Consistancy, Quality & Crossbreeding

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Anonymous

As long as your definition of consistancy and quality is based on the hair color of the animal then the purebred advocates are correct, using a composite or crossbred bull will not give you the consistancy you are looking for. So cattle breeding becomes real easy and real simple, just breed black cattle to black cattle and you have it made, can't go wrong can you?
 
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Anonymous

But if your definition of consistency is based on growth, fertility, yield and quality grades, you would best use a registered bull with a full set of EPDs.
 
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Anonymous

Yep, now you are talking, use hide color AND numbers. Numbers that may or may not be indicative of actual performance, numbers that may or may not be very distorted (either accidently or by design), numbers that are mostly only a defacto indicator of growth rates.

Let me see if I got this right. If I breed the biggest and the blackest to the biggest and blackest, shouldn't be long before the money starts rolling in. This cattle business gets easier and easier every year. Thanks purebred breeders! Opps, I mean thanks REGISTERED purebred breeders! And a special thanks to you members of the largest registered purebred association because, after all bigger is always better, right?
 
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Anonymous

Went back and read my post. I didn't mention hide color or beed. Several breeds, and colors, have growth AND carcass EPDs. If you want to breed the biggest to the biggest, go ahead. That's the great thing about EPDs, you can use them to upsize, downsize, increase milk, decrease milk, increase quaity grade or decrease yield grade...whatever you think will make you the most money. The list is almost endless for the use of EPDs. Apparently you haven't learned how to use them. But it's not too late. They're not going away.

Yep, now you are talking, use hide
> color AND numbers. Numbers that
> may or may not be indicative of
> actual performance, numbers that
> may or may not be very distorted
> (either accidently or by design),
> numbers that are mostly only a
> defacto indicator of growth rates.

> Let me see if I got this right. If
> I breed the biggest and the
> blackest to the biggest and
> blackest, shouldn't be long before
> the money starts rolling in. This
> cattle business gets easier and
> easier every year. Thanks purebred
> breeders! Opps, I mean thanks
> REGISTERED purebred breeders! And
> a special thanks to you members of
> the largest registered purebred
> association because, after all
> bigger is always better, right?
 
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A

Anonymous

just think you are another Black Angus pasionate breeder, If I'm wrong just excuse me. BUT if you are just read this: Angus is a breed with far less genetic consistency than most beef breeds. The assumption that the Angus breed is still the industry standard for consistent quality grade carcass traits is more a product of promotional hype than actual independent carcass evaluations. The inconsistencies in both carcass marbling quality and back fat levels in the genetic base of the present Angus breed have been shown by the wide range of values that have emerged from the rescent generation of carcass EPD's for the breed.

> Yep, now you are talking, use hide
> color AND numbers. Numbers that
> may or may not be indicative of
> actual performance, numbers that
> may or may not be very distorted
> (either accidently or by design),
> numbers that are mostly only a
> defacto indicator of growth rates.

> Let me see if I got this right. If
> I breed the biggest and the
> blackest to the biggest and
> blackest, shouldn't be long before
> the money starts rolling in. This
> cattle business gets easier and
> easier every year. Thanks purebred
> breeders! Opps, I mean thanks
> REGISTERED purebred breeders! And
> a special thanks to you members of
> the largest registered purebred
> association because, after all
> bigger is always better, right?



[email protected]
 
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A

Anonymous

Don't much care what you think. You bet I'm a "pasionate" (your spelling) Angus breeder. There is more variety in the Angus breed than any other. Not everyone wants/needs the same kind of bull. I think diversity is one of the Angus breed's strong points. If you pay attention to EPDs, you can find an Angus bull that will work for you, whether you sell at the sale barn or the feedlot, whether your cattle graze in east or west Texas. Not every Angus bull will marble, but pay attention to EPDs and you'll find many that will. Some Angus bulls are too fat, pay attention to EPDs and you can avoid those if you want. Not every Angus bull will give you heavy milking daughters, but pay attention to EPDs and many will (or not, if you don't have the forage for heavy milking cows).

> just think you are another Black
> Angus pasionate breeder, If I'm
> wrong just excuse me. BUT if you
> are just read this: Angus is a
> breed with far less genetic
> consistency than most beef breeds.
> The assumption that the Angus
> breed is still the industry
> standard for consistent quality
> grade carcass traits is more a
> product of promotional hype than
> actual independent carcass
> evaluations. The inconsistencies
> in both carcass marbling quality
> and back fat levels in the genetic
> base of the present Angus breed
> have been shown by the wide range
> of values that have emerged from
> the rescent generation of carcass
> EPD's for the breed.
 
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A

Anonymous

I was not talking to you... but what you wrote just confirm my thoughts of genetic inconsistency in the Angus breed

> Don't much care what you think.
> You bet I'm a
> "pasionate" (your
> spelling) Angus breeder. There is
> more variety in the Angus breed
> than any other. Not everyone
> wants/needs the same kind of bull.
> I think diversity is one of the
> Angus breed's strong points. If
> you pay attention to EPDs, you can
> find an Angus bull that will work
> for you, whether you sell at the
> sale barn or the feedlot, whether
> your cattle graze in east or west
> Texas. Not every Angus bull will
> marble, but pay attention to EPDs
> and you'll find many that will.
> Some Angus bulls are too fat, pay
> attention to EPDs and you can
> avoid those if you want. Not every
> Angus bull will give you heavy
> milking daughters, but pay
> attention to EPDs and many will
> (or not, if you don't have the
> forage for heavy milking cows).



