Trans Ova is doing the IVF flushing at a facility near me now so I was thing about trying it once on a nice virgin heifer we have. I was just wanting to know if anyone on here has tried it yet and what their results were. My main concern is will I be messing her up for breeding back or possibly shortening her reproductive life. She is a Simangus heifer that is just a little over a year old now and I planned on breeding her in late May so I have plenty of time to flush her before that.
IVF flushing a virgin heifer ?
- Thread starter jd720
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branguscowgirl
Well-known member
There is a chance of causing problems with future reproduction. However I am not aware of how it happens well enough to explain it to you.
As far as flushing a virgin heifer, I personally would want to see a calf or two out of her first. I say this because flushing is expensive. You are using the best possible genetics that you can. So why not make sure your heifer can do a good job raising a calf first. Just my :2cents:
Also I have read that the optimal age is 3-6 years old. However many have good results up into their teens.
As far as flushing a virgin heifer, I personally would want to see a calf or two out of her first. I say this because flushing is expensive. You are using the best possible genetics that you can. So why not make sure your heifer can do a good job raising a calf first. Just my :2cents:
Also I have read that the optimal age is 3-6 years old. However many have good results up into their teens.
wbvs58
Well-known member
I can't say with any authority but I would imagine there would be a bit more force used on a virgin heifer using a dilator before passing the catheter which could result in some adhesions forming in and around the cervix.
Ken
Ken
Dubcharo
Well-known member
We flushed a fourteen months charolais heifer last week and had 4 embryos, we will know when she calve next year if everything is ok.
retro
Well-known member
You should really check with Trans Ova . Last I knew they recommended the female be at least 3 yrs of age and had at least 1 calf. I don't really know why anyone would want to flush a virgin hf. I would like some sort of Idea of what type of offspring she would produce. just because you feel she is nice doesn't automatically maker her a flush quality female, but its your money and my opinion.
Why flush a virgin heifer? What does she have going for her that makes you feel she is flush quality. She at this point has never worked a day in her life. Just trying to get my head around this management plan. Just because a heifer is out of great genetics certainly doesn't mean she will produce quality. Why not get a few calves on the ground out of the calf see how they perform within their contemporary group. If she is performing well then flush her. I just see so many reasons not to flush a virgin heifer.
Gizmom
Gizmom
WalnutCrest
Well-known member
We're aspirating a virgin heifer this week; should have results a week from Friday. Frankly, I'm not too optimistic...
Why are we aspirating her?
She's out of really good stock, she's injured her rear leg (frostbite as a calf) and will never live long enough on her own to raise her own calf ... so ... we're trying to get something out of her to salvage our not-insubstantial upfront cost to buy her mama as a bred cow (carrying this heifer in her belly -- at least half the reason we bought the mama was because of the heifer she was carrying).
Is it the right reason?
Dunno.
Ask me again in five years.
:shrug:
Why are we aspirating her?
She's out of really good stock, she's injured her rear leg (frostbite as a calf) and will never live long enough on her own to raise her own calf ... so ... we're trying to get something out of her to salvage our not-insubstantial upfront cost to buy her mama as a bred cow (carrying this heifer in her belly -- at least half the reason we bought the mama was because of the heifer she was carrying).
Is it the right reason?
Dunno.
Ask me again in five years.
:shrug:
branguscowgirl
Well-known member
My thoughts are.....when you like a heifer so much, you would flush her dam in hopes to replicate her. Flushing an unproven heifer is just a crap shoot. Flushing the dam is better odds at getting what you desire. :2cents:
An old horse breeder once told me, " if you really like a stud, don't breed to him. Breed to his sire."
An old horse breeder once told me, " if you really like a stud, don't breed to him. Breed to his sire."
Commercialfarmer
Well-known member
branguscowgirl":3hxmamuh said:
I've thought something along those lines as well. But the other side of the coin, if he isn't pre-potent enough to pass it down, then what good is your half sibling going to do either?
