Hereford Genetic Summit

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alexfarms

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I thumbed through the April issue of HEREFORD WORLD over lunch and saw a few really good aritcles. One is posted below. It is about a genetic summit to be held in September to discuss future genetic issues for the Hereford breed. The article sites a similar meeting held in 1969 that launched the breed into the frame race. So it would be interesting to anyone who thinks the breed needs to change or who thinks the breed needs to be carefull what it changes into. Any thoughts?

On page 26 there is a really good article on "leadership", that ought to do us all a lot of good to read and take to heart, especially if we do or hope to lead. Another article on page 10 outlines the upcoming BIF Research Symposium and Convention in Lincoln, NE in June. There is also an article on Limiting feeding cows on page 44 that I haven't had time to read yet. One of the better issues of HW that I've read in a while.

 
I would think the majority of focus will be on feed efficiency. Hopefully it is a more balanced approach than in the previous decades. The Hereford breed just got to the point where commercial guys are starting to take it seriously again.
 
alexfarms said:
I thumbed through the April issue of HEREFORD WORLD over lunch and saw a few really good aritcles. One is posted below. It is about a genetic summit to be held in September to discuss future genetic issues for the Hereford breed. The article sites a similar meeting held in 1969 that launched the breed into the frame race. So it would be interesting to anyone who thinks the breed needs to change or who thinks the breed needs to be carefull what it changes into. Any thoughts?

Well, that worked out so well, lets do it again huh? :lol: We absolutely need to be careful of rapid changes. Rapid changes usually involves selecting for extremes and that will eventually lead to more problems. I think if the purebred industry would just try to make small changes gradually we would be better in the long run and we would have less backtracking to correct problems.
 
In my opinion, the Hereford breed's real STRENGTH is really in it's choices available. We have genetics that can cover all sizes and goals.

I 'd rather see encouragement for breeders to again ratchet up their breeding and quit the registered circle jerk that goes on and give commercial folks different choices and options with prepotency. Breeding and selecting cows for environment then bringing in the bull of the month through AI is a fools game in my opinion.

Then again I only use the AHA for pedigree keeping........
 
Hereford76":13mpwpnd said:
"Age of the hornless composite wonders"

.... But they'll do their damnest to make sure you have good time.


I was laughing about that last line too. "We'll make sure you have a great time while you're there." You know what they say about people pleasers: They never get what they want. I'd like to get to the meeting just to see what others are saying. I don't think people in the Hereford breed have come to terms with the current economics of feed costs and its effect on profitability. A good example of that is discussion about whether the AHA's profit indices need to be updated to reflect current feed costs and the difficulties of maintaining profit indices if they aren't updated often.

Did you ever wonder about Titan 23D, S Titan 7777, Tex Prime Time (two time Denver champion), DH Yampa Dominator and their many descendants throughout the breed? Its surprising how many of their descendants are now polled. Have you ever wondered why we still have so many horned Herefords when the polled gene is dominant and if nature were let take its course then the number of horned cattle in the breed should be slowly declining.

Here's an article about the horn/poll gene in Holsteins, one of the other breeds where horns are common. There is a statement in the first paragraph that might interest you: "Oddly enough, the history books tell us that the ancestors of our modern-day cattle did not have horns and that mutations must have occurred that gave rise to horns."

Its interesting to read through the article and see the examples of the polled gene popping out in Holsteins from parents that were believed to be horned but had distant ancestors that were known to be polled. Often times scurrs are mistaken for horns and when a smooth headed calf comes along it really isn't the result of a recent mutation, but one that occurred several generations earlier.

http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q= ... idtyuyKeWA
 
I wonder if they ever seek any commercial breeder input. The way I see it as a commercial breeder if I wait for breed associations to give me direction I am destined to seek what they sell. The dollar indices are a joke and I include the Angus dollar indices in that statement. It is not that they couldn't be useful but too many breeders raising seedstock don't have the discipline to allow their usefulness and basic functionality is overlooked for a pleasing number. Just my two cents worth nothing more. I won't be holding my breath for the results of the summit.
 
