Hey newbies, take a look

[cypressfarms]

Hi all,

I'm really not trying to sound like a "know it all", so if comes accross as such, please forgive me. From all of the "newbie"type questions lately, I thought I would post a small version of how I keep track of cows/calves:


The name of the game for a commercial cow/calf producer is pounds at weaning, and price per pound. Each year I analize all of the data I can get a hold of to evaluate any changes that I need to make.

To start off, you need a reliable way to identify each cow's calf. I put in a ear tag with the moma's number plus A soon after birth so I can monitor them better.

When I bring them to the stockyard, I am meticulous. I write down each calves sale number (the sticker #) so I can correlate it to their ear tag number. This allows me to gather data like the following:

This year's results:

Avg sale price $1.17 per pound
Avg sale weight 453 pounds
Avg sale price $525.58
Avg Daily gain 1.99 pounds
205 Avg weight 482 pounds.

I calculate Avg daily gain by using the following formula:

sale weight - birth weight (I usually just use 75 lbs) divided by the numbers of days old the calf was at sale day.

205 weight is a common age for weaning weights. This lets me judge calves against each other. For this the formula is:

Avg daily gain multiplied by 205 plus birth weight.


This is just a brief summary. It allows one to make more informed decisions about which cows to keep or cull. This year, the bottom three calves in ADG and 205 weight were from first time heifers, so they will get a break, as cows first calves are normally smaller.

Thought it may help some. I'm not a math expert, but you gotta find a way to see what your cows are doing for you. After all, they are your employees.

 

[mcdowedd]

Thanks! That is exactly the kind of info I needed and broken down into an easy to use format.

 

[Mosho]

Thank you so much for being so helpful. We need more people on this board with your attitude.

 

[john250]

Hi all,

I'm really not trying to sound like a "know it all", so if comes accross as such, please forgive me. From all of the "newbie"type questions lately, I thought I would post a small version of how I keep track of cows/calves:


The name of the game for a commercial cow/calf producer is pounds at weaning, and price per pound. Each year I analize all of the data I can get a hold of to evaluate any changes that I need to make.

To start off, you need a reliable way to identify each cow's calf. I put in a ear tag with the moma's number plus A soon after birth so I can monitor them better.

When I bring them to the stockyard, I am meticulous. I write down each calves sale number (the sticker #) so I can correlate it to their ear tag number. This allows me to gather data like the following:

This year's results:

Avg sale price $1.17 per pound
Avg sale weight 453 pounds
Avg sale price $525.58
Avg Daily gain 1.99 pounds
205 Avg weight 482 pounds.

I calculate Avg daily gain by using the following formula:

sale weight - birth weight (I usually just use 75 lbs) divided by the numbers of days old the calf was at sale day.

205 weight is a common age for weaning weights. This lets me judge calves against each other. For this the formula is:

Avg daily gain multiplied by 205 plus birth weight.


This is just a brief summary. It allows one to make more informed decisions about which cows to keep or cull. This year, the bottom three calves in ADG and 205 weight were from first time heifers, so they will get a break, as cows first calves are normally smaller.

Thought it may help some. I'm not a math expert, but you gotta find a way to see what your cows are doing for you. After all, they are your employees.

Very good. Where were you 45 yrs ago when I needed this? I would only add one thing--(pounds at weaning * $/lb ) must be divided by the number of cows exposed to the bulls. The cycle starts when you turn the bulls in to the cows (or purchase bred cows).

 

[cypressfarms]

Very good. Where were you 45 yrs ago when I needed this?

Mom and dad hadn't quite gotten around to making me 45 years ago.

By the way, I am not trying to brag or gloat or anything else; By posting this I was just trying to get some of the newbies to start thinking about dollars and cents - and sense. My actual summary every year is much more complicated, but if a newbie can get a grip on costs, he/she has a jump.

 

[Crowderfarms]

Cypress,
See, You've got that pencil sharp as a new tack... That was some great info. to show the newer folks in the Cattle business.

Atta Boy!

