Commercial bulls

[charangusman08]

Curious, how many of you would buy a commercial bull, any breed? Explain your answer! Thanks.

 

[Frankie]

"commercial bull." Does that mean unregistered?

 

[charangusman08]

"commercial bull." Does that mean unregistered?

Yes it does, sorry about that.

 

[novatech]

I would only buy from an individual that was in the business of raising breeding stock. The reason is that people in the seed stock business usually have a lot more consistency. They will have more bull calves that will make bulls. It has been stated on these board in the past that only 1 out of 10 calves qualifies to be a breeding bull. The odds will get a lot worse buying from an individual not in the business, as you are buying phenotype only having no clue what the bull will produce. If a producer has records to back up the traits of the progeny you are money ahead.
In my opinion you are still better off with a registered bull with a pedigree and EPD's. That is unless you have not taken the time to learn how to use them or research them. Most registered seed stock producers that I know spend more time fine tuning their bulls by culling rather than trying to decide which ones to keep. In other words there are more keeper's than culls.
This tells me they will have good consistancy.

 

[EAT BEEF]

Yes I would buy an unregistered bull but I would have to know the program he came from.right or wrong I would also expect to pay less for him.I've breed a few that I have used or sold (Simm-Angus). Your biggest shot of hybrid vigor will come from your first cross thats why the chars work good as a terminal bull and some of the heifers from the char-angus cross may make good cows,but I don't see much reason to use a char-angus bull. What would you breed them to and what would you get that you couldn't get some other way?

 

[angus9259]

Registered or not is not the issue, it's whether the breeder has paid attention to the genetics to offer a consistent product so you know what you'll be getting. My best looking bull calf this year was from a simi angus cross with a registered angus bull. I cut him. He's a great looking calf, but I simply don't know what he'll do as a breeder. His momma's line were always late into puberty, and hard calvers but they raised some great terminal steers. Will he produce heifers that mature late? Will he be a hard calver? I don't know so I cut him because YOU, my customer, would want to know that information . . . I think . . . 'course, some folks see a great set of nuts hanging off a 1500 lbs of yearling muscle and would probably buy him up so what do I know

 

[charangusman08]

I think . . . 'course, some folks see a great set of nuts hanging off a 1500 lbs of yearling muscle and would probably buy him up so what do I know

That is a huge yearling bull

 

[angus9259]

Yeah, most of my yearlings have an AYW of about 1200-1300 lbs. But "yearling" bull is a tricky word because many bulls don't sell till they are 15 months which puts them up even higher and he's going to be heavy just from the muscle he's already carrying.

 

[HOSS]

My neighbor buys unregistered yearling bulls at the sale barn. He is an old codger thats been around and he picks some decent looking bulls. He runs only large framed cows and no heifers so he does not have calving issues. It is still too much of a crap shoot for me. I'll stick with registered bulls with epd's.

 

[ALACOWMAN]

Registered or not is not the issue, it's whether the breeder has paid attention to the genetics to offer a consistent product so you know what you'll be getting. My best looking bull calf this year was from a simi angus cross with a registered angus bull. I cut him. He's a great looking calf, but I simply don't know what he'll do as a breeder. His momma's line were always late into puberty, and hard calvers but they raised some great terminal steers. Will he produce heifers that mature late? Will he be a hard calver? I don't know so I cut him because YOU, my customer, would want to know that information . . . I think . . . 'course, some folks see a great set of nuts hanging off a 1500 lbs of yearling muscle and would probably buy him up so what do I know

that's where they would let their emotions take over logic... they would probably be disapointed at calving time. :shock: what happened he had the nutts, butt and gut that i wanted.. but he did'nt pass it on.

 

[angus9259]

Registered or not is not the issue, it's whether the breeder has paid attention to the genetics to offer a consistent product so you know what you'll be getting. My best looking bull calf this year was from a simi angus cross with a registered angus bull. I cut him. He's a great looking calf, but I simply don't know what he'll do as a breeder. His momma's line were always late into puberty, and hard calvers but they raised some great terminal steers. Will he produce heifers that mature late? Will he be a hard calver? I don't know so I cut him because YOU, my customer, would want to know that information . . . I think . . . 'course, some folks see a great set of nuts hanging off a 1500 lbs of yearling muscle and would probably buy him up so what do I know

that's where they would let their emotions take over logic... they would probably be disapointed at calving time. :shock: what happened he had the nutts, butt and gut that i wanted.. but he did'nt pass it on.

Yup. And then when he didn't pass it on, you'd not buy another bull from me and you'd tell your neighbor not to buy another bull from me and rightfully so. My farm's motto is "bulls I'd use on my own cows" and I said to my wife . . . he's a great looking calf, but I wouldn't use him here as a bull. When in doubt, cut em out.