Holsteins : What's your opinion on them?

[greenwillowhereford II]

You are right on all counts. What's the point? None of these facts are in dispute. Are they?

OK, I have no quarrel with you, and I'm sorry if I contributed to beating a dead horse. But the original poster DID ask for opinions, and seemed to need them.

Our Holstein steer was originally a bottle calf, so he was a teddy bear too. But I wouldn't want to deal with an intact mature bull.

 

[3waycross]

You are right on all counts. What's the point? None of these facts are in dispute. Are they?

OK, I have no quarrel with you, and I'm sorry if I contributed to beating a dead horse. But the original poster DID ask for opinions, and seemed to need them.

Our Holstein steer was originally a bottle calf, so he was a teddy bear too. But I wouldn't want to deal with an intact mature bull.

You're right and I apologize for coming off kinda testy. I do that when I'm tired.

Heck who am I kidding I do it when I'm not tired also.

 

[DaletheDairyFarmer]

{Correct me if I am wrong, but the reasons most beef ranches do not run Holsteins are:

Most breeders prefer not to have to milk several gallons of milk that the calf can't handle;
Holstein cows in a range situation on unimproved pasture couldn't sustain their milk production and would become walking skeletons;
Holstein cows would require significantly more acres per cow;
Holsteins tend to dress at lower percentages than their beef contemporaries;
What is the average lifespan of the Holstein cow?
While Holstein heifers bring good money as replacements, their steer counterparts sell at the stockyards somewhere in the basement with Longhorns;
There is a need to increase muscling, not decrease it;
Holstein bulls have a reputation for being ill natured.}

and don't forget:
Holstein steak is all grizzle, tough and has no natural flavor

all calves weigh 120 lbs plus and need to be pulled

there has never been a Holstein steer grade choice because the one who did have a shot had enough of a bad attitude they cut his head off before he was finished

they are just plain too big I mean what is the practical application of a breed that averages like 2400lb cows and has a frame score of 14.3

they can't live long enough to be profitable when they roll over and die after 1 or 2 calves real cows are still almost functional after 3 maybe even 4

feeders lose 10's of thousands of $$$ each year doing the dairymen a favor by taking these calves and feeding them out

its against the law in 15 states to even mumble that a holstein steer could be considered a beef animal oops make that 14 just came across the wire mississippi repealled that law this afternoon

sorry couldn't resist

 

[TexasBred]

I'm still looking for the holstein herd that averages 2400 lbs. weight per cow.

 

[VanC]

Here's a relevant article on Holstein beef:

http://beefmagazine.com/mag/beef_turnin ... umdingers/

 

[somn]

CK
somn-

Assuming that you are - partially correct - I wonder why all of the feedlots in the US PREFER beef calves instead of Holstein calves? Can you say - COST of feed?? Can you say - lack of FEED EFFICIENCY?? How about - Tenderness of cuts?? or - How about marbling? (Intramuscular fat deposits??) How about size of Rib Eye?? or - Ratio of fat to lean??

There must be a good reason why the "Beef Breeds" are the preferred choice for marketing meat on the butchers shelves! I have yet to see Gourmet Restaurants ( or ANY restaurant for that matter) advertise their " Cut of Prime Holstein Rib Cut" or " 12 oz. cut of Holstein Filet Mignon - wrapped with Bacon" or even wrapped with Chicken Fat.

CUT ME SOME SLACK!

DOC HARRIS

Three years ago there wasn't a beef breed in the entire nation that could hold a candle to a holstien for net profit in a feedyard. Feed efficiency isn't any worse or better on a average than any other breed when fed a proper diet. Another advantge holstiens have over beef breeds is consistancy. A higher % holstiens grade choice than do the beef cattle I have sold. Less prime but more choice. In case you haven't figured it out your cab is a marketing scheme and nothing more. There are other breeds I would rather eat first. The american consumer will believe anything and pay more for it just because they believe it will be better for them. Ever heard of bottled water. CAB people are buying it by the case. Wonder why? One thing I have always noticed is most people when shooting their mouths off about how bad holstiens are don't have a clue what needs to be in a holstien steer feed ration. They just shoot off their mouths running the breed down. Care to tell us what you put into your holstien feed rations and why?

 

[TexasBred]

Last holstein I butchered was a 1350 lb. bull that was working in the dairy herd. Had a short in the wiring of a metal building that he touched his nose to and it electrocuted him. Bled him out, hauled him to the locker, hung him for 3 weeks and processed him. The meat was out of this world. He ate 75 lbs. per day of corn silage, grain mix and whole cottonseed.

 

[J. T.]

"Bambi-boy"? :shock:

 

[bambi_boy]

Your question is an open-ended one. My opinion of Holsteins is: they are a Dairy breed , NOT a Beef breed. Holstein bulls, as they grow into adult bulls, get very difficult to manage, and, like ANY bull, can become extremely dangerous to be around.

