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drug labels do they mean anything?

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How many producers read and follow label directions on animal meds

  • yes we follow label directions

    Votes: 18 100.0%
  • no we do not follow label directions

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Total voters
    18

regolith

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"Off-label use" is not the same as "ignore them and do whatever they want to do."

There are certain drugs I use off-label under a vet's direction. There are others I inject in a different area to that specified because to do as the label recommends is either impossible or dangerous.
I read the label of every drug I'm unfamiliar with. When they change the recommendations, I rely on my vet to inform me of that next time I buy it. Several common antibiotics have had the withholding time increased within the last few years.

how many producers actually read and follow label directions
I don't think you'll get useful answers starting a discussion this way. Maybe on a vet's forum. It's acknowledged that a great many people lack the desire to read, or the ability to follow simple instructions... in the minds of those giving the instructions.
So I hear about this sort of stuff sometimes when talking with vets. That doesn't mean I can take any guess as to how wide-spread it is, or whether anyone out there is actually perfect.
 

msscamp

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what?":27mm1jn3 said:
a post awhile back by dun got me wondering how many producers actually read and follow label directions and how many producers ignore them and do whatever they want to do.

Yes, we read and followed label directions. A very few drugs were used differently from the label directions, but always under the supervision of a licensed vet.
 

CKC1586

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msscamp":2db63x6o said:
what?":2db63x6o said:
a post awhile back by dun got me wondering how many producers actually read and follow label directions and how many producers ignore them and do whatever they want to do.

Yes, we read and followed label directions. A very few drugs were used differently from the label directions, but always under the supervision of a licensed vet.


:nod:
 

Howdyjabo

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In the USA "off label use" is exactly what we call it.

I tried to explain to you the last time that the cost of rewriting the label as new uses/changes are found is prohibitive. It is common practice in Veterinarian and Medical fields to take the new information and use it as "off label use".

I don't see why you are so hung up on this subject
Yes I do read labels and follow them--- till I am told different by someone who should know.

As far as the Banamine its is such common practice to recommend using it "off label" by field reps and vets---- that now everyone knows.
They know it works and they have done the withdrawal protocols.

The requirements to produce a label are there for a reason- but with all good things too much of a good thing backfires
If you have an issue with "off label use" then put your efforts into the proper spot and lobby to have the requirements streamlined for cost effective additions/changes to current labels.
 

milkmaid

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Unless you get an accurate, actual weight on an individual animal prior to giving it X medicine and then use a calculator and an extremely accurate syringe.... you're using it off label.

Drug labels are a good guideline; go as close to the guideline as possible but don't be afraid to use it off label when necessary. For a severe case of pneumonia one dose of X med may not be sufficient. More important to treat with what works until the animal is better than use each antibiotic once until you've created a drug-resistant chronic lunger. Observe withdrawal times, extend them when necessary, keep track of what was treated off label and it's not an issue.

Not sure why you've got that chip on your shoulder but I suggest you stop trying to pick a fight; you aren't going to win this one.
 

Pickles Dillman

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[/quote]
i don't care how common it is these are the people i listen to

http://www.fda.gov/cvm/FlunixinGlumine.htm[/quote]

If these are the people you listen to, then please GO LISTEN TO THEM!
In the real world its not always by the book! Sometime you have to apply past experience and a little commom sense while making everyday judgement calls, wheather its medicating an animal or even adjusting their feed.

The wife said I had to edit out the rest of orig. post !
 

TexasBred

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I've used drugs "extra label" but always after consulting the vet. Have also been known to give larger than recommended doses of antibiotics. "Kill or cure" doses.
 

