Is there a bull here? Pics (7)

[Alan]

I would like one of these two calves to be my clean up bull for next year. Is either worth while? I'll welcome thoughts and opinions on both, which do you like best?

Both are right at 6 months old, # 84 weighs 550 lbs, #86 weighs 530 lbs. Just mommas milk and grass, no creep.

Thanks,
Alan

#84

IMG]http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y120/hort828/IMG_1079.jpg[/IMG]

#86

 

[JHH]

I think # 86 IF I had to keep one. I thought you had a black bull for cleanup? If I did I would A-I and clean up with black bull. Nice bunch of cows but I think I would steer the #84. Someone else may see something I dont on him. Also pics are not a good indicator on what to keep. I cant ever get a pic to look as good as what they seem in real life. JHH

 

[Beefy]

i actually like 84 better. he already looks more bullish to me. i would like to see better hindquarter on both. i would like to compare their dams too.

 

[JHH]

i actually like 84 better. he already looks more bullish to me. i would like to see better hindquarter on both. i would like to compare their dams too.

I just thought in the pics that the 86 had a better rear quarter.

 

[DOC HARRIS]

I would like one of these two calves to be my clean up bull for next year. Is either worth while? I'll welcome thoughts and opinions on both, which do you like best?

Both are right at 6 months old, # 84 weighs 550 lbs, #86 weighs 530 lbs. Just mommas milk and grass, no creep.

Thanks,
Alan

#84

IMG]http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y120/hort828/IMG_1079.jpg[/IMG]

#86

Alan-

These are interesting pictures, however, for anyone to make a "breeding selection" decision at this early stage of their lives is inadvisable, because there is not enough information given to make a definitive judgement. For example: Do both calves have the same sire? What is the production history of their dams? How old are the dams? What are your GOALS with your operation? What are any weaknesses of the sire and the individual dams? What Phenotypic and Genetic strengths are you attempting to enhance or minimize in your herd? Will either of these calves fill those requirements, considering their Phenotypic and Genetic backgrounds? AND, (this is a very important consideration which only YOU can answer) are your desires to expect the choice here to improve the Genetics of your herd for retention of replacement females from them, or to market all of their calves on the market, and not keep any for seedstock? And, finally, would you be satisfied if ALL of the calves from these bull calves looked exactly like them?? or . . . should you attempt to "breed UP" the quality of your herd?

You might make a "Checkoff List" of considerations to peruse in the next several months, thereby making it possible for YOU to answer your questions as the calves mature. Doing your own 'homework' is preferable to having someone make the decision for you without their knowing all of the facts involved.

DOC HARRIS

 

[bigbull338]

id go with 84 hands down.he has the stamp of a herd bull on him at a young age.id like to see how thick he is in the rear end.he is a nice thick bull from the side.an carries good bone in his legs.

 

[KMacGinley]

I have to agree. Allen: Your cows look very good. I would not mind having them. :)

 

[3waycross]

If you have to pick one it would be 84 in opinion. Having said that I would sure like to see him in 6 months before you turn him out. He may get better he may get worse. If he gets worse don't feel locked in, steer him and look for a better bull to cleanup.

 

[JHH]

Which one do you like Alan?

 

[CPL]

None of the pictures are really good to judge by, but nonetheless I like 86. If I was playing the role of a packer, steers resembling the 86 bull would probably be the ones that make me the most money. I'd like to see them both in at a better angle, but If I had to pick one it'd be 86. To me it looks like 84 has a weak top, almost no quarter, and is finer boned. I really don't see the herd bull look to him, and I think his daughters will be more of a harder keeping, frailer kind. Thats just what I see anyway.

 

[milkmaid]

Here's your other pic of 84 that didn't post properly before. Might influence opinions one way or the other.

 

[Limomike]

As far as a cleanup bull... I would go with #84

 

[IluvABbeef]

I dunno...I really wouldn't pick either of them. 1) they're still too young, and 2) they both got the conformation of that of a steer, and that suitable for a bull, clean-up or otherwise.

That's just my honest opinion.

P.S. I sure like your cows though. ;-)

 

[3waycross]

Here's your other pic of 84 that didn't post properly before. Might influence opinions one way or the other.

He's no herdbuilder but he's got a lot more rear end than the 86 calf. Plus he seems to be more masculine in general

 

[Beefy]

i agree.

 

[CPL]

To me it looks like there is more muscle in 86. Granted they are both a lighter muscled pair, but 84 seems to taper down into his rear quarter and 86 has some what of a bulge. I've always been taught the bulge meant more muscle.

 

[greenwillowhereford II]

The jury is still out. Watch them awhile.

 

[JHH]

Ok try and get us a pic of both from the rear end. Easier said than done I know. I like the 86 but like I said before these are just pics. 86 could not walk right or have to much of a cow head. Keep both and then repost pics in 3 months :D Just kidding.

 

[Alan]

Thanks for all the replies, I appreciate all the honest responses. To answer some of the questions, yes they are both out of the same sire. I agree that neither has the quality of a herd building bull, but as stated before, one will be a clean up bull, not a herd building bull. I have some great herd building bulls, Rib Eye, M326, Progress, 242, Harland, World Class and some Online.... But I like to keep those on ice... :D.

To answer some of your questions Doc, my goals (as a hobby guy), is to produce cattle with consistant, top notch phenotypes, that milk, calves have good growth rates, and top quaility carcuss traits. All this and I'll try to get them to cross some enviromental boundries...... yes my goal is to get all the marbles :lol: .... we'll see how far I get If I get more than half way before I'm gone I'll be happy.

At this point I don't like one over the other, both have good and bad qualities, one week #84 looks good and the next week he doesn't. While #84 is deeper and better boned, he does have a norrowing hind end ... right now. I think #86 is better muscled, but not as deep, he'll also be slighter taller than 84. But he is also lighter boned than 84. Both have better than (what I consider) avg. EPD's, good REA and IMF (Oh yea, AHA decided to start calling it marbling this year). But again, one time #86 has the edge the next it's 84. Also 86 is related to 1 cow in the herd adn 84 is related to 2 cows. After my winter cull and weaning I'm a hobby guy that has 15 cows, headed for a goal of 25 top notch cows.

So the jury is still out, for now they both get to keep their parts.... I can only cut them once. But as a clean up bull I think one will do fine. In my perfect world, neither calf will ever sire a calf.... ha!

I would still welcome further comments and thank all for their thoughts.

Alan

 

[HerefordSire]

Exception job Alan! You have to be the best hobby breeder I have ever seen based upon your output. I can hardly wait until I see your next bull selections.