Why do you have two Holstein bulls? What are you planning to do with them?

DO NOT, I REPEAT,DO NOT MAKE PETS OUT OF THEM!

My opinion: Sell them, and read and learn how to take care of cattle before you buy anything. Have plans and goals of what you are going to do before you do anything.

DOC HARRIS

Alright,

Ok to answer your question One of them (Bambi is his name by the way to the person who said "Bambi_Boy"? XD)
is going to be just a grazing PET. Yes, i repeat PET. I have been to a couple of farms and frankly i haven't seen a mean spirited bull yet. One of them ran up to the fence like a puppy begging for me to pet it XD. The other Holstein is going to be slaughtered. Then we have the beefmaster cows,one is a heifer and one is a bull, the bull is going back to his origianal owner to be well.. the name says it all :D. Anyway thanks for all your help you guys.. but i would have to dis agree with most of you and say that i think Holstein is probably the most gentle natured breed of cow ive ever seen :)

Taylor

 

[FarmGirl10]

Bambi_boy, you're wrong about holstein bulls being good natured. My dad, grandpa, a couple of my uncles, and a lot of friends and neighbors have had holstein dairies, most are anything but good natured. One of my friends families had a bull about six months ago that tore a automatic waterer out of the cement and when they loaded him to get rid of the darn thing, they had to use a skid loader for safety reasons. That bull attacked the skid loader and caused a good deal of damage to it. One of my uncles bulls had a six foot chain hanging off of his nose ring to keep him from attacking, if it ran after someone it'd step on the chain and stop it long enough for them to jump the fence. Now everybody that didn't sell out has resorted to AI.

Now about holstein steers and how they compare to beef breeds. http://animalscience.tamu.edu/main/academics/beef/browsing/dec07.html You have to scroll down to "HOW DO HOLSTEIN STEERS PERFORM?"

 

[AppalachCattle]

As many of you may or may not know, the old dual purpose Friesian cattle of Northern Europe was the parent of both Holsteins and Beef Friesians. The intermuscular fat that Holsteins have is in higher quanty in Beef Friesians. The Beef Friesian is the genetic parent of our current Irish Blacks. That is why Irish Blacks have more "easy" marbling than other beef breeds. They also have less intramuscular fat than breeds. Right, Doc

AppalachCattle

 

[DOC HARRIS]

Your question is an open-ended one. My opinion of Holsteins is: they are a Dairy breed , NOT a Beef breed. Holstein bulls, as they grow into adult bulls, get very difficult to manage, and, like ANY bull, can become extremely dangerous to be around.

Why do you have two Holstein bulls? What are you planning to do with them?

DO NOT, I REPEAT,DO NOT MAKE PETS OUT OF THEM!

My opinion: Sell them, and read and learn how to take care of cattle before you buy anything. Have plans and goals of what you are going to do before you do anything.

DOC HARRIS

Alright,

Ok to answer your question One of them (Bambi is his name by the way to the person who said "Bambi_Boy"? XD)
is going to be just a grazing PET. Yes, i repeat PET. I have been to a couple of farms and frankly i haven't seen a mean spirited bull yet. One of them ran up to the fence like a puppy begging for me to pet it XD. The other Holstein is going to be slaughtered. Then we have the beefmaster cows,one is a heifer and one is a bull, the bull is going back to his origianal owner to be well.. the name says it all :D. Anyway thanks for all your help you guys.. but i would have to dis agree with most of you and say that i think Holstein is probably the most gentle natured breed of cow ive ever seen :)

Taylor

I can't believe that I am entering into a serious discussion concerning the inadvisability of making "PETS" out of Holstein bulls! :???: :roll: :shock:

There are always exceptions which alter cases, but I would not care to be put in the position of " TESTING" whether ANY particular Holstein bull is the "Exception to the Rule" - given the fact that in the presence of Testosterone, ANY unknown stimulus can instigate instantaneous negative responses which could prove disastrous to a human being on the receiving end of such a reaction by a "PET" Bull! I would gravely encourage you to cease 'testing' the Holstein 'puppies' which might run up to the fence to be petted! St. Peter might be greeting you before you could say "M-o-o-o-ve over a couple of feet, please!" :welcome:

DOC HARRIS

 

[dun]

I for one will bow to your experience when it comes to bulls in genral and Holsteins in particular. Not wanting to sound harsh or critical but your idea about pet bulls just proves, "You can't fix stupid"

 

[VanC]

I dealt with quite a few Holstein bulls in my youth. "Good natured" is not exactly how I would describe them. Very, very dangerous to the point of being downright mean would be closer to the truth. In fact, one of the better natured ones broke a couple of my ribs.

A Holstein bull as a pet? Good luck. You'll need it.

 

[milkmaid]

Good grief Taylor -- keeping him as a pet is fine, but at least castrate the calf! :shock: :o

I've seen a few too many extremely mean Holstein bulls over the years and you do NOT want an aggressive Holstein bull in your backyard (inside your chainlink fence?! :shock:).