Howdyjabo

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I'm not defending Dun- he doesn't need defending
You were just wrong
I thought I could post and help you see the situation based on the real world we live in.
My mistake
 

rockridgecattle

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We follow the drug directions unles stipulated by our vet. For example the drug "nuflor" is not recommended for navel ill, but our vet has ok'd the used of it for that.
All drugs, unless specified by the vet are followed for dosage because this changes the withdrawl times

All drugs are given where the manufacture says to. If it says IM that is where it goes. If it says SQ that is where it goes. If it says in the ear that is also given where it goes. Doing otherwise delays withdrawls and in some cased with these new drugs "can" lead to residual. Our vet is very vocal about this and make no bones on calling a customer out (repectfully) on mis use of drug injections

All drugs are followed under a vets advice, for us the call is free and welcomed when a question about treating with what, how much, and withdrawl

RR
 

TheBullLady

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I'm also confused as to the point you're trying to make.. if any? When veterinarians dispense drugs, they sometimes overwrite the actual label on the bottle, but isn't that so you have legible instructions also? Many drugs are not species specific, so you'd have to know the dosage regardless. There are also many drugs (as mentioned previously) that are not "labeled" for certain sicknesses, diseases, conditions, etc., but are still acceptable to use.

The POINT to labeling and how you administer the drug is the resisdual in the meat / organs / blood, whatever. Consumers are worried because we keep hearing about how treating animals with certain medicines is making people resistant to them.. which I don't believe. There are irresponsible ranchers / cattlepersons that will use medications with absolutely no concern as to withdrawl times, because their main concern is selling something and making sure it looks to be healthy when they sell. Happens all the time, because people don't like to be ACCOUNTABLE for their actions. I'm going to suggest that THIS is the main problem, not people that don't read labels.
 

hillsdown

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I go off label on some things esp. pen. But with everything you MUST know withdrawal times. Fortunately 99.99% of animals I sell for food consumption have been 100% healthy and have had no need for any meds.

When we dairied however off label was never ever done unless our vet was with us and worked out the exact withdrawal time. Shipping milk with residuals in it is very costly as well as wrong. The milk from everyone on your run will be dumped out at your place and you will be have to pay for everyone's milk as well as all the trucking so it could cost you 20 - 30 thousand dollars for a very stupid error..It happened to us once when we had a relief milker and he milked a treated cow straight into the tank..The guy was lucky to escape with his life.. :mad:

The first time I bought banamine (from my vet clinic) I got home and read the label and it said IV use only. I called my vet because everyone on here was using it IM. He said try to use it IV if you can not get it in the neck vain the first 2 tries do not torture the calf anymore and do it IM. I have only used it on young calves and now do not use it very often at all because it is really really hard on the gut.

Now if you all would have been here to see how much meds and the wayyyyyy off label doses we gave to our cow with the uterine prolapse last Feb. some of you would be stunned..But, she lived, the uterus stayed in ,she is raising her calf as well as supplementing a twin and our vet said she should have no reoccurring problems again..She will live her life out here with us as well and will never ever enter the food chain..

I wouldn't recommend off label use to just anyone, but as was stated before on here,the drug companies need to update label usage and in withdrawal times, but because it costs money they just inform the vets and they are to inform the clients.
 

dun

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The vet was aware that the withholding had recently been changed but couldn't off the top of his head remember what it was.
Banamine is also really hard on the injection site and leaves severe carcass blamishes.
 

hillsdown

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I agree What, and that is why I answered honestly and forthright. I do my best to ensure that withdrawal times are more than met. Like if it is safe to ship in 21 days I will wait at least 30 ect.. I want to produce the best product for my consumers and ensure that my beef is safe for human consumption..I assume I am just like the majority of producers out there..

BTW, if I have a med question my very experienced and highly informed vet is the first person I call...
 

Angus Cowman

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what?":ffigewbs said:
Pickles Dillman":ffigewbs said:
If these are the people you listen to, then please GO LISTEN TO THEM!
In the real world its not always by the book! Sometime you have to apply past experience and a little commom sense while making everyday judgement calls, wheather its medicating an animal or even adjusting their feed.

