feeding suggestion

[J. T.]

Look kid, I am an Auburn University graduate with nearly 20 years of ag teaching under my belt and I've been around cattle practically all my life. Now listen, you've been given some dang good advice from people who are very knowledgeable. Maybe you've got a dud steer that just doesn't have the genes for a very high ADG. One of my students had a steer that just wouldn't make the weight division and he was turned away from the District show in Birmingham. It was heartbreaking, but that's the cow business buddy. Some make it, some don't. Another student had a dandy F-1 Simmentalx Brahman heifer. In Muscle Shoals she had to compete with purebred Simmentals and she placed dead last because of the Brahman traits of loose hide and sloping from hooks to pins. Everywhere else she competed with the American breeds and cleaned up! It was not in her genetic makeup to be a level rumped, tight hided heifer. She was half Brahman!! Now, dry your eyes and wipe your snotty nose and perservere. This steer may not make it, but it's not the end of the world!

 

[shorthorn cowgirl]

I would agree on the corn or have you tried beet pulp. I also agree on gettin him a buddy.

 

[shorthorn cowgirl]

If you do use beet pulp soke it in water over night then when you use it get however much you want and drain the water out and mix it with there feed.

 

[msscamp]

If you do use beet pulp soke it in water over night then when you use it get however much you want and drain the water out and mix it with there feed.

As we've fed beet pulp for quite a number of years - both pelleted and in bulk - I think I'm safe in saying that it does not have to be soaked for cattle, only horses. Horses tend to choke on dry beet pulp, cattle do not.

 

[shorthorn cowgirl]

I agree. But I have a filling this calf can sense what is in his feed. So me and brother saw somebody at a show soaking beet pulp in water. So when we got home we tried it. We let soak over the night and the next morning we went out to feed. put some beet pulp in and in mixed it up. You could not even tell that we put it in there. But i agrree with you msscamp, unless your calf is a picky eater.

 

[msscamp]

I agree. But I have a filling this calf can sense what is in his feed. So me and brother saw somebody at a show soaking beet pulp in water. So when we got home we tried it. We let soak over the night and the next morning we went out to feed. put some beet pulp in and in mixed it up. You could not even tell that we put it in there. But i agrree with you msscamp, unless your calf is a picky eater.

Valid point, we don't raise show cattle so they either get over the pickiness or they don't eat - their choice!

 

[jaydill]

ok. let me clear some things up. i'm sure some of my hostility sparked towards milkmaid started because she has criticized my ag teachers before, without knowing a thing about them. criticizing my ag teachers doesn't fix the problem nor does it answer the question i asked.

second, my steer is not a dud. he's a heavyweight steer.. eating a lot, but NOT ENOUGH which is where the problem is coming from.

i wouldn't be "throwing a tantrum" if i could just get some straight answers instead of irrelevant comments such as "i don't think very highly of your ag teachers" which is obviously going to unsettle a person. if i could, for once, ask a question on this board and get responses from people who are going to answer the question asked without feeling attacked, than maybe i wouldn't be quite so hostile.

The trouble with this board is you get someone posting with a question and not "hearing" the 21 good, solid answers posted because they don't think it is "the" answer. I find people on this board to be extremely knowledgeable, because most are basing answers on real world trial and error.

i don't disagree with you about having extremely knowledgeable people here...otherwise i wouldn't have asked the question here. i might've gone to another board.

as far as my question...the type of responses i was hoping to get was something along the lines of "i once had a finicky steer and i...". the problem with what i'm getting is these are ordinary solutions and many from people with british cattle that are going to put on fat much easier than my calf.

as far as my calf, here are some answers. he's a heavyweight simbrah steer, weighing 1280#. making the weight is not the problem. the problem is he won't grow wide. now that he's leveled off in height, we're still struggling to get him to fatten up. we've tried b12, beet pulp (although i may try mixing in beet pulp again), corn(which he is still on), barley(which he is still on), letting him out for exercise every night, letting him out for exercise every other night...we've tried every suggestion i've received here except cert's suggestion to cook the corn (rather than buy it cracked), Lauren's suggestion of rice bran, and the suggestion to add a buddy. all of these i'm going to try...but again, i do not think i can work out adding a buddy. however, the cooked corn i'm also going to try.

someone else suggested show bloom and i've also been suggested a heifer implant by someone else. so i have a new question: how is show bloom working for those who have tried it? and has anyone ever used a heifer implant for either a steer or heifer and had it work in increasing the weight/fat gain?

although i do often feel provoked on these boards, i do apologize for the hostility i may have exhibited. while saying that, i also hope that others might also think a moment about what they're going to say, before they say it.

thanks
jay

 

[msscamp]

i'm sure some of my hostility sparked towards milkmaid started because she has criticized my ag teachers before, without knowing a thing about them. criticizing my ag teachers doesn't fix the problem nor does it answer the question i asked.

