Another Brahman question.

[Australian Cattleman]

Why can't more American juniors show their own prefixed animals? Its not much of an accolade to win with some one elses' cattle. Yes they may well have prepared them and paraded them and congratulations for that. Here in Australia very few juniors show cattle for anyone other than their family apart from schools which often have their own herds of registered cattle. some schools now prepare for breeders that don't have the time.
Another question,is there many schools in the US that have their own registered herds?

 

[ffamom]

Texas A&M has a Simmental show team.

As far as the youth go, sometimes the brand is more important in the ring than how nice the cattle look. I have seen several kids do well with their own bred and owned, but they are few and far between. It is really hard to a beat a nice V8 calf. Having said that, I must say, V8 has some terrific cattle on the show road. I would love to be able to afford a great one.

 

[TxCoUnTrYbOy]

I think its because the Jrs have no chance against the breeders. In America the Brahman shows are so political and crooked, kids just have no chance. When the breeders transfer ownership to the kids names to show at Jr shows, what kid that raised their own animal has a chance against a $30,000 animal?

A lot of times also it depends more on the brand than the animal. I raised my own animals, and unless I go to a small county show where the breeders dont go, I dont have a chance. It doesnt matter to me, I just enjoy going to the shows and being there, even if Im last place.

I know some colleges have their own herds, but Ive never heard of high schools having them for Jr shows.

 

[Australian Cattleman]

Good on you thats the true spirit of showing. Just to compete.
Colin

 

[la4angus]

I raised my own animals, and unless I go to a small county show where the breeders dont go, I dont have a chance.

TCB, I think that more than one of us remember when you bought both your bull and hfr to show. How can you truthfully say that you raised your own animals.

 

[TxCoUnTrYbOy]

I have raised them. From the time they were weaned nobody else has worked with them, just me. Yes, I did buy them. When I say most of the kids dont raise them, I mean they see the animal 3 times before they show it, and the breeders have them halter broke and ready for show. They just have a kid come and show it for them.

I guess I didnt say it the best way, but when I think about raising an animal, I think of raising it as the one who worked with it and put in the work to get to show.

They do sometimes have seperate Bred and Owned shows, which is what I think your talking about, when the kid owns the dam that they had bred to get the calf to show.

Sorry for the mistake.

 

[Bek]

All I can say is it's a lot simpler over here. everyone shows in the same show, not Open & Junior, although there is a few junior shows.

 

[Keren]

I was lucky in that I went to a high school that didn't have its own cattle stud. The school was donated steers at weaning time, but the real gem of it was that at shows the students got the opportunity to work with stud breeders. Not only do you get the chance to work with and learn from the best in the industry, but because everyone sees things differently you really keep an open mind. It allowed me to gain experience and contacts within five different breeds, and led to the job I have today.

 

[farmwife]

All I can say is it's a lot simpler over here. everyone shows in the same show, not Open & Junior, although there is a few junior shows.

Here's an example of juniors not able to compete. I just came back from the Arkansas State Fair yesterday. In the Jan-Feb 06 class, the 3 junior heifers that showed on Sat competed with the Open cattle yesterday. In a class of 7, the 3 junior heifers were last in the same order they placed in the junior show -- Open show competition is tough over here!!

 

[Bek]

I wouldn't say itd be tougher over there, it's just here everyone shows in the same show, and a lot of the time the juniors are put up over the adults, mainly because there's quite a few schools, and 8 out of 10 of them have quality animals.

 

[TheBullLady]

Some of the Brahman shows are beginning to feature a "bred and owned" group of classes. With any luck, these will begin to overshadow the regular classes, and the smaller breeders will have a chance to spotlight there good breeding cattle.

I hate Brahman people...

 

[4H&FFAmom]

What in the world happen to you to write the comment of hating Brahman people?

Actually, I feel just to opposite. I realize the Brahman shows are some of the most competitive shows I have ever seen. When most of the people come out of the show arena, they are still the best of friends. Especially, our youth---they are great examples of stiff competitors then friends in the stall areas.

I just got back from the National Show in Dallas, it was like "home week".

Oh, by the way, at our "National Show" (second largest open show in the US) a "junior" was Grand Champion Grey Cow, another junior was Reserve Champion Red Bull and I think he also had either Champion or Reserve Red Cow. When it came time for the Junior show, he chose not to show for several reasons--probably the most significant being he wanted others to have things go well for them. He has won a lot in the past and he wanted his friends to do well. He is an amazing humble young man---really does not think he will "always win", but he knows when it is time to rest. Young men and women like him make the breed great.

