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artesianspringsfarm

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Putting in my corners and braces for a 14 acre piece and thought I would throw this question out. If you are hanging a gate off an H-brace that is also the beginning of a long section of line headed in the other direction, do you do just a single H? If so, how do you do your cable tighteners? An X to account for the tension on both? I have a way I do it, but I am not happy with mine.
 

greybeard

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I sometimes x the diagonal wire where there's a gate if the run from the hinge side of the gate isn't very long. If it's a long run, the tension on the fence should easily offset the weight of the gate. The X takes about 15 extra minutes and I never had to put a wheel on a gate in my life. Wheels are for vehicles.


 

callmefence

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greybeard":1722z9nv said:
I sometimes x the diagonal wire where there's a gate if the run from the hinge side of the gate isn't very long. If it's a long run, the tension on the fence should easily offset the weight of the gate. The X takes about 15 extra minutes and I never had to put a wheel on a gate in my life. Wheels are for vehicles.




Everything he said. And plant em deep.
 

ddd75

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brace post should be another 1/3 of the way higher and HT wire + strainers should be used.. not brace wire.


the double X is useless.. all your doing is putting more strain on the tension post.
 

ddd75

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greybeard":4rse4o5v said:
Been doing it this way since '65. Never had one fail.


i could never get that 9 ga wire to keep a tension. :bang:
 

callmefence

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greybeard":15n2euhy said:
I sometimes x the diagonal wire where there's a gate if the run from the hinge side of the gate isn't very long. If it's a long run, the tension on the fence should easily offset the weight of the gate. The X takes about 15 extra minutes and I never had to put a wheel on a gate in my life. Wheels are for vehicles.



Very neat good looking work. Horizontal height could be higher but it's splitting hairs. Don't make a bit of difference with post that size sunk deep enough. The x brace absolutely serves purpose on a short run gate post.
I would definitely hire the man that built that.....
Except we work round goats a lot. And I know they scare him. :D
 

greybeard

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And I'd work for ya, except I done got too old, worn out, grouchy, and decrepit to do much work anymore. You'd run me off & probably before I got out of my truck and both feet on the ground.

That particular gate and the other end of the fence sees flood water several times per year and the ground stays saturated for weeks. And, I shoulda run 2 more strands on that fence too, but decided to run a hot wire with the five I have. A mistake. Hot wires don't work well when water is up to the 4th strand...
 

Farm Fence Solutions

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The width of your box brace is where the strength is derived, assuming that the brace posts are the proper size, and properly set in the ground. At least 2 and a half times the height of the fence is a good rule to follow with HT wire, and the less angle on your brace wire, the better. The horizontal strut should be placed at 2/3 the height of the highest wire. We generally run on a single 10' or single 12' brace, but do use a double H once in a while. We use a 10'x8" for the end/corner post, and an 8'x7" for the second post with a 4-5" diameter horizontal strut. On the high side of your brace wire, simply line it up with your horizontal strut, and it will help to keep your corner or end from heaving. That's where the width comes into play to keep the angle of your brace wire a little less steep. The easiest brace wire to use is 5/32" galvanized aircraft cable with a large Gripple. I just happen to know a fella that sells a quick brace pretty cheap. Of course, some areas of the world have conditions that dictate other methods.
 
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artesianspringsfarm

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Farm Fence Solutions":dsiakx0y said:
The width of your box brace is where the strength is derived, assuming that the brace posts are the proper size, and properly set in the ground. At least 2 and a half times the height of the fence is a good rule to follow with HT wire, and the less angle on your brace wire, the better. The horizontal strut should be placed at 2/3 the height of the highest wire. We generally run on a single 10' or single 12' brace, but do use a double H once in a while. We use a 10'x8" for the end/corner post, and an 8'x7" for the second post with a 4-5" diameter horizontal strut. On the high side of your brace wire, simply line it up with your horizontal strut, and it will help to keep your corner or end from heaving. That's where the width comes into play to keep the angle of your brace wire a little less steep. The easiest brace wire to use is 5/32" galvanized aircraft cable with a large Gripple. I just happen to know a fella that sells a quick brace pretty cheap. Of course, some areas of the world have conditions that dictate other methods.

I appreciate everyone's comments. I think Callmefence identified my main issue right off the bat. I use a postpounder but we have a shelf of rock thats 30-36" down and that is just as deep as is reasonably possible here. What I see happen on some gates with an H brace and fence running the other way is that the bottom of the post close to the gate starts to wobble after a few years of swinging. I generally put my horizontal in at 54" and my top line is 60". You are saying thats too high? Also, I use 6-8" pine posts for main beams, 4-5" for horizontal, would going up one size really help my problem? What would you guys do if 30" is all the depth you can reasonably get? I use 8' posts since I can only get 30" in the ground anyway.