As far as I'm concerned that isn't good enough. I would take Milkmaids advice over your ag teachers any day of the week! She has proven her knowledge, ability, and commitment - something your ag teachers have not. Plus she has a vested interest in making sure she is correct and knows what she is talking about, something else your ag teachers are lacking. Additionally, she has shown quite a few animals and that gives her the experience to further back up her posts.

second, my steer is not a dud. he's a heavyweight steer.. eating a lot, but NOT ENOUGH which is where the problem is coming from.

I don't suppose the thought ever crossed your mind that, just possibly, your steer is eating all he desires and/or needs? Some animals will eat themselves into a heart attack and some won't. The way you are housing him sure doesn't help matters. Cattle need fresh air, exercise, companionship, and room to roam. That is just the nature of the beast.

i wouldn't be "throwing a tantrum" if i could just get some straight answers instead of irrelevant comments such as "i don't think very highly of your ag teachers" which is obviously going to unsettle a person. if i could, for once, ask a question on this board and get responses from people who are going to answer the question asked without feeling attacked, than maybe i wouldn't be quite so hostile.

Perhaps the problem is you are looking for a set answer when one does not exist and, therefore, disregarding all of the answers that could help you to understand this steer and see it from his perspective. Cattle are as idiosyncratic as people are - one size does not fit all most times. Just a thought.

he's a heavyweight simbrah steer, weighing 1280#. making the weight is not the problem. the problem is he won't grow wide. now that he's leveled off in height, we're still struggling to get him to fatten up. we've tried b12, beet pulp (although i may try mixing in beet pulp again), corn(which he is still on), barley(which he is still on), letting him out for exercise every night, letting him out for exercise every other night...we've tried every suggestion i've received here except cert's suggestion to cook the corn (rather than buy it cracked), Lauren's suggestion of rice bran, and the suggestion to add a buddy. all of these i'm going to try...but again, i do not think i can work out adding a buddy. however, the cooked corn i'm also going to try.

While I could very easily be wrong here, I believe a Simbrah is a cross between a Simmental and a Brahman (sp?). I don't believe I've ever seen a 'wide' Brahman (sp?) animal. Brahman cattle were breed to be able to survive and prosper in the heat of Texas, therefore additional weight would be a problem as I understand it - again, I may be wrong. It's possible you are looking to the wrong genetics to get done what you want done. If that is the case, there is nothing that can be done about it. It's just the way it is.

thanks
jay

 

[triple'S']

out of the ordinary advise to make him gain wieght?

people used to stick a water hose up their butt for a little while, but I wouldn't recommend that. Its just a quick fix, won't last long.

Just kidding, I don't know all my calves get is mom's milk, grass, and if prices are good, some soybean hulls for a few weeks before the sale.

 

[milkmaid]

First, dph and msscamp, thanks.

Second, Jay, I will comment on a few things.

This is one thing I find unattractive about these boards. You ask one question, don't get the answer to your question, but instead get 21 back.

I went and read all your previous posts before I made my initial response. You know what I found? you've asked the same question, gotten the same responses, over and over and over. And still, from all we've seen, you aren't taking any advice. From my viewpoint, you're sitting at the computer, wringing your hands because your steer won't eat, but for every suggestion we offer you insist it won't work.

You come on these boards and you post "My steer won't eat, what can I do? I've tried everything" - and we need more information. Of course we're going to ask questions! I note that you finally gave some information in your last post. When someone comes on and asks such a general question we cannot give an good response without knowing more about the animal. That's akin to "my cow's sick, what do I do?"...well, symptoms, age, etc, would be nice before we can help anyone make a diagnosis.

This is why I asked for no criticism. You do not know that they haven't tried it all because I haven't listed it out for you.

List it. Exactly what you tried, for what length of time (1 day isn't enough to tell anything), what response you noticed from your steer, and why you think it wasn't working.

as far as my question...the type of responses i was hoping to get was something along the lines of "i once had a finicky steer and i...". the problem with what i'm getting is these are ordinary solutions and many from people with british cattle that are going to put on fat much easier than my calf.

Jay, I have/had a few angus crosses, but for the most part I deal with holsteins. Those are what I work to put weight on, and I dare say getting a holstein fat is a lot harder than finishing out your beef animal. A dairy animal would make your steer look like a meat wagon.

We're more than willing to help, if you're willing to try.

 

[Bez!]

MM wrote:

Jay, I have/had a few angus crosses, but for the most part I deal with holsteins. Those are what I work to put weight on, and I dare say getting a holstein fat is a lot harder than finishing out your beef animal. A dairy animal would make your steer look like a meat wagon.

Now that is funny! :lol:

Bez!

 

[JHH]

I think you have gotten some good advice and dont want to try it because you say it wont work.

TRY putting some molasis(sp) in with his feed they like something sweet and will generally clean up the feed. I feed soaked (water) oats with ground corn and vitamins,along with some other stuff ground in with corn. But I havent been feeding show steers till last year and this year.

Be carefull with the oats if you try that can cause bloat being soaked with water.

I really dont think he will get wide ( some animals just dont)
I have a steer that I dont think will be tall enough (time will tell)

Just try the best you can and if you lose then try harder next year. Maybe with different breed if you choose.