 

[Bama]

Great post. To make money in this line of work you have to stay on top of where your money is spent. The only thing I would add to this is I keep a running total of dollars per day. I get this by taking the profit from each calf and dividing it by the days on the farm. I do this with purchased stock. Dollars per day is the real profit. Say I keep one 365 days and make $250. thats $.68 per day. Sounds good until I see I could have made $150 on two that I had only 180 days, $.83 per day. works out to $300 in 360 days or $250 dollars in 365 days. Nearly same number of calfdays but considerable more profit. Tricky part is knowing when to sell.

 

[backhoeboogie]

Tricky part is knowing when to sell.

Absolutely. And knowing when to buy as well.

Good info, good post Cypress.

 

[cypressfarms]

I was actually waitingfor someone to come along and tell me that my 205 day weight was way too low.

But again, I did this for the newer people to see how to put dollars and cents to this.

I read a post earlier where a newbie brought a newborn calf to a college vet school twice. At some point, with cow calf operations, you have to cut your monetary losses and accept the loss of a calf.

 

[backhoeboogie]

At some point, with cow calf operations, you have to cut your monetary losses and accept the loss of a calf.

That is easier said than done.

I lost one even after spending $240 at the vet, not considering the time and nickels I spent before I got her to the vet. Had the little gal lived, I might have broke even. Probably not. The smart thing to have done would have been to cut my losses, I knew it, but I just couldn't do it.

 

[Cowdirt]

Cypress,
Excellent post. I made an Excel spreadsheet to help track my herd' performance. Nothing elaborate though. I wonder how some of you folks deal with individual calf performance when your calves sell in groups through the auction. Scale says six calves weigh 3000 lbs. I know there is some that weigh more and less than 500 lbs. This bugs me abit but my records are still better than no records.

 

[randiliana]

Cypress,
Excellent post. I made an Excel spreadsheet to help track my herd' performance. Nothing elaborate though. I wonder how some of you folks deal with individual calf performance when your calves sell in groups through the auction. Scale says six calves weigh 3000 lbs. I know there is some that weigh more and less than 500 lbs. This bugs me abit but my records are still better than no records.

We get around that by weighing the calves before they go to the sale. We can rent an electronic scale for $25 and weigh them. After doing this you realize just how much of a difference there is between the 6 calves ;-).

I have various spreadsheets, the Ranch Manager program, and, I also keep a record for each cow (on paper). It has her info, BW, WW, ADG on her mama, and who her dam and sire were. It also has info about every calf that she has had. Birthdate, BW, sex, assist, sire, Weigh date, WW, ADG and comments. That way I can see what she is doing as the years pass by. Very useful as you can tell which cows are consistent, and which aren't, and which ones are doing their job.

 

[preston39]

cypress...,

An excellent explanation and a very useable tool.

Many would do well to apply it for cost analysis as well as herd improvement.

From your analysis would you care to share your thoughts on why the ADG was not 1.5 or 3.5?

 

[travlnusa]

Thank you very much.

I have printed your post to get me started. I am sure I will change it a but for my own personal style, but with no idea how to start, this is Great info for me.

I am VERY gulity of being one of those who will stop and buy a quick bag of mineral (or whatever) out of pocket money and never get the charge properly placed.

Thanks again.

 

[MillIronQH]

Thank you very much.
I am VERY gulity of being one of those who will stop and buy a quick bag of mineral (or whatever) out of pocket money and never get the charge properly placed.

Thanks again.

Not me. I don't have that problem. My wife/beancounter is on me every night the minute she sees me and I better be able to account for every nickel. I can usually cover a few bucks here and there to buy a coldbeer but that's about it.Z

 

[Caustic Burno]

Hi all,

I'm really not trying to sound like a "know it all", so if comes accross as such, please forgive me. From all of the "newbie"type questions lately, I thought I would post a small version of how I keep track of cows/calves:


The name of the game for a commercial cow/calf producer is pounds at weaning, and price per pound. Each year I analize all of the data I can get a hold of to evaluate any changes that I need to make.

To start off, you need a reliable way to identify each cow's calf. I put in a ear tag with the moma's number plus A soon after birth so I can monitor them better.