W.B.":13vq5v28 said:
I wonder if they ever seek any commercial breeder input. The way I see it as a commercial breeder if I wait for breed associations to give me direction I am destined to seek what they sell. The dollar indices are a joke and I include the Angus dollar indices in that statement. It is not that they couldn't be useful but too many breeders raising seedstock don't have the discipline to allow their usefulness and basic functionality is overlooked for a pleasing number. Just my two cents worth nothing more. I won't be holding my breath for the results of the summit.

nice... comedy here too!
 
Have you ever wondered why we still have so many horned Herefords when the polled gene is dominant and if nature were let take its course then the number of horned cattle in the breed should be slowly declining.

imo if they let mother nature take its course there would be no such thing as a polled hereford. imo there is way too much inconsistency, junk, whatever attached to the polled gene. sit at any sale barn, visit with any commercial hereford rancher or any feeder... there is no such thing as a commercial polled hereford ranch... maybe hobby but that about cover it. all opinion gathered all on my own.
 
Hereford76":29mgadcp said:
Have you ever wondered why we still have so many horned Herefords when the polled gene is dominant and if nature were let take its course then the number of horned cattle in the breed should be slowly declining.

imo if they let mother nature take its course there would be no such thing as a polled hereford. imo there is way too much inconsistency, junk, whatever attached to the polled gene. sit at any sale barn, visit with any commercial hereford rancher or any feeder... there is no such thing as a commercial polled hereford ranch... maybe hobby but that about cover it. all opinion gathered all on my own.

There just aren't that many horned beef cattle left and the number is declining and its no accident:

http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q= ... 4634,d.b2I
 
Hereford76":2ojyjk4s said:
Have you ever wondered why we still have so many horned Herefords when the polled gene is dominant and if nature were let take its course then the number of horned cattle in the breed should be slowly declining.

imo if they let mother nature take its course there would be no such thing as a polled hereford. imo there is way too much inconsistency, junk, whatever attached to the polled gene. sit at any sale barn, visit with any commercial hereford rancher or any feeder... there is no such thing as a commercial polled hereford ranch... maybe hobby but that about cover it. all opinion gathered all on my own.

If you let "Mother Nature" take its course, would there be any such thing as a Hereford, period? I suspect the ranges would be again filled with bison and perhaps a new more mongrelized version of the Longhorn. I've always thought breeding cattle involved interfering with "Mother Nature", at least to the point where selection and mating decisions weren't totally left up to "survival of the fittest". Granted it can certainly be taken to the opposite extreme, but if you want to hang your hat on that "Mother Nature" argument, why not just turn them all in together and see what gets sorted and bred out?
 
Herefords.US":9b114hme said:
Hereford76":9b114hme said:
Have you ever wondered why we still have so many horned Herefords when the polled gene is dominant and if nature were let take its course then the number of horned cattle in the breed should be slowly declining.

imo if they let mother nature take its course there would be no such thing as a polled hereford. imo there is way too much inconsistency, junk, whatever attached to the polled gene. sit at any sale barn, visit with any commercial hereford rancher or any feeder... there is no such thing as a commercial polled hereford ranch... maybe hobby but that about cover it. all opinion gathered all on my own.

If you let "Mother Nature" take its course, would there be any such thing as a Hereford, period? I suspect the ranges would be again filled with bison and perhaps a new more mongrelized version of the Longhorn. I've always thought breeding cattle involved interfering with "Mother Nature", at least to the point where selection and mating decisions weren't totally left up to "survival of the fittest". Granted it can certainly be taken to the opposite extreme, but if you want to hang your hat on that "Mother Nature" argument, why not just turn them all in together and see what gets sorted and bred out?

Always seemed that there were a lot of whitefaces in the Aleutian Islands cattle herds.

A hermit out in the wilds of this area had a wild herd of Herefords. Lived down a deserted dead-end road surrounded by spruce bogs. Had no fences, no corral, no barn. Didn't put up any feed or vaccinate. No minerals or salt. No breeding season or helping cows calve. Cattle survived the winters by travelling miles upon miles into the bogs and eating spruce and cedar boughs. Had a herd of about 30 cows (of the ones they could find) when he sold them all about 8 years ago. Cows and bulls had matured to between the 900-1100 lb mark. Calves at 205 days would have been around the 350 lb mark.

A huge load of portable panels and horses had to be brought in to corral everything and load them out. They definitely stuck out in the crowd of the regular sale barn cattle.
 
Hereford76":2qrcgtxs said:
i hang it on a horn... that way i don't have to keep picking it up off the ground.