Commercialfarmer
Well-known member
But I'd have to side with some of the comments about not knowing what you have yet, until proven.
Of course, lost a bull last year after only settling 2 cows. I thought he'd do some things right and with only 2 hitting the ground, it looks like he really would have. One at 4 months is as thick and nice of a calf as I've seen.
Of course, lost a bull last year after only settling 2 cows. I thought he'd do some things right and with only 2 hitting the ground, it looks like he really would have. One at 4 months is as thick and nice of a calf as I've seen.
WalnutCrest
Well-known member
branguscowgirl":3phxiymy said:
We are planning to flush the heifers dam this spring (hopefully 3x - 4x, including at least once to the heifer's sire) ... but only after the heifers' dam calves a full sibling to this heifer (she was due to calve yesterday; we're hoping for another heifer). Oh, and we've already flushed the heifers aunt (half-sister to the heifers' dam, by the same sire) three times (including once to the heifers' sire, which resulted in two live calves on the ground about a month ago ... one of whom is a quite-nice 3/4 sister to the yearling heifer we're going to try to flush this week).
Oh, and the comment from the horse breeder exists in purebred dogs, too.
Walnutcrest
Under those circumstances I might do the same thing. Goes to show you always have to look at all the variables when making breeding decisions. I stick by my comments I will just revise them to 99% of the time why would you flush a virgin heifer. I still think I would just flush her dam, but sure understand wanting to get at least one calf out of the heifer. Good luck I hope your able to get some eggs.
Gizmom
Under those circumstances I might do the same thing. Goes to show you always have to look at all the variables when making breeding decisions. I stick by my comments I will just revise them to 99% of the time why would you flush a virgin heifer. I still think I would just flush her dam, but sure understand wanting to get at least one calf out of the heifer. Good luck I hope your able to get some eggs.
Gizmom
WalnutCrest
Well-known member
Regarding our virgin heifer ... two things:
1) apparently 13 oocytes are cooking as I type ... should have an answer on Thursday (I was off by a day). This is good news as I expected 0 oocytes this first go-round.
2) This virgin heifers' dam just gave us a full sister to the one that's being IVF'd now. :)
1) apparently 13 oocytes are cooking as I type ... should have an answer on Thursday (I was off by a day). This is good news as I expected 0 oocytes this first go-round.
2) This virgin heifers' dam just gave us a full sister to the one that's being IVF'd now. :)
branguscowgirl
Well-known member
Congratulations WalnutCrest! Happy for you on your success.
congrats on the flush, I hope they all stick for you!
gizmom
gizmom
WalnutCrest
Well-known member
branguscowgirl":2m1dhw4o said:
Thanks!
PS -- One of our partners (we source our recips out of his herd) tells me that one of our prospective recips this year will be a nice 5yr old brangus cow. I look forward to seeing her; I hope she passes my muster (he has a good eye and is hard to please, so I'm sure she'll be fine for us).
gizmom":2m1dhw4o said:
Thanks! Anything we get is going in the tank for future use.
WalnutCrest
Well-known member
WalnutCrest":1jz7kj2r said:
Well, while we did get some oocytes, we didn't get any developed-enough embryos. We'll try again at least once more.
branguscowgirl
Well-known member
Sorry to hear that WalnutCrest.
WalnutCrest
Well-known member
branguscowgirl":5yf0w8t6 said:
...yeah...I know. When it doesn't work, it feels like we're just like lighting money on fire to watch it burn.
So, that said, she's tentatively queued up to go again the week of April 20 with results before the end of the month. We're going to try a different bull this time to see if that matters any. We'll see ...
WalnutCrest
Well-known member
The first time, we had 0 embryos to freeze out of 13 oocytes.
Today, we froze 4 embryos out of 15 oocytes.
We're queuing her up again to go in three weeks.
Today, we froze 4 embryos out of 15 oocytes.
We're queuing her up again to go in three weeks.
