in British Columbia. Funny global warming seems to stop at the border.cowgirl8 said:I mentioned this on a FB story on global warming and the fires a FB friend posted, she liberal.... i basically got laughed out of her liberal friend group...lol... She posted this..........Although I haven't seen anything telling us the political leanings of the people at the Gender Reveal Party. And i suppose antifa are melting all the icebergs too and Fires erupted beginning Aug. 15 when more than 1,200 lightning strikes hit the baking landscape within 72 hours.Those came "the exact week that we were experiencing some of the hottest temperatures ever recorded in human history, 130-degree temperatures in the southern part of the state," Newsom said. It was "maybe the hottest modern recorded temperature in the history of the world," he said. There is no changing their minds.. so, i dont really bother unless i feel like a argument..lol....
callmefence said:Fire is a part of nature. It's always been. Nobody has to start it. The more you suppress it the more combustible the country becomes. Tall grass allows fire to get in the canopy. At least that's how it works here.
Fire gets up in the cedars and runs off when it gets onto properly that isn't grazed down. I would think those vast tracts of government owned land being burned off on a rotation ( idk how often) but when it's safe to do so. And being stocked fairly heavy with cattle during times when the grass is growing would be a logical solution.
shaz said:callmefence said:Fire is a part of nature. It's always been. Nobody has to start it. The more you suppress it the more combustible the country becomes. Tall grass allows fire to get in the canopy. At least that's how it works here.
Fire gets up in the cedars and runs off when it gets onto properly that isn't grazed down. I would think those vast tracts of government owned land being burned off on a rotation ( idk how often) but when it's safe to do so. And being stocked fairly heavy with cattle during times when the grass is growing would be a logical solution.
I'll bet the fires in Oklahoma a few years ago didn't burn cow pasture either.
callmefence said:shaz said:callmefence said:Fire is a part of nature. It's always been. Nobody has to start it. The more you suppress it the more combustible the country becomes. Tall grass allows fire to get in the canopy. At least that's how it works here.
Fire gets up in the cedars and runs off when it gets onto properly that isn't grazed down. I would think those vast tracts of government owned land being burned off on a rotation ( idk how often) but when it's safe to do so. And being stocked fairly heavy with cattle during times when the grass is growing would be a logical solution.
I'll bet the fires in Oklahoma a few years ago didn't burn cow pasture either.
IDK what your talking about. But I'm going to respond with I didn't say cow pasture won't burn....
76 Bar said:This was posted on a friend's face book page. She & her husband are independent loggers and active in the industry's politics. Author of the article is Bill Imbergamo.
As these fires burn in California and Oregon (and elsewhere, but boy, these two states are putting on a show right now), I thought I'd share some information about the conditions on California's National Forests provided by one of my board members, mostly based on Forest Service Forest Inventory and Analysis and research done by FS researchers. Caveats: Not all the fires burning are FOREST fires, some of them are brush, grass, and chaparral, all highly flammable landscapes that are a whole other issue when it comes to land management. But the fact is the Forest Service grounds in CA are badly overstocked, the result of over a century of fire suppression and several decades of little management. This isn't about "raking" (ahem), nor is it only about climate change (although there is no doubt that climate change is playing a significant role here). Anyway, it's background knowledge like this that led me to pen that op-ed I shared yesterday. So now you can know what I know:
National Forests in California Forest Service Inventory & Analysis (FIA): In 2010 – average of 295 live trees/acre and 17 dead trees/acre for a total of 302 conifer trees/acre; 2015 data shows 302 live conifer trees/acre and 18 conifer dead trees/acre for a total of 320 conifer trees/acre.
Very recently, Dr. Malcolm North, Forest Service Pacific Southwest Research Station, found that in the 1860's, California's forests had on average 64 trees/acre; average diameter of 26 inches; 32% canopy cover, while in the 2010's – on average, there are 320 trees/acre; average diameter of 14" inches, and; 65% canopy cover ("Creating a Resilient Landscape Using Recent Research on Reference Conditions. Reforestation, and Owl Habitat" (February 2020).
In other words, on average, National Forest acres have 5 times the number of trees they have historically supported, these trees are 46 percent smaller, and the canopy (where the tops of trees touch) is twice as dense as it was historically. You subject a forest in that condition to climate change, this week's fire weather, and years of on again, off again drought, and you've got a real problem.
"We have a Forest Health problem. There simply is not sufficient water throughout any given year to sustain tree density on average 5 times greater than historic stands that were resistant to wildfire, insect, and disease."