RiverHills
Well-known member
If I'm feeding 1% of body weight on none implanted calves. Do I need to back off to 3/4% for implanted calves to keep them in good condition????
I'm feed a commodity mix.
I'm feed a commodity mix.
Implanting feeder calves
- Thread starter RiverHills
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RanchMan90
Well-known member
That's just as a maintenance ration, not for gains correct?RiverHills":24rx7o23 said:
RiverHills
Well-known member
1% you get gains maybe not as much as a higher %. If your selling at an auction barn you don't want to get much over a 1% for very long.
wbvs58
Well-known member
js1234":1m3vx1rl said:
I agree if you were to tell us what your goals or market that you are aiming at we could advise you better.
Ken
talltimber
Well-known member
RH, I don't consider myself an authority for anywhere but here, but I don't worry too much with weighing feed other than maybe if I change a type of feed or something like that, and I am just curious. I handfeed twice a day. The steers I just sold looked good at 815 around the first of Oct. They were implanted and never got more than 3 pounds daily on fescue/wsg pasture this summer. I usually start them out around a 1 lb or so each prior to weaning. I kept un implanted heifers on that same 3 lbs until around the first of Nov and they averaged 824. They looked good to go to sale, but wanted more conditioning prior to breeding so I stepped them up to around 7 lbs these last three weeks. They are weighing 875 (guess) plus I imagine now, and all have cycled once at least and are doing good.
I just look at them, and adjust the amount given. I just turned heifers in on a good stockpile, and cut their feed back a little. I dont adjust real fast. A quarter bucket a day is all I will usually adjust them.
I have heard some say that if you're not going to FEED them, don't fool with implants. Last year I knew I wouldn't keep heifers and implanted all. Heifers weighed about 25 lbs more than the steers. This year steers had the advantage I think by a little. I dont have scales here yet, a guess. If I back-calc a 2 lb/day gain on the above calves: 824 (scales)-(30x2)=764 815(scales)-764=51 lb difference between steers and heifers the first of Oct.
14% commodity
I just look at them, and adjust the amount given. I just turned heifers in on a good stockpile, and cut their feed back a little. I dont adjust real fast. A quarter bucket a day is all I will usually adjust them.
I have heard some say that if you're not going to FEED them, don't fool with implants. Last year I knew I wouldn't keep heifers and implanted all. Heifers weighed about 25 lbs more than the steers. This year steers had the advantage I think by a little. I dont have scales here yet, a guess. If I back-calc a 2 lb/day gain on the above calves: 824 (scales)-(30x2)=764 815(scales)-764=51 lb difference between steers and heifers the first of Oct.
14% commodity
RiverHills
Well-known member
wbvs58":11328cen said:
Sorry guys!!!
I'm trying to get the best gains out of my calves while keeping them in good condition to sell at sale barn. Can you keep feeding calves the same amount of feed after implanting and still keep them in good condition or will the extra gain from implanting get them too fleshy?
1% seems to be the max to keep them in good condition. Thats why I'm asking if implanting will put too much on them with out backing off on the feed?
The calves will be fed from weaning to 90days weaned at most.
RanchMan90
Well-known member
Are they going to be grazing or in feedlot?RiverHills":11t4i5vm said:
RiverHills
Well-known member
Feedlot with minimal pasture. Dry hay with a 14% commodity mix
RanchMan90
Well-known member
10 4, I understand your plans now. That should put some condition on them. Do you have access to scales, just to make sure there not losing weight? A higher protein ddg based ration will frame them out better than a low protein high starch ration also.
RiverHills":1toaflet said:
Gotcha, I don't think that an implant will make those calves too fleshy. I think that a Synovex C type implant is just going to keep their condition moving on par with the frame they are growing, maybe a bit more, in that 90-120 day window before you sell them.
I would say that you're going to do way more damage in terms of making cattle too greasy with letting your ration get away from you than you ever could with an implant. If you've got your ration under wraps in terms of what you are asking your calves to do, I think a moderate implant is just going to put about 15lbs. of icing on top for you in the time frame. I think its costing us about 90 cents a dose, but even if it costs you $1.25/dose, thats not a bad return on a short investment.
RiverHills
Well-known member
js1234":15flxjb5 said:
The plan is to implant the calves at pre breeding vaccination, worming, castrating time. The calves would be 30-45days old. I would re implant at pre weaning vaccinating time. The calves would be on the farm 60-90days after second implant. Anything bad about this plan? I've been using ralgro is that Ok?