I have no problem with that. You do what you think is best, but bad mouthing polled cattle isn't gonna make anybodies horned cattle any better.

I've had some experience with both and IMHO their is no advantage either way in general qualities.
 
alexfarms":3j3b70rh said:
Hereford76":3j3b70rh said:
i hang it on a horn... that way i don't have to keep picking it up off the ground.


I have no problem with that. You do what you think is best, but bad mouthing polled cattle isn't gonna make anybodies horned cattle any better.

I've had some experience with both and IMHO their is no advantage either way in general qualities.

is that supposed to surprise me?

its funny when someone shares their own opinions or views and others take offense to it - its always called badmouthing, beating a dead horse, butting heads or whatever.
 
Hereford76":23svgj5l said:
alexfarms":23svgj5l said:
Hereford76":23svgj5l said:
i hang it on a horn... that way i don't have to keep picking it up off the ground.


I have no problem with that. You do what you think is best, but bad mouthing polled cattle isn't gonna make anybodies horned cattle any better.

I've had some experience with both and IMHO their is no advantage either way in general qualities.

is that supposed to surprise me?

its funny when someone shares their own opinions or views and others take offense to it - its always called badmouthing, beating a dead horse, butting heads or whatever.


Ok, this what you stated a few posts ago:

imo if they let mother nature take its course there would be no such thing as a polled hereford. imo there is way too much inconsistency, junk, whatever attached to the polled gene. sit at any sale barn, visit with any commercial hereford rancher or any feeder... there is no such thing as a commercial polled hereford ranch... maybe hobby but that about cover it. all opinion gathered all on my own."

Your saying all the "junk" and all the "inconsistency" are "attached to the polled gene". So why hasn't this ever been proven? Why are so many beef cattle breeds polled and not having to deal with these problems "attached" to the polled gene, not to mention a chorus of "horned breeders" constantly condemning the polled cattle within their breed?
 
A hermit out in the wilds of this area had a wild herd of Herefords. Lived down a deserted dead-end road surrounded by spruce bogs. Had no fences, no corral, no barn. Didn't put up any feed or vaccinate. No minerals or salt. No breeding season or helping cows calve. Cattle survived the winters by travelling miles upon miles into the bogs and eating spruce and cedar boughs. Had a herd of about 30 cows (of the ones they could find) when he sold them all about 8 years ago. Cows and bulls had matured to between the 900-1100 lb mark. Calves at 205 days would have been around the 350 lb mark.

A huge load of portable panels and horses had to be brought in to corral everything and load them out. They definitely stuck out in the crowd of the regular sale barn cattle.

Would have been an interesting experiment to have left them an extra 20 years or so and then have a close look at what type of animal you had. I'm sure they would excel at things like calving ease, disease resistance and other survivability traits.

Andrew
 
Hereford76":zucnkw73 said:
Have you ever wondered why we still have so many horned Herefords when the polled gene is dominant and if nature were let take its course then the number of horned cattle in the breed should be slowly declining.

imo if they let mother nature take its course there would be no such thing as a polled hereford. imo there is way too much inconsistency, junk, whatever attached to the polled gene. sit at any sale barn, visit with any commercial hereford rancher or any feeder... there is no such thing as a commercial polled hereford ranch... maybe hobby but that about cover it. all opinion gathered all on my own.

I guess if we went by economic value then, there would be no such thing as a horned Hereford then either, IMO, as there is no economic profitability trait tied to the horned gene.
 
smnherf":66bzfuhy said:
Hereford76":66bzfuhy said:
Have you ever wondered why we still have so many horned Herefords when the polled gene is dominant and if nature were let take its course then the number of horned cattle in the breed should be slowly declining.

imo if they let mother nature take its course there would be no such thing as a polled hereford. imo there is way too much inconsistency, junk, whatever attached to the polled gene. sit at any sale barn, visit with any commercial hereford rancher or any feeder... there is no such thing as a commercial polled hereford ranch... maybe hobby but that about cover it. all opinion gathered all on my own.

I guess if we went by economic value then, there would be no such thing as a horned Hereford then either, IMO, as there is no economic profitability trait tied to the horned gene.


If nature took it's course there would be fewer polled cattle because the horned bulls beat the crap out of the polled bulls. Look at the Aleutian cattle for proof of that.
 

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