I was all set to buy Sure Fire semen and I posted about it on the Facebook A.I. Good/Bad and they jumped all over me because of Sure Fire's feet. But, there are SO many people who have them and love them and BUY them. There seems to be a double standard on feet. If people like a bull they don't talk about feet even when the epds are BAD.
GAR Sure Fire daughters
- Thread starter VaCowman
- Start date
Help Support CattleToday:
T & B farms
Well-known member
Air gator said:
A Gar bull with bad feet? I'm sure that's not true.
jscunn
Well-known member
Air Gator,
Careful with places like here, facebook, even one on one conversations. Everyone one wants to say "Bull A0023" has horrible feet, or you need to check out the the feet on A0023 progeny before you buy any. The first question you should ask in response
"have you ever owned any A0023 progeny?"
(No)
" Have you seen any A0023 progeny"
(No)
"well how do you really know?"
( Well I heard. )
We are all guilty of it. Only believe what you see, and then only believe it if either you own it or you see enough of them more than 10 at once to form a semi educated opinion. If you only see one the owner may have used Bull A0023 as a corrective mating on a bad footed cow and try and fix her and he didn't.
Not a big believer in the Foot Score EPDs yet either, just not enough data turned in yet. It is a step in the right direction thou.
*** for the purpose of this post Bull A0023 is fake.. :lol: ***
Careful with places like here, facebook, even one on one conversations. Everyone one wants to say "Bull A0023" has horrible feet, or you need to check out the the feet on A0023 progeny before you buy any. The first question you should ask in response
"have you ever owned any A0023 progeny?"
(No)
" Have you seen any A0023 progeny"
(No)
"well how do you really know?"
( Well I heard. )
We are all guilty of it. Only believe what you see, and then only believe it if either you own it or you see enough of them more than 10 at once to form a semi educated opinion. If you only see one the owner may have used Bull A0023 as a corrective mating on a bad footed cow and try and fix her and he didn't.
Not a big believer in the Foot Score EPDs yet either, just not enough data turned in yet. It is a step in the right direction thou.
*** for the purpose of this post Bull A0023 is fake.. :lol: ***
Ebenezer
Well-known member
And I was just getting ready to order semen on him! :cry2:
I'm not an Angus breeder but I will be using Angus genetics in a side project of mine I have been working on for several years. I spoke with one of the Gardiner brothers a couple of years ago in determining the right bulls I should use from his herd. We immediately agreed on 2 bulls and he suggested a third - Sure Fire... he told me that he personally really really liked that bull and expected exciting results from him as time progressed. He didn't elaborate beyond that, but if you have a breeder tell you that out of all his bulls he mentions him specifically... well I bought some straws on him after that conversation. Don't know if that helps anyone here, but thought it might coming from the breeder.
Bestoutwest
Well-known member
lms0229 said:
I'd rather get it from the breeder than the rep. I got one from QH Rampage that was not my favorite. He was 1/2 LH and grew like a weed, but was not the most pleasant creature. When I looked into things, Rampage's DOC score had tanked after he was bred to a bunch.....shocker.
jscunn
Well-known member
Bestoutwest,
You would never name a calm bull Rampage. LOL
About Sure Fire, breed him to a cow with a lot of middle (rib) they aren't the deepest creatures here. Thought I was gonna use him again this year but I am moving on to something else. They aren't bad just don't wow me right now. One of the heifers is out of a heifer but the other one is out of a "bullet proof" cow as far as raising good calves.
You would never name a calm bull Rampage. LOL
About Sure Fire, breed him to a cow with a lot of middle (rib) they aren't the deepest creatures here. Thought I was gonna use him again this year but I am moving on to something else. They aren't bad just don't wow me right now. One of the heifers is out of a heifer but the other one is out of a "bullet proof" cow as far as raising good calves.
I was talking to my rep this morning and Sure Fire came up. He said the exact same thing as jscunn about depth. He said they were good, but worked best on cows with lots of middle. He also said that he thought Prophet had more muscle. I looked at prophet, but his DMI scared me away, not the reports of sporadic chrome. 
jscunn
Well-known member
This is the better of the 2 Sure Fire Calves.
She could sure use some depth of rib, her mother has plenty. It will be interesting to see her develop some more. She isn't bad but surely isn't great.