When I bring them to the stockyard, I am meticulous. I write down each calves sale number (the sticker #) so I can correlate it to their ear tag number. This allows me to gather data like the following:

This year's results:

Avg sale price $1.17 per pound
Avg sale weight 453 pounds
Avg sale price $525.58
Avg Daily gain 1.99 pounds
205 Avg weight 482 pounds.

I calculate Avg daily gain by using the following formula:

sale weight - birth weight (I usually just use 75 lbs) divided by the numbers of days old the calf was at sale day.

205 weight is a common age for weaning weights. This lets me judge calves against each other. For this the formula is:

Avg daily gain multiplied by 205 plus birth weight.


This is just a brief summary. It allows one to make more informed decisions about which cows to keep or cull. This year, the bottom three calves in ADG and 205 weight were from first time heifers, so they will get a break, as cows first calves are normally smaller.

Thought it may help some. I'm not a math expert, but you gotta find a way to see what your cows are doing for you. After all, they are your employees.

Good post and records Cypress here comes the reality check, take your numbers against true operating cost to get that little bit of profit.
Now after you charge off taxes, equipment, hay, feed, vet bills, fenceing etc against every calf is where the rubber mets the road.
If you where on the national average of 400 dollars a head operating cost you made 125 dollars profit a cow if you had a 100% calf crop. Thats good as it is 25 dollars a head over national average.
This is where most operators get in trouble they think they are making a lot more than they really are. The best I have been able to get it to is a dollar a day to upkeep old Belle.

 

[cypressfarms]

Good post and records Cypress here comes the reality check, take your numbers against true operating cost to get that little bit of profit.
Now after you charge off taxes, equipment, hay, feed, vet bills, fenceing etc against every calf is where the rubber mets the road.
If you where on the national average of 400 dollars a head operating cost you made 125 dollars profit a cow if you had a 100% calf crop. Thats good as it is 25 dollars a head over national average.
This is where most operators get in trouble they think they are making a lot more than they really are. The best I have been able to get it to is a dollar a day to upkeep old Belle.

Caustic, your 100% correct. There are many hidden costs that people don't see. Example: it costs me 5% everytime I sell a calf at the auction. However, I think if some of the newbies can start putting numbers down and doing the math, they will see that it's not the "cake walk" that many have thought.


Preston,

I've thought about the ADG a good bit. Most of my cows are commercial brangus or beefmaster. They are bred to affordable (to me) bulls. Another words, there are no "curve benders" in my pasture. I have thought of a.i.'ing to some of the big name bulls to test and see if the ADG would go up. Normally my ADG would be just above 2.0, but I did have several heifers calve this year, and they always seem to bring in smaller calves the first time around. I do not creep feed. If I did, I'm sure the ADG would improve, but it's hard for me to justify the cost.

 

[Susie David]

I applaud your willingness to share some valuable information :clap: :clap: :clap:

Waiting for Cow/calf 202. The good stuff like cost per pound of gain and total cost per head.
Since we are not in the calf business, I start my calculations at conception and end it at slaughter....figure that the time spent bred with a calf on the teat makes up for the feed for the cow&calf until weaning.
We usually don't sell calves except for an occasional heifer.
Just my two bits worth...hope that I make sense Dave Mc
Keep up the good posts
P.S. Ever thought about a beginner site with commonly asked questions and the answers posted.

 

[Bama]

these are the catagories I use when figuring cost

Equipment
Feed, hay and grain
fertilizer, lime and chemicals
Gas and oil
improvements
milage
misc. supplies
salt,mineral and protein
seed and plants
Stockyard fees and commissions
taxes
utilities
vet and medicine

Days on farm
profit per head
dollars per day on each one
dollars per acre
daily gain
and other info.

 

[Caustic Burno]

Cypress you ADG seems really low to me, do you fertilize your pastures. Our grass is really sorry compared to some areas of the country. Also I have ran Brangus like the breed I had some that the growth rate stunk on, they are now at the happy feedlot in the sky. Forget about epd's on a piece of paper you are on the right track in tracking your ADG now it is time to find the most efficient cow on your grass to give maximum ADG with the least input.