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calf layed down and will

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ficikc

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Calf layed down and willnot get back up
Calf is sitting uprigt not laying on it's side
Calf is about 4 month old and has been down for about 2 weeks
Eating everything we give her
Pooping OK
Trying to get up but hind leg not cooperating front legs seem OK
Seems happy
 

rockridgecattle

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Going to need more info than this if you are looking for help
Advice # 1

Call the vet as see what the vet says

As for the forum
What are the symptoms?
Poopy?
Temp?
Laboured breathing?
Adequate colostrum?
Are the cows vaccinated? Are the bulls?
Is the mother looking after the calf?
Does the mother have enough milk?
How old is the calf?
How heavy is the calf?
A brief herd history is needed too.
 

angie1

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ficikc":1htaaf94 said:
Calf layed down and willnot get back up
If you figure out what it is, let me know.
I think I have the same disease.
 

HerefordSire

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I do not intend to hurt anyone's feelings. I don't understand why there are so many "call the vet" comments on these boards. Doesn't the vet cost more than the calf? Isn't that the same thing as sacrificing your profit up at the front end instead of the back end? I realize there are other variables.... like how many times does a downed animal get up to survive, and so forth. Maybe the comments are related because the posters have only one calf and not several hundred? Please make some sense out of "call the vet".
 

randiliana

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HerefordSire":1svwxy6u said:
I do not intend to hurt anyone's feelings. I don't understand why there are so many "call the vet" comments on these boards. Doesn't the vet cost more than the calf? Isn't that the same thing as sacrificing your profit up at the front end instead of the back end? I realize there are other variables.... like how many times does a downed animal get up to survive, and so forth. Maybe the comments are related because the posters have only one calf and not several hundred? Please make some sense out of "call the vet".

Well, I don't know how how anyone here is supposed to diagnose a problem with an animal with what most people post for symptoms. 1 animal or 1000 they all deserve proper care, and that means that if you don't know what is going on, you need to call on someone with more experience and training than what you have, and usually, that means a VET. Everyone on this board has different amounts of knowledge, and different levels of experience. The same symptoms (as described by the poster) may indicate different things to different people. How many different experiments should a person put an animal through on heresay knowledge?

If it costs more to phone the vet and TALK to him or have him come out and LOOK at an animal than what it is worth, then perhaps the animal should be put down right now. We call on our vet anytime we have something wrong with an animal that we do not understand. Sometimes he comes to look, sometimes our description of the symptoms is enough for him to make a diagnosis. After the diagnosis is made, then the decision on whether to treat or euthanise can be made!!

Fact of the matter is that downer cattle do not usually get back up. If they are down it is a serious problem, having someone who knows what they are looking at (VET) come out and look and possibly diagnose the problem may be cheaper in the long run than trying cure after cure, feeding the animal for several weeks and then euthanising anyway.
 

HerefordSire

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It is easy....we do the best we can with the knowledge we have with the financial resources we have. Ranchers are dropping out like flies because of financial reasons. Any item that increases overhead and doesn't provide a return must be eliminated. Being humane to all living animals is one thing. Losing your farm is another.
 

hillsdown

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I don't understand why there are so many "call the vet" comments on these boards. Doesn't the vet cost more than the calf? Isn't that the same thing as sacrificing your profit up at the front end instead of the back end
?

TOO MANY PEOPLE HAVE LIVESTOCK THAT SHOULD NOT HAVE LIVESTOCK BECAUSE THEY DO NOT HAVE A FRICKEN CLUE AS TO WHAT THEY ARE DOING AND INSTEAD OF CALLING A PROFESSIONAL IE. VET, POST ON A FRICKEN BOARD EXPECTING ANSWERS... we do the best we can with the information given BUT that is all we can do. If you are not willing to do all you can then get the [email protected] out of the business..

Herefordsire I have yet to see you give anyone here any helpful info on treating an animal ,,,,,,,,, so button it....
 

dun

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HerefordSire":33vginvn said:
It is easy....we do the best we can with the knowledge we have

Not everyone is born with the inate knowledge to be able to treat animal problems. They need to learn someway and the best way is from a competent vet.
 

ga. prime

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ficikc":kpztdcwk said:
Calf layed down and willnot get back up
Trying to get up but hind leg not cooperating front legs seem OK
Seems happy
Could be a neurological problemo. Or something else. You may soon learn what Mexican Buzzards are.
 

regolith

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Sounds to me like it might be a break or dislocate - in which case it does need a vet to diagnose unless the injury is obvious, and it's probably the end of the road for this calf.

If they are down it is a serious problem, having someone who knows what they are looking at (VET) come out and look and possibly diagnose the problem may be cheaper in the long run than trying cure after cure, feeding the animal for several weeks and then euthanising anyway.

I've found that with experienced cattlemen, if they don't know what's wrong with an animal chances are the vet won't either. It's a different situation with a novice to cattle - and there have been also lots of times when I've been glad I got the vet out for a correct diagnosis (like the first time I saw Johne's, after over a decade working with cattle). But I've also seen a lot of misdiagnoses that essentially waste the farmer's time and money and the animal either gets better on its own or dies.

I reckon it takes a couple of decades for a large animal vet to become competent. One of the best vets I worked with was a new graduate, who like all new uns used book-learning to come to a diagnosis and treatment - but she took the time to fully examine every animal and consider the possibilities. And she'd be the only new graduate I was pleased to see on my farm. It's the ones who think they've already seen everything after an education and five years in practise you have to watch out for.