[email protected]
 
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A

Anonymous

Just to let you know I'm using Red Angus semen in part of my Simmental herd (for my comercial replacement females), I don't have anything against Angus but you Angus breeders have to accept all the negative facts that your Breed has.

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Anonymous

Just a few "Negatives"

Deepest genetic base Moderate Frame Great Carcass Traits Black Hide Polled Better Disposition than any Exotic Industry and Consumer Preference Strongest Breed Association

Your "niche market" beef exotics have all been the fad at one time or another, but only one breed has stood the test of time and that breed is Angus. I know i've had Limo's and Charlois, and Salers, theres only one breed i've come back to and thats Angus. You hobby farmers can your three head of Murray Grey's or Limo Simmi giant cows or your Longhorns but the Cattle Business Beef Breed is and always will be Angus.



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A

Anonymous

"... but what you wrote just confirm my thoughts of genetic inconsistency in the Angus breed"

You can call it inconsistency; I call it diversity and it's a great strength of the breed. Whatever trait you want, you can likely find it in the Angus breed. The Angus breed isn't perfect; but they rate high in every economically important beef trait, fetility, feed efficiency, carcass quality.... That's why they are so widly used here in the US, why so many other breeds have incorporated them into their breed base.
 
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Anonymous

and I am sure many other breeders and breed associations thank you......with your attitude....it really is best that you just stick with Angus
 
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Anonymous

The cattle business beef breed will always be quality crossbreeds.

dun

> Just a few "Negatives"

> Deepest genetic base Moderate
> Frame Great Carcass Traits Black
> Hide Polled Better Disposition
> than any Exotic Industry and
> Consumer Preference Strongest
> Breed Association

> Your "niche market" beef
> exotics have all been the fad at
> one time or another, but only one
> breed has stood the test of time
> and that breed is Angus. I know
> i've had Limo's and Charlois, and
> Salers, theres only one breed i've
> come back to and thats Angus. You
> hobby farmers can your three head
> of Murray Grey's or Limo Simmi
> giant cows or your Longhorns but
> the Cattle Business Beef Breed is
> and always will be Angus.
 
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A

Anonymous

The whole discussion reminds me of the old saw "Nobody wins an argument with a fool" and "Never argue with an idiot, bystanders can't tell the difference"

dun

> As long as your definition of
> consistancy and quality is based
> on the hair color of the animal
> then the purebred advocates are
> correct, using a composite or
> crossbred bull will not give you
> the consistancy you are looking
> for. So cattle breeding becomes
> real easy and real simple, just
> breed black cattle to black cattle
> and you have it made, can't go
> wrong can you?
 
OP
A

Anonymous

> The whole discussion reminds me of
> the old saw "Nobody wins an
> argument with a fool" and
> "Never argue with an idiot,
> bystanders can't tell the
> difference"

AMEN, AMEN AND AMEN AGAIN!!!
 
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A

Anonymous

say whatever you say but I have more Registered and commercial heads than you and I can prove it, so just stop insulting small farmers.

> hobby farmers can your three head
> of Murray Grey's or Limo Simmi
> giant cows or your Longhorns but
> the Cattle Business Beef Breed is
> and always will be Angus.



[email protected]
 
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A

Anonymous

> AMEN, AMEN AND AMEN AGAIN!!!

Hey Arnold! Loved you on TV as a kid. I am going to like getting into the cattle hobby if I can associate with characters like these. I guess that it really is what you like and what make you happy.

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OP
A

Anonymous

> Just a few "Negatives"

> Deepest genetic base Moderate
> Frame Great Carcass Traits Black
> Hide Polled Better Disposition
> than any Exotic Industry and
> Consumer Preference Strongest
> Breed Association

> Your "niche market" beef
> exotics have all been the fad at
> one time or another, but only one
> breed has stood the test of time
> and that breed is Angus. I know
> i've had Limo's and Charlois, and
> Salers, theres only one breed i've
> come back to and thats Angus. You
> hobby farmers can your three head
> of Murray Grey's or Limo Simmi
> giant cows or your Longhorns but
> the Cattle Business Beef Breed is
> and always will be Angus.

seems kind of funny to me,.. i was at the sale barn just the other day and it seemed that black cattle prices were falling, and white charolais cross prices were high,.. get off your high horse, angus isn't all its cracked up to be, ... SMALL CATTLE>>>> WHERE'S THE BEEF?? ....



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Anonymous

what are your weaning weights? I'm weaning 650lb calves with no creep, that's where the beef is along with marbling. Small cattle? My cows probably average 1200 lbs. 650lb calf is over 50% of my cows body weight so i guess i'm doing something right. You can put all the $100 a ton hay you want down your mammoth cows but in the end I'll turn more profit. Your a joke.

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A

Anonymous

OK you wanna play that way... explain 750lb weaning weight NO creep... 2,000 lb cows ... ... is it just me or have some of the angus folks on this page become pompous idiots who open their mouth long before they think?? im not knockin the angus breed, .. but give me a break... all breeds have one good trait or another,.. whats up with these folks who say they raise angus... they act as if all other breeds are trash??? ... yall,.. its seriously time to grow up and see everyone elses point of view ...

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