Nothing wrong with that plan. I'd look at Synovex. The Synovex C would be ideal for the calf thing and a follow up as well. If you were going to own them longer, I'd use Synovex One on the steers and Synovex H on the heifers. Ralgro is fine and has been fine for a long time. It owned the market 20 years ago. Now there are better implants out there now that aren't a whole lot more money. Lots of calves get Ralgro every year to this day and if you're happy, by all means leave well enough alone. For my money, no more boost than I'm seeing from Ralgro, I'd rather forego the implant and try to fit the calves in on a buyers natural order if it were my only implant option. No matter which direction you go on your implants, good luck with your endeavor.RiverHills":23s7ox0k said:
Stocker Steve
Well-known member
js1234 I think that a Synovex C type implant is just going to keep their condition moving on par with the frame they are growing said:
Synovex C is a low strength implants as is Ralgro. We have had better results and are overall happier with Synovex C than we have been with Ralgro for a while. That said, for the vast majority of our grass implant needs, we are going to look at a product more like Synovex Plus.
We don't implant our homegrown calves.
The Natural Market is DEAD at the moment. I bought 6 loads of GAP 4 calves weighing in the big 6's off one ranch that delivered to the feed yard last week. I had to shame the GAP program into taking them into the Natural program as they basically can't sell the GAP beef at the moment. I would have sucked it up and fed one load commodity but 400 head is a different story so I twisted their arm.
2 years ago, I had a standing order to buy all the Natural and GAP cattle I could get, at basically what I wanted to pay for them. These niche markets and the Whole Foods types of stores they feed into are experiencing a glut of product and pushback in terms of enough customers to pay the inflated cost at the meat counter. I place a lot of cattle into this particular program, which does send cattle into the Whole Foods supply chain as well as a couple small independent markets in high income urban areas. They called me at the first of the year and said they could guarantee slots to kill X-thousand cattle GAP and X-thousand cattle Natural. Based on reduced demand they weren't accepting cattle from new customers this year. I figured we would need to have slots to kill and sell about 1,100 GAP cattle and 2,600 Natural cattle to this particular beef company. Once I committed to that, I couldn't get anymore marketshare from that company at their cooperator yard for the year.
Year over year the market is certainly growing for GAP and Natural both but the rate of growth has come back down to Earth so the glut of placements has to work its way through the system which can be a bitter pill for the program as the premiums are pretty good paid to the cattle owner and if the beef isn't sold to a niche market at niche money it bleeds red ink in a hurry for the Natural Beef companies. For all cattle that don't fall out of the program, the premium is $14/cwt. for Certified Natural and $20/cwt. for GAP. It can be pretty good but a lot of that premium is chewed up by knockouts and the higher COG, thats why buying the right Natural or GAP cattle is so important, despite what a certificate may state, they're hardly all created equal.
We don't implant our homegrown calves.
The Natural Market is DEAD at the moment. I bought 6 loads of GAP 4 calves weighing in the big 6's off one ranch that delivered to the feed yard last week. I had to shame the GAP program into taking them into the Natural program as they basically can't sell the GAP beef at the moment. I would have sucked it up and fed one load commodity but 400 head is a different story so I twisted their arm.
2 years ago, I had a standing order to buy all the Natural and GAP cattle I could get, at basically what I wanted to pay for them. These niche markets and the Whole Foods types of stores they feed into are experiencing a glut of product and pushback in terms of enough customers to pay the inflated cost at the meat counter. I place a lot of cattle into this particular program, which does send cattle into the Whole Foods supply chain as well as a couple small independent markets in high income urban areas. They called me at the first of the year and said they could guarantee slots to kill X-thousand cattle GAP and X-thousand cattle Natural. Based on reduced demand they weren't accepting cattle from new customers this year. I figured we would need to have slots to kill and sell about 1,100 GAP cattle and 2,600 Natural cattle to this particular beef company. Once I committed to that, I couldn't get anymore marketshare from that company at their cooperator yard for the year.
Year over year the market is certainly growing for GAP and Natural both but the rate of growth has come back down to Earth so the glut of placements has to work its way through the system which can be a bitter pill for the program as the premiums are pretty good paid to the cattle owner and if the beef isn't sold to a niche market at niche money it bleeds red ink in a hurry for the Natural Beef companies. For all cattle that don't fall out of the program, the premium is $14/cwt. for Certified Natural and $20/cwt. for GAP. It can be pretty good but a lot of that premium is chewed up by knockouts and the higher COG, thats why buying the right Natural or GAP cattle is so important, despite what a certificate may state, they're hardly all created equal.