The wife said I had to edit out the rest of orig. post !
what % of your herd and how many of your cattle are slaughtered thru a usda inspected facility?
Do you actually believe just because a slaughter house is USDA inspected that their is an Inspector present all the time?
A USDA inspected facility just means that they meet the USDA requirements to proccess and sell meat as a retail product and they are randomly inspected it does not mean that they have an inspector on site when butchering and proccessing
 

Workinonit Farm

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Angus Cowman":1xh7ul3g said:
it does not mean that they have an inspector on site when butchering and proccessing

That may be the case for some facilities, however, the facility where I take my animals to be processed for myself as well as my 'customers' does indeed have an inspector present, on duty, on the kill floor and in the cutting room from 8:30 am to 3:30 pm Mon. thru Fri. That is one of the main reasons that I use that facility. I like it and my customers like that. If there is something wrong with any animal/carcass of mine, I want to know.

As for the animals I take to the sale-barn which then go to a feedlot, then to whatever place for processing, I have no idea what the inspector is or isn't doing wherever that happens to be.

But I do know that the animals I carry to the market/sale will not have any chemical residue in their systems. Fortunately, my animals rarely need any medication of any kind. Standard vaccines and de-wormers is what is used. The occasions where there has been a need for meds, have been mainly the occasional calf, and one cow with 'mild' mastitis 3 years ago. Yes, I read the labels on the meds, and when the vet has instructed extra-label use, i followed his instructions.

What will really irk me to no end are the few folks (I know of 3 within 8 miles of me) who will 'willy-nilly' give a 'penicillin' shot for anything and everything, then ship the animal.

Katherine
 

redluv

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Every plant I have been to (swine and beef) has had a USDA inspector there stamping carcasses while they are processing meat.
 

milkmaid

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Why do you assume that every animal that is treated in an off label manner is going to slaughter???

Significant portion of sick cattle out there are not at the right age/weight to be run through the auction ring or sent direct to the plant within the next 60 days anyway. In the last 5 years I've only had ONE cow that was treated with antibiotics that went to slaughter within the next 2 months. She went after the extended withdrawal period was more than over. Everything else I've treated is younger and/or further from a slaughter date or not going to slaughter, period.

You want to talk about withdrawal times and problems with the way drugs are labeled there's plenty to talk about, but getting fixated on something like the fact that some bovines do get treated in an off label manner is like a coon dog that's chasing rabbits. A totally worthless discussion.
 

milkmaid

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what?":3eguxtke said:
milkmaid":3eguxtke said:
Why do you assume that every animal that is treated in an off label manner is going to slaughter???
show me where i ever said anything like that milkmaid

my problem is with people who do not read and follow label directions PERIOD. i wonder as a member of the posse like yourself does it bother you the least bit when you continue making excuses and diverting away from the original question just to protect one of the gang?

If you accepted the fact that most animals treated off-label (or treated, period) are not going to slaughter in the near future, then you wouldn't have brought up such a pointless question in the first place.

I am not defending anyone; I walk my own path, make my own choices, and come and go at will on this forum. I have a pretty good idea what started you on this original topic but I don't know or care why you chose to pick a bone with dun. You bring up the medical treatment of animals and you get my opinion, unbiased by whatever forum member it is that is indirectly involved in this post or any other.

You're doing an excellent job yourself of skirting the subject at hand by insisting everyone who disagrees with you is part of a posse. I don't have time for such nonsense and most folks on here don't either.
 

Howdyjabo

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what? Your posts are now blocked
Do not EVER PM me again.
How dare you invade my privacy

Macon there is something really bad going on with this NUT- he has a way of monitoring what members are doing with their computer outside of this site.
 

showing71

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I have always and will always follow drug labels, unless I have consulted with a vet. I don't care if it's a steer going to slaughter or a cow out in the pasture, there are instruction/cautions for a reason. I never want to be blamed for mistreating and causing a problem. I'm a bit of an organization freak and also keep records of who I treated, when, why, where, with what, and the number and expiration date of the vaccine along with the withdrawl period.
 
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