I realize there are those in this breed that are not the highest in character, but there are always bad apples in every basket. It is not as easy as you think--just to throw them out. The best idea is just to put these type people aside and let the good one come to the top.

Again, it makes me sad that you feel that way about "Brahman people"--because the majority are really great friends. I came home "refreshed" from seeing them and hearing how their life is going.

 

[ffamom]

Please read my statement again. No hate here. I just wish I could afford one.

 

[4H&FFAmom]

Sorry, ffamom. Did not mean you. I was writing this to TheBulllady (the post just prior to my first post).

There are Brahman breeders that will sell you a good animal at a reasonable rate. They may not be an overall Champion but they will be competitive. Call some of the smaller breeders that advertise in the Brahman Journal. I will even tell you, the larger breeders will also provide you with a variety of price ranges. Amazingly enough, these people do not put the pressure on to fell like you have got to buy the most expensive. They give you the assortment and let you decide what is within your budget.

The price range can be amazing. You are not likely to find a competitive one for less than $2,500. You can find some at $1,500 but they are not as likely to be competitive. I have found that $3,500-$5,000 is a range that good ones can be bought at. Some of the best will run $5,000-$10,000. If you have someone with a good eye, buy the youngest that you can that way you get two full years of junior showing (three years in the open shows). We have borrowed money from the bank to buy some of the better ones, but it has been worth it in helping with genetics for the future. If you buy a young heifer, it makes the amount you spend easier to divide over two years. If she is good you do not have to buy one the next year. What I have come to figure is that the amount of time my kids have spent with their animals has kept them out of trouble. This amount is typically less than what it would take getting them out of trouble---idle time makes for idle minds and behavior. Just my phylosophy.

In addition to buying the animal there is also the benefit of your junior belonging to one of the best junior organizations. At state and national shows they have other contests where the kids can shine to include public speaking, sales talk, quiz bowls, herdsman quizes, etc. The kids have lots of fun. If you have ever seen the awards that are given out at the major shows in Texas from a group called the Brahma Mamas--they are also great. Overall, the Brahman people are competitors but they are all devoted to the youth.

 

[brahman breeder]

To Bull Lady--- you are a Brahman Breeder --- why would you hate brahman people?

 

[Australian Cattleman]

Just received my latest Brahman Journal. Some very nice cattle but also a few rough ones. It would be good to have some of Australia's top show winners against the US show winners. I have a strong feeling that the Australian cattle would win out because most of them are bred to work and survive out in the paddock and not locked up in lush paddocks or stalled undercover or fed from day one.
For example back page Kick off classic reserve intermediate champion,not a good bull as far as I can see.His opponents must have been shockers.Don't see as often senior champion females with calves at foot (or side) as we do here in Australia. I wouldn't be game to show an older senior female without a calf. The calf shows how good your cow is.

 

[brahman breeder]

Where do you think the genetics come from for your australian brahman cattle if not from the US herds? we would welcome you to bring some to our international show and lets see how they stack up!

 

[TxCoUnTrYbOy]

brahman breeder, what is your ranch name? I may have seen you at shows before.

 

[Australian Cattleman]

brahman breeder you are correct,yes our bloodlines did emanate from the US. I do think though,Australians have blended the lines somewhat better into an animal that is more suited to perform off grass than bred for the show ring.

 

[TheBullLady]

Sorry for the offensive remark about Brahman people. Love the cattle, .. but we won't go into the rest. I started out showing Brahmans, and never met a more clannish, don't socialize with anyone except the other "big guys", don't want to help anyone group of people in my life. And more than happy to critisize the heck out of anything you have, and invite you to their place to purchase a "good" one. I promise you, there are very very good Brahmans at other people's ranches!

But.. enough of that. I could go on and on. When I "switched" to Simmentals, it was a totally different experience! Incredible people in the Simmental breed, and I get 100% more enjoyment out of everything related to showing, breeding, etc. And I KNOW there are "Big" breeders that would lend a hand or help a fellow breeder out in a moment.

I still have Brahmans.. great cattle, and a place in the industry. I just think the organization needs some serious changes.

But I'm so glad to hear you had a good time at the Nationals! I'm familiar with the folks you're talking about. Having a great time and meeting great people is the main purpose!