Helping a neighbor with a bull

[Nesikep]

Neighbor's bull seems like he didn't do his job well as a yearling last year, and he wants one of my bulls as a backup for 6 weeks,.. it's before my breeding season, so that works for me.. He's currently thinking of my yearling, but I really can't give any guarantees on him, on the Limo (4 year old) he can see the calves on the ground.

He will have him for 6-7 weeks (Apr 1 - May 25)..

What should I charge? I can do all the legality and what-if's, that's been covered pretty good already, just want to make a fair deal for both parties.. I guess the price of the two bulls would also differ.

 

[Till-Hill]

$20 a cow for a good friend deal if he hauls both ways and takes care of him.

 

[Kingfisher]

Pick of the litter!

 

[Aaron]

$20 per cow exposed and I put him out, he hauled back.

 

[sim.-ang.king]

Does this mean your bull will be now classified as a helper bull? Might need to charge more, heard there is big money in helper bulls on the big ranches.

 

[WalnutCrest]

Who covets death loss?

Maybe you sell him the bull and agree to buy him back at a lower price if he's clean (no diseases) and healthy.

 

[KNERSIE]

Sheath wash and trich en vibrioses tests at his cost before returning the bull. Make sure you write into the contract how it will be dealt with if the bull tests positive for either.

 

[Rafter S]

The $20.00 per cow that a couple people mentioned sounds reasonable to me; maybe a little less if he's a friend. And WalnutCrest mentioned what if the bull dies. That might come under the legality and what-ifs that you already have covered, but if not I'd have him take out insurance on the bull.

 

[mwj]

Does this mean your bull will be now classified as a helper bull? Might need to charge more, heard there is big money in helper bulls on the big ranches.

You need to ''helper'' clean up my monitor! :lol2:

 

[Nesikep]

Thanks for the ideas..

With the health of the bull, I was wondering if his current bull (only one) would test clean if there would be any risk, he doesn't import cattle other than bulls, and I know this last bull of his came from a reputable breeder last year. Yes, there's still all the other health issues a bull can get... I'd say I want $4500 for the bull so I can get a replacement.. He has choice on if he wants to do a vet test before he goes into his herd, but I will need one before he comes back.

On the small bull I wouldn't be too worried as he's a less valuable animal. In the future I could see doing a 'bull share' since his breeding season is earlier than mine it could work, and he feeds the bull through the winter until mid may when I need him back.. It may make it possible for us to afford better bulls too in the future

 

[SPH]

$20 per cow is pretty reasonable. Probably wouldn't hurt to insure your bull too or have some kind of signed agreement on liability/responsibilities because replacing a good bull ain't cheap right now. The question I have about his yearling bull is how many cows did he have running with him and did he have the vet give a BSE before he turned him out? Most yearling bulls really should only be out with 20-25 cows at most as that will really work a young bull. Every bull we sell we have a BSE done before delivery and even the herd bull gets a yearly BSE as the last thing you want is to turn a bull out that isn't packing enough bullets. That's a lot of potential income to be missing out on if your bull can't settle the cows he's with.

 

[TennesseeTuxedo]

I don't think I'd do it.

 

[houstoncutter]

No, but he-- no! At beast case you get a little money and a bull that has a little less reserve in the cods. Worse case you get disease, injury or death. Sorry but this one is a no brainer.

 

[dun]

If you do it, make sure he is tested for at least trcih and a BSE before delivery. Then before you use him again get him trich tested again. With a healthy bull, anytime there are a good number of open cows my first thoguhts would be that the cows may have a STD. Trich would be my first thought. If the bull you loan him has problems settling cows you can eliminate the bull being the problem (that's the main reason for the BSE). And if he comes back you want to make sure he didn;t contract anything while he was there.

 

[Nesikep]

We've decided it's sale only, and since I would like to use him, I've set the price pretty high at $3000, so I have something to smile about either way. If he goes I have a chunk of change, and if he doesn't, he breeds some of my cows and gains weight, which will make him worth $3000 in meat before too long.

I know his last bull came from a reputable breeder (I've been to the breeders place and any one of them would have a home here), so I would guess the breeder would have had a BSE done on him... Those details are not much of my business though

 

[dun]

We've decided it's sale only, and since I would like to use him, I've set the price pretty high at $3000, so I have something to smile about either way. If he goes I have a chunk of change, and if he doesn't, he breeds some of my cows and gains weight, which will make him worth $3000 in meat before too long.

I know his last bull came from a reputable breeder (I've been to the breeders place and any one of them would have a home here), so I would guess the breeder would have had a BSE done on him... Those details are not much of my business though

That was the reason for the trich comments. A guy south of us bought a herd of cows and turned his bulls in with them and his other cows. His old herd calved lilke they should have the first year, the other herd was very spotty. He used the bulls that had been with the new herd on his older herd the second year. Calving was spotty in both herds. Sold one of the older bulls and in MO if you sell a bull for breeding it has to have a trich test. Bull failed, tested all the other bulls, they all failed. Turned out that the new herd of cows had at least some trich carriers.

 

[WalnutCrest]

We've decided it's sale only, and since I would like to use him, I've set the price pretty high at $3000, so I have something to smile about either way. If he goes I have a chunk of change, and if he doesn't, he breeds some of my cows and gains weight, which will make him worth $3000 in meat before too long.

I know his last bull came from a reputable breeder (I've been to the breeders place and any one of them would have a home here), so I would guess the breeder would have had a BSE done on him... Those details are not much of my business though

That was the reason for the trich comments. A guy south of us bought a herd of cows and turned his bulls in with them and his other cows. His old herd calved lilke they should have the first year, the other herd was very spotty. He used the bulls that had been with the new herd on his older herd the second year. Calving was spotty in both herds. Sold one of the older bulls and in MO if you sell a bull for breeding it has to have a trich test. Bull failed, tested all the other bulls, they all failed. Turned out that the new herd of cows had at least some trich carriers.

Yup.

Buying a herd of cows with some trich carriers is one expensive proposition ... as (presumably) now all the cows are trich carriers ...

 

[Red Bull Breeder]

Bulls are the ones that carry trich.

 

[Rafter S]

Bulls are the ones that carry trich.

Yes, but don't they get it from cows?

 

[Red Bull Breeder]

A infected bull never gets over trich. Infected cow will. Bred cow does not have trich open cow can. They only test bulls.