Why do you think you haven't seen a mean Holstein bull yet??? Might be because the dairies don't keep mean ones very long......

My dairy vet has told me ONE story of a docile 7 year old Holstein bull. The rest of the bulls -- 99.9% of them -- become too aggressive to be near and are sold for slaughter around 2 to 2 1/2 years of age. And any dairy bull that comes running up to the fence is likely not looking to be petted. The "friendlier" they seem, the earlier they start to show aggressive tendencies. Sounds like you need a crash course in bovine body language, and I just hope the cost of that course isn't an ICU visit.

 

[spinandslide]

Bambiboy- Please! at least castrate the holstein you are going to keep.
My husband has told me stories about some of the holstein bulls he had interaction with as a youth..regarding sledgehammers and it not even fazing the bull when it was coming at him.

If you are wanting a "pet" why not keep the beefmaster heifer as such?
Even if one of my horses or cows is a "pet", I still realize they are a LARGE animal and we establish groundrules QUICK...That being said, Id never keep a bull as a pet.

 

[TexasBred]

Taylor when that Holstein Bull pet throws you about 18 feet straight up in the air or runs over you like a freight train and stomps you, at least "change his name" at that time. :help: :help:

As for holstein steers and feedlots, there are tens of thousands of them in feedlots. Apparently they do something well when given a good hot ration.

 

[DOC HARRIS]

As many of you may or may not know, the old dual purpose Friesian cattle of Northern Europe was the parent of both Holsteins and Beef Friesians. The intermuscular fat that Holsteins have is in higher quanty in Beef Friesians. The Beef Friesian is the genetic parent of our current Irish Blacks. That is why Irish Blacks have more "easy" marbling than other beef breeds. They also have less intramuscular fat than breeds. Right, Doc

AppalachCattle

You are absolutely right!

Dealing with the "Human Brain" functionalities, and attempting to rationalize the strange lack of reason and common sense, which seems to permeate the "Idealism" of modern-day thinkers - particularly the "'Teen-20-30-something" Generation(s), is a monumental task, and presents a "script", if you will, of repetition, repetition, repetition in order to get the 'light-of-day' to penetrate the cerebral cortex of people - pertaining to almost every subject of modern living protocols - Political awareness and consequences currently being predominant.

This thread of discussion involving "Meat/Fat" characteristics, and which Cattle breed or breeds is/are "the BEST is just one example of the difficulty of presenting proven facts to closed-minded people. Human beings are inherently, intuitively, and innately skeptical. This trait is not necessarily a negative quality - just very difficult with which to deal at times. One can talk, explain, and - even "Show-and-Tell" - until BLACK in the face, ( Pun intended, but in the final analysis, it is the prerogative and privilege of the individual to make their own mistakes!

DOC HARRIS

 

[hgfarmer]

Your question is an open-ended one. My opinion of Holsteins is: they are a Dairy breed , NOT a Beef breed. Holstein bulls, as they grow into adult bulls, get very difficult to manage, and, like ANY bull, can become extremely dangerous to be around.

Why do you have two Holstein bulls? What are you planning to do with them?

DO NOT, I REPEAT,DO NOT MAKE PETS OUT OF THEM!

My opinion: Sell them, and read and learn how to take care of cattle before you buy anything. Have plans and goals of what you are going to do before you do anything.

DOC HARRIS

Alright,

Ok to answer your question One of them (Bambi is his name by the way to the person who said "Bambi_Boy"? XD)
is going to be just a grazing PET. Yes, i repeat PET. I have been to a couple of farms and frankly i haven't seen a mean spirited bull yet. One of them ran up to the fence like a puppy begging for me to pet it XD. The other Holstein is going to be slaughtered. Then we have the beefmaster cows,one is a heifer and one is a bull, the bull is going back to his origianal owner to be well.. the name says it all :D. Anyway thanks for all your help you guys.. but i would have to dis agree with most of you and say that i think Holstein is probably the most gentle natured breed of cow ive ever seen :)

Taylor

And how many breeds of cattle have you seen? Holstien and beefmaster? All these people on here who are warning you have A LOT of experience and I wouldnt question them. If you wanna pet, get a fish, they eat a lot less..... ha

 

[3waycross]

Am I the only one here who thinks Taylor is either a farce who is having a lot of fun making everybody crazy giving him/her advice about something that is so basic and fundamental that it's ridiculous OR he/she may be the single most stupid, hard headed, or retarded person who ever posted a dumba$$ question on these boards.

Either way I propose that if Taylor hasn't got the point by now Taylor is not going to GET IT. Let's stop wasting our collective breath on this moronic thread.

If he/she hasn't got the point by now it's a waste of time trying to find any more new and creative ways to say HOLSTEINS BULLS ARE EXTREMELY DANGEROUS. THE END