You have gotten some really good advice now go use it and tell us how he does in 30 days .

 

[CattleAnnie]

Last year the kids were having a devil of a time getting their 4H steers to eat their grain.

It was suggested to add molasses to the ration. So bought the dried molasses and did just that. They finished fine.

The kids current 4H steers are licking up their ration. Being fed rolled barley, rumensin, and dried molasses and looking fat and sassy on it. Also getting some hay twice daily when they've cleaned up their grain.

Hope this helps.

Take care.

 

[cowgirl]

Your calf is depressed, lonely, he needs excercise to stimulate his appetite atleast 1-2 hrs a day. Or at the very least take him for a walk, give him probias- in the tube it is a blue paste 60 gram tube, give him 10 cc twice a day for 5 days. all the hay he wants, take out the hay he does not eat each feeding and give him new. Shake it out in the hay rack, they love the findings in the hay, give him alot of attention, they love that. Top dress the feed w/ hay cubes, or carrots or somehting different. Believe me I have been where you are and done all this it has made a big difference. Put alot of effort in to it. Good luck I would put a buddy in w/ him and seperate them at feeding.

 

[farmer4620]

steam rolled corn, soybean meal, and silage be growing a 3.5 lbs per day in no time

 

[ctlbaron]

As far as the buddy goes it doesn't necessarily have to be another cow either. A walking horse trainer here keeps goats on his place for picky eaters. If a horse is not eating enough to flesh out he will put a grown goat in the stall with him for a few days. The goat is always ready to eat. If the horse don't get in the trough when the feed is poured in he will miss out on a good portion of his feed. In a few days the horse will be the first one to put his head in the trough.

 

[jaydill]

Thank you for all the suggestions given to me here.

I have taken Milkmaid's advice and am taking matters into my own hands...I was reflecting on my ag teachers earlier today and while I respect them, I don't feel that they did all that was in their power early enough for them to help my steer.

However, that is what I have you guys for, and your suggestions have been great. I am here for an update because I'm in a bit of a bind.

Here's the update: I've returned to letting my steer out at nights; he goes out about every other night. I attempted to get a buddy for my steer, but there was only one calf in the barn that I could place with him. (partially due to space) The problem with that...is that we contacted the breeder to see if he'd be alright with it, but he declined. So as of this moment, the buddy option is out. I've also got an order of two 50 lb. bags of rice bran being held at the feed store for me (I'm going to get them tomorrow) which I'm going to be adding to his feed immediately.

As far as the buddy goes it doesn't necessarily have to be another cow either. A walking horse trainer here keeps goats on his place for picky eaters. If a horse is not eating enough to flesh out he will put a grown goat in the stall with him for a few days.

I'm working on seeing if we've got a goat that I can put in with him, as there are a few kids who've failed and won't be able to show at the majors so they may be willing to lend their goat to me for a small price.

What I'm wondering now is if there are any more suggestions for putting s'more fat on my steer? I can get a picture up soon...I'll try to take one of him all set up this weekend. Also, about how much does dry molasses (in the bag) run?

Thanks again,
Jaydill

 

[TxSimbrahShower]

We have a registered Simbrah herd and my son shows Simbrah's. If the steer doesn't have the genetics to be broad, (I'm assuming you mean across his back), then he will never be broad. Not to sound nasty, but, if he was sold for a steer, then he was not one of the best in the pasture.

My son showed a registered Simbrah steer a few years back, he was like you are stating, didn't finish like he should have. It was a fight from the get go to even get him to 1250#. However, one good thing, brought him back home, put him on a straight diet of flaked corn for 30 to 40 days, best steak I think that I have ever eaten, melted in your mouth like butter.

As far as the implant, it is probably too late, depending on when you are going to show him. Withdrawal times. We use show bloom, works good for us. Another thing, have you tried to feed him 3 times a day, (if possible)

As far as ag. teachers, to be honest, they push the british and continental breeds, that's what they know the most about. Easy to put fat on them. Less work and hassle for teacher's.
Also, don't have to have the best, can hide flaws with the hair.

 

[J. T.]

As far as ag. teachers, to be honest, they push the british and continental breeds, that's what they know the most about. Easy to put fat on them. Less work and hassle for teacher's.
Also, don't have to have the best, can hide flaws with the hair.

This Ag teacher loves Brahman based cattle and raises Brangus. Can't beat a Brahman cow on "hot' Fescue and timber. I always enjoy helping a kid with any breed of cattle, but I like the Brahman based breeds the best. In fact I have encouraged my cattle showers to purchase an American type heifer.

 

[jaydill]

Thanks SimbrahShower. We've currently got my steer at 1300 lbs. It's just the fat we're trying to push. I actually just bought a new feed I'm going to switch him over to and see how he does on that. Someone suggested that he may just be tired of the feed so hopefully that'll be part of it. I've also got him on some rice bran now...now let's just keep our fingers crossed and hope he'll eat it! Thanks again for the suggestions!

Jay