Hah - quoting from the last vet I had on farm who was getting the interrogation about acidosis/bloat/current conditions...
"We get a lot of farmers phone up and tell us the cow has frothy bloat. But then we give them magnesium and they get up and walk away."
On the other hand, I got two different answers from two different (experienced) vets about what might have killed my cow and still don't know...
 

HerefordSire

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dun":272j4dg5 said:
HerefordSire":272j4dg5 said:
It is easy....we do the best we can with the knowledge we have

Not everyone is born with the inate knowledge to be able to treat animal problems. They need to learn someway and the best way is from a competent vet.

I agree dun. I am one of those. I paid the vet bills until I figured out a pattern. I figured out the vet was making more money than I was and was only involved for one hour but I was involved for the entire year. I just don't understand how someone can recommend to someone else to lose money intentionally. Maybe they are communicating via PM in between posts to find out the novice has allot of money? If there was normallly a nice profit pad, it would be a little different to sacrifice half of the profit. With margins so slim, calling a vet could be a matter of losing $50 per head or losing $100 per head, or more, if the vet is/was successful. I like vets. I think they provide a great service to non-medical ignorant people like me. However, I would rather eat than not eat and live on my farm rather than the local homeless shelter, if I could find one with a bed open.
 

dun

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HerefordSire":39qgbq43 said:
dun":39qgbq43 said:
HerefordSire":39qgbq43 said:
It is easy....we do the best we can with the knowledge we have

Not everyone is born with the inate knowledge to be able to treat animal problems. They need to learn someway and the best way is from a competent vet.

I agree dun. I am one of those. I paid the vet bills until I figured out a pattern. I figured out the vet was making more money than I was and was only involved for one hour but I was involved for the entire year. I just don't understand how someone can recommend to someone else to lose money intentionally. Maybe they are communicating via PM in between posts to find out the novice has allot of money? If there was normallly a nice profit pad, it would be a little different to sacrifice half of the profit. With margins so slim, calling a vet could be a matter of losing $50 per head or losing $100 per head, or more, if the vet is/was successful. I like vets. I think they provide a great service to non-medical ignorant people like me. However, I would rather eat than not eat and live on my farm rather than the local homeless shelter, if I could find one with a bed open.

The vast majority of the inexperienced people aren;t going to put an animal down when it should be. Without the vet there are 4 possible outcomes. It will get better on it's own, they'll get lucky and one of the shotgun approaches will work, they'll finally shoot it or it will suffer and die. My preference is for either #3 or the vet.
Like anything else, it's costs money to get an education, but there is no reason for an animal to suffer while you're doing your schooling.
 

HerefordSire

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hillsdown":3eyjambw said:
I don't understand why there are so many "call the vet" comments on these boards. Doesn't the vet cost more than the calf? Isn't that the same thing as sacrificing your profit up at the front end instead of the back end
?

TOO MANY PEOPLE HAVE LIVESTOCK THAT SHOULD NOT HAVE LIVESTOCK BECAUSE THEY DO NOT HAVE A FRICKEN CLUE AS TO WHAT THEY ARE DOING AND INSTEAD OF CALLING A PROFESSIONAL IE. VET, POST ON A FRICKEN BOARD EXPECTING ANSWERS... we do the best we can with the information given BUT that is all we can do. If you are not willing to do all you can then get the [email protected] out of the business..

Herefordsire I have yet to see you give anyone here any helpful info on treating an animal ,,,,,,,,, so button it....

I am not picking on you hillsdown. I have a genuine concern in today's economy. I just do not understand how people can afford a vet. Where does the money come from? Do you borrow the money to pay the vet? Please explain politely how one can recommend a vet bill and make a profit?
 

rusty

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HerefordSire,
I understand what you are saying but if you can't afford a vet can you really afford cattle?I agree that if you called a vet every time any thing went wrong you may as well get out now.Do you go to the doctor if ''you lay down and will not get back up'' ?If you have a cow calf or whatever down with no idea of what to do call a vet .
 

HerefordSire

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dun":18799dcd said:
The vast majority of the inexperienced people aren;t going to put an animal down when it should be. Without the vet there are 4 possible outcomes. It will get better on it's own, they'll get lucky and one of the shotgun approaches will work, they'll finally shoot it or it will suffer and die. My preference is for either #3 or the vet.
Like anything else, it's costs money to get an education, but there is no reason for an animal to suffer while you're doing your schooling.

That is probably the best post than I am going to get dun. I appreciate your replies. I have been struggling with this for quite awhile now. If I understand you correctly, the reason to call a vet:

(A) Preventing an animal from suffering is more important than current financial cash flow and or profit position.

(B) Vets are many times used to put an animal out of misery and one can justify their expense and borrow the money to pay for their services.

Am I missing your point?
 

HerefordSire

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rusty":38rjuz82 said:
HerefordSire,
I understand what you are saying but if you can't afford a vet can you really afford cattle?I agree that if you called a vet every time any thing went wrong you may as well get out now.Do you go to the doctor if ''you lay down and will not get back up'' ?If you have a cow calf or whatever down with no idea of what to do call a vet .

Good question. Thanks for your reply. A couple of quesions if you don't mind, based upon the current state of the economy and cattle markets, and input prices, etc.:

(1) Can anyone with vet bills afford cattle?

(2) Can anyone without vet bills afford cattle?

If you answered yes to either of the two above questions, how do you do it? When you get a vet bill, where does the money come from?
 
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