One more question. I just use 12.5 wire for my brace. I just started using a gripple instead of a strainer and love it but why should I consider using cable instead of wire, other than maybe a little faster?
 

Farm Fence Solutions

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artesianspringsfarm":355xrxhe said:
Farm Fence Solutions":355xrxhe said:
The width of your box brace is where the strength is derived, assuming that the brace posts are the proper size, and properly set in the ground. At least 2 and a half times the height of the fence is a good rule to follow with HT wire, and the less angle on your brace wire, the better. The horizontal strut should be placed at 2/3 the height of the highest wire. We generally run on a single 10' or single 12' brace, but do use a double H once in a while. We use a 10'x8" for the end/corner post, and an 8'x7" for the second post with a 4-5" diameter horizontal strut. On the high side of your brace wire, simply line it up with your horizontal strut, and it will help to keep your corner or end from heaving. That's where the width comes into play to keep the angle of your brace wire a little less steep. The easiest brace wire to use is 5/32" galvanized aircraft cable with a large Gripple. I just happen to know a fella that sells a quick brace pretty cheap. Of course, some areas of the world have conditions that dictate other methods.

I appreciate everyone's comments. I think Callmefence identified my main issue right off the bat. I use a postpounder but we have a shelf of rock thats 30-36" down and that is just as deep as is reasonably possible here. What I see happen on some gates with an H brace and fence running the other way is that the bottom of the post close to the gate starts to wobble after a few years of swinging. I generally put my horizontal in at 54" and my top line is 60". You are saying thats too high? Also, I use 6-8" pine posts for main beams, 4-5" for horizontal, would going up one size really help my problem? What would you guys do if 30" is all the depth you can reasonably get? I use 8' posts since I can only get 30" in the ground anyway.

One more question. I just use 12.5 wire for my brace. I just started using a gripple instead of a strainer and love it but why should I consider using cable instead of wire, other than maybe a little faster?

The cable will be just a bit stronger, and quicker since one wrap is plenty. The quick braces are handy because of the speed, but also nice because they are light weight to pack around. It never fails for us that the Jenny will have a full roll on when it's time to build braces. :mad: We generally would drill the rock to get a post set deeper, but have also used earth anchors in a smaller drilled hole, but lucky for us, it doesn't happen often. Depth would be more important than diameter, in my opinion. I would drop your horizontal, and go to a longer one if possible.....if it was me.

 

callmefence

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artesianspringsfarm":2jmcl855 said:
Farm Fence Solutions":2jmcl855 said:
The width of your box brace is where the strength is derived, assuming that the brace posts are the proper size, and properly set in the ground. At least 2 and a half times the height of the fence is a good rule to follow with HT wire, and the less angle on your brace wire, the better. The horizontal strut should be placed at 2/3 the height of the highest wire. We generally run on a single 10' or single 12' brace, but do use a double H once in a while. We use a 10'x8" for the end/corner post, and an 8'x7" for the second post with a 4-5" diameter horizontal strut. On the high side of your brace wire, simply line it up with your horizontal strut, and it will help to keep your corner or end from heaving. That's where the width comes into play to keep the angle of your brace wire a little less steep. The easiest brace wire to use is 5/32" galvanized aircraft cable with a large Gripple. I just happen to know a fella that sells a quick brace pretty cheap. Of course, some areas of the world have conditions that dictate other methods.

I appreciate everyone's comments. I think Callmefence identified my main issue right off the bat. I use a postpounder but we have a shelf of rock thats 30-36" down and that is just as deep as is reasonably possible here. What I see happen on some gates with an H brace and fence running the other way is that the bottom of the post close to the gate starts to wobble after a few years of swinging. I generally put my horizontal in at 54" and my top line is 60". You are saying thats too high? Also, I use 6-8" pine posts for main beams, 4-5" for horizontal, would going up one size really help my problem? What would you guys do if 30" is all the depth you can reasonably get? I use 8' posts since I can only get 30" in the ground anyway.

One more question. I just use 12.5 wire for my brace. I just started using a gripple instead of a strainer and love it but why should I consider using cable instead of wire, other than maybe a little faster?
You

You just can't get a worse deal than a couple of feet of heavy soil on top of bedrock. (unless you mix in some tree roots) it's just a bytch.
Rock drills bog down in dirt , rock augers wanna walk , and you can't drive em deep enough. Pipe makes it easier, but I know that's not what your dealing with.
If you can't get the equipment, like farm hinted your gonna have to get creative.

I pulled up alot of old cedar braces built like greybeards. Built all with hand tools long ago. after setting the post as deep as They could get. They had dug about a 18" wide buy 12 " deep trench the length of the brace encompassing both post and filled it with concrete.
Not a recommendation....but a example.
Whatever you do it's worth the effort . ..better than fighting a leaning brace, dragging gate and sagging fence the rest of your days. :bang:
 

CaddoFarms

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I have been using 9 guage brace wire and wrapping it twice....is that overkill, can I do just one wrap? Other than that ive been building them like you described pretty much thanks to texas a&m's guide I followed.
 

Farm Fence Solutions

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CaddoFarms":2roadgfc said:
I have been using 9 guage brace wire and wrapping it twice....is that overkill, can I do just one wrap? Other than that ive been building them like you described pretty much thanks to texas a&m's guide I followed.

That's not overkill. You'll get more strength/less stretch out of HT 12.5 gauge brace wire.......and it's cheaper.
 

Farm Fence Solutions

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callmefence":bzhvtw2d said:
artesianspringsfarm":bzhvtw2d said:
Farm Fence Solutions":bzhvtw2d said:
The width of your box brace is where the strength is derived, assuming that the brace posts are the proper size, and properly set in the ground. At least 2 and a half times the height of the fence is a good rule to follow with HT wire, and the less angle on your brace wire, the better. The horizontal strut should be placed at 2/3 the height of the highest wire. We generally run on a single 10' or single 12' brace, but do use a double H once in a while. We use a 10'x8" for the end/corner post, and an 8'x7" for the second post with a 4-5" diameter horizontal strut. On the high side of your brace wire, simply line it up with your horizontal strut, and it will help to keep your corner or end from heaving. That's where the width comes into play to keep the angle of your brace wire a little less steep. The easiest brace wire to use is 5/32" galvanized aircraft cable with a large Gripple. I just happen to know a fella that sells a quick brace pretty cheap. Of course, some areas of the world have conditions that dictate other methods.

I appreciate everyone's comments. I think Callmefence identified my main issue right off the bat. I use a postpounder but we have a shelf of rock thats 30-36" down and that is just as deep as is reasonably possible here. What I see happen on some gates with an H brace and fence running the other way is that the bottom of the post close to the gate starts to wobble after a few years of swinging. I generally put my horizontal in at 54" and my top line is 60". You are saying thats too high? Also, I use 6-8" pine posts for main beams, 4-5" for horizontal, would going up one size really help my problem? What would you guys do if 30" is all the depth you can reasonably get? I use 8' posts since I can only get 30" in the ground anyway.

One more question. I just use 12.5 wire for my brace. I just started using a gripple instead of a strainer and love it but why should I consider using cable instead of wire, other than maybe a little faster?
You

You just can't get a worse deal than a couple of feet of heavy soil on top of bedrock. (unless you mix in some tree roots) it's just a bytch.
Rock drills bog down in dirt , rock augers wanna walk , and you can't drive em deep enough. Pipe makes it easier, but I know that's not what your dealing with.
If you can't get the equipment, like farm hinted your gonna have to get creative.

I pulled up alot of old cedar braces built like greybeards. Built all with hand tools long ago. after setting the post as deep as They could get. They had dug about a 18" wide buy 12 " deep trench the length of the brace encompassing both post and filled it with concrete.
Not a recommendation....but a example.
Whatever you do it's worth the effort . ..better than fighting a leaning brace, dragging gate and sagging fence the rest of your days. :bang:

I pulled(lots of digging first) a concrete dead man out a couple years ago on a fence job for an old timer.......My skid steer will pick up about 6k, and we had to put the crane on it as well to move it. After we got it out, I had to get the story on it. Ol' Jim tells me that he had two brothers and his dad worked at the gravel pit, so the only thing cheaper than mixing his own concrete was his labor. :lol:
On a side note, I've got a real dandy of a hill/rock job coming up in a month or so, and I'm thinking about tracking down some pipe to make life a tick easier. If any of you have a good source that is closer to Indiana than TX or OK, I'm all ears. It's hard to get from the local drillers, unless you're in the club.
 

greybeard

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Farm Fence Solutions":2bh9a1wr said:
CaddoFarms":2bh9a1wr said:
I have been using 9 guage brace wire and wrapping it twice....is that overkill, can I do just one wrap? Other than that ive been building them like you described pretty much thanks to texas a&m's guide I followed.

That's not overkill. You'll get more strength/less stretch out of HT 12.5 gauge brace wire.......and it's cheaper.
I sometimes use 12.5 HT wire for brace wire myself. Sure cheap enough @ less than $120.00 per 4000' and 200K tensile, it